Strict nursery having negative effect on my ds

[ErinH]

I'm wondering whether I should take my ds out of his nursery school. He is due to start in reception of the same school in September and I'm worried the school is not right for him. He has always been shy and recently become extremely anxious about going to nursery. His anxiety has got worse over the last few months and he has stopped using the toilet at school (wee and poo) and holds it until he wets himself or I come in to reassure him and help him go. (he has spend the last year at this nursery with no problems). He has become selectively mute over the last few months and now doesn't talk to any adult (other than me) and no children (other than his brother). He has more recently completely withdrawn from playing with the other children at nursery. He says he doesn't want to go to school and is very subdued when he gets there. I don't know what the trigger is but he does talk a lot about how they discipline the children at school (he was humiliated by being made to sit alone on another table during lunchtime for being silly - a last resort, according to his teacher). They have strict rules about running, playing, shouting and manners (they have to wait until all the snacks have been dished out at breaktime before they are told "now you may start". My ds always follows these rules (unless his little 4yr old brain forgets, then he's reminded and gets quite upset by it). The other children tuck into their food before its all been dished out and don't get told off which really upsets ds as he sits patiently waiting. He hates this and says it's boring to have to wait, but he does it. Others don't.) He doesn't seem to be blossoming here, instead he seems down about the tellings off and injustice and is not getting anything out of it. I had a meeting this morning with his teacher who became rather defensive about the school. "I can assure you we're extremely compassionate to the children...it's always a last resort to do this" etc. I just don't know whether his over-sensitive nature suits a strict school like this. Any thoughts?

oh good I'm so glad he enjoyed the pre-school and that I have been able to help...it's only now that DD is in a good and kind school that I am understanding how much the prep affected her...the only thing I think you need to be aware of is that it could take longer than year 1 to get a place....because it's in-year...even if you're in the catchment, you'll need to be high on the waiting lst and for a child to leave...which tbh does happen..people move, etc.

It could take longer...if your younger DS begins in 2013 then that might get the older DS right to enter if siblings hold sway...but not always.

Speak to the school about it all as they'll be able to advise more...are you well in catchment? Is it a popular school with a waiting list?

I am glad you found a solution. I think the most important thing with the under 6/7s is that they enjoy learning and school, gain social skills and confidence - everything else will follow.

Too strict discipline and too much emphasis on academic achievement at that age may backfire and put them off school before they even started.

So I think you are doing the right thing.

Just a quick update. We applied and appealed for a place for DS at our local oversubscribed primary school and have been stressing about what to do if he didn't get a place. We had a phone call on Tuesday to say that they have made a place for him in Reception in Sept. We couldn't be happier.
DS is in the playgroup next door and loving it. He's now eating in front of others and last week even said a few words to the supervisor and to another child. He's having some CBT or play therapy over the summer to help him with his anxiety issues.
I can't tell you how much happier he is since we removed him from the independent nursery school where he developed these terrible issues. He's a different child. He's much more relaxed (and less anxious) much happier (laughs and jokes with his dad - even said a few words last week to him).
The primary school said they'd work with DS so if he wants to stay at the playgroup for more of the week and start 3 mornings at primary school in September then they'll support this. They really believe that whatever is right for him...
The playgroup team have been amazingly proactive. Instigating games to play with him that build the bond, relax him and get him playing and talking. They've done their research and come to me to suggest the day's 'plan of attack'. I've been able to leave him for up to 2 hours without worrying that he'll panic and as long as he doesn't need the loo, then he's very happy.
It's a small-steps kind of life at the moment, but he's making great progress. I'll keep you posted for all those with children with anxiety issues, selective mutism, social phobias etc and new environments. You just need to get the school right!

The regime at the nursery sounds as though it is damaging your child's emotional health and well being. Preschool should be a happy place with lots of fun as well as learning how to socialise. I wouldn't use any place that humiliates children. Take him away and find some where he can relax and have fun. Please don't force him to go back. You are paying for this to happen to him.

Lovely to hear your update Erin. It's amazing what good, sensitive teachers can do - and by contrast what can happen when it's not right. So pleased things are looking up for you.

I've only read the OP so apologies if this has been suggested already but my gut feeling when I read your OP was "get him out quick".

The nursery doesn't sound brilliant if I'm honest and sounds like its impacting negatively on your son.

I am a Reception teacher and if a child like your DS came to me from a nursery as you describe, I would be seriously concerned about their practice.

Is there another school he could go to?

What a lovely outcome. How horrible though that he was made so unhappy by his previous nursery. I am very glad that he is a lot better now, it sounds like a great result all round. You sound like a lovely mother.

DS started school part-time last Thursday so this will be his fourth morning at primary school. It really has been the start that I could only have dreamed of six months ago. He is so happy at the school (he's grown a foot in confidence since starting) that he talks to his teacher and to the other children. He even spoke to a stranger the other day who was in school on supply for the day! I have to say that apart from the minor anxiety issues of PE and toileting which is still a bit of a problem, that he has made the most amazing progress and the best start to school. I think he's finally found what he was looking for! It's been a long, hard nine months since my little boy was so withdrawn and unhappy that he didn't even have eye-contact with me to now talking and playing with everyone. For those out there who are experiencing selective mutism and social anxiety issues with young children and are currently at rock bottom, I can assure you that with small-steps, CBT and the right environment that things will get better. Thank God, I finally have my little boy back!

So these are the facts I'm hearing:
-- school has strict rules. However they don't seem to apply to all children equally - your DS gets told off others don't
-- they punish children by himiliating them in from of their peers (bear in mind this is 4 year olds)
-- instead of showing concern and listening to you his teacher gets defensive and instead of talking through your concerns he gives you a standard 'reassuring' response.

-- your DS does not want to go there
-- his shyness is getting worse and he is withdrawing
-- he stopped using the toilet
-- he is not happy there

From what I see this school is not doing anything good for your child. I don't understand why they punish him and not others. Is he being singled out because he is shy? That's very wrong.
My worry would be that instead of helping your DS to gain confidence they are doing exactly the opposite. If he is shy by nature then one single act of humiliation can have a huge effect and make him fear to be put through that again. I wonder if he was ever 'punished' for having an accident there and as a result refuses to engage in toilet activity at all as a way to prevent the humiliation?

I would take him out of there. Thb he sounds like he's getting depressed. I think shy children need extra attention and encouragement not punishment and humiliation. This school obviously cannot provide what he needs - a nurturing environmet.

And I wonder what did he do to deserve the humiliating punishment? What do they mean by saying 'for being silly'? surely there are ways to discipline children without humiliating them?.. I'm a bit speechless tbh as it all sounds a bit victorian... rules about running and shouting - are 4 year olds not supposed to run around anymore?..

Oh, I just read your updates, so glad for you both!
The new place sound really fab, I am sure his issues will slowly be resolved.

Erin thank you for the update - that was a heartbreaking start to a thread and such a happy ending. Very happy for your DS and your family.