Support thread for 'late' potty-trainers and/or gentle/slow training?

[badchat]

DD has just turned 3. We've had a potty for a year. I've been reading potty books, talking about using potty/toilet etc. for months and months, and watching and waiting for signs of readiness. So far nothing. She shows no awareness of doing a wee or a poo, or of needing to. She has been uninterested in, or hostile to, the potty and knickers up until recently, and she doesn't seem to mind having a dirty nappy at all. Also, up until quite recently she would sometimes wake with a poo in her nappy.

She is meant to be starting at a nursery/pre-school in mid-September, which will require her to wear knickers, although if she is not potty trained they say they will work with me to try and help.

So, for the past few weeks I've been getting her used to sitting on the potty, e.g. regular reading on the potty after breakfast. For the past week stepped it up to wearing knickers or nothing for a few hours a day as well (she asks for nappies quite quickly and I encourage her to stay with knickers but if she gets upset I don't want a power struggle over it so I go back to nappies).

So far, nothing in the potty, just a few wees on the floor. She says she doesn't know when she is about to go.

I am trying to stay positive - we have moved on at least from refusing potty/knickers to giving them a go. But I am finding it really difficult - I am worried about her going to nursery and having a horrible time being worried about it, or being teased. My sister is very disapproving and seems to think that it is my fault she isn't potty trained yet. I have mentioned it to a few friends and they have responded with slight shock, and e.g. "oh, x was dry before she was 2"... I don't know a single other person in RL who is struggling or has struggled with potty training - everyone seems to tell me that their kid wanted to train, or responded quickly to adult-led training.

Anyway, sorry this is so epic. Just hoping some of you out there are in same kind of position and will come and huddle here for support!

[Bossybootsmum]

Hi, can I join in please?

I have a DD who was three last month. She has started doing some weeks and poos on the toilet, on one of those toddler seat thingies. I haven't worried too much about it until recently, as she seemed to know when she HAD done something, but not that she was GOING to do something if you see what I mean.

The other day, she came home from nursery, and had been going on the toilet there all day. Was really pleased for her but felt weird that nursery had decided to potty train her. Now I can't decide if I was being really lax before ( we'd done some trying with the potty, but would get really upset because she just did not know she was going to do a wee until too late ) or whether I was right to follow my instincts, because she suddenly seems to have clicked.

What do people think?

[threepiecesuite]

My DD is 3.8yo.
We have persevered with potty training now for 15 months. She has had a few small phases of being dry for a couple of weeks - apart from that, she has at least 3 wet accidents per day. No pattern, rhyme or reason to it. We have tried everything, including:
choosing pretty knickers
rewards
bribery
ignoring it and not getting angry
massive praise
bringing potty downstairs
putting her on every half an hour
no drinks after 6pm

The only thing she can tell me is that she 'doesn't know when a wee is coming'. I really need some help with this, our relationship is breaking down. I am shouting at her all the time. Do we still have access to Health Visitor services at this age, I don't know who else to contact.

[tinypumpkin]

I don't have any advice as I am also struggling and DD2 is 4 in Oct. Have tried all you have done too. We definitely do have access to HVs, mine came out and was quite useful to be honest. More so than the GP who just said go for it (that makes it worse for my DD and she digs her heels in even more!)

[http://www.eric.org.uk/ ERIC]] is also helpful. I rang them and they gave me some good advice too. Not sorted yet but definitely support out there.

It's so hard isn't it, I feel so judged as a parent for not 'having bothered' to potty train my child. Would love them to have a go! Good luck :)

Fishandjam, yay for your DS. Hope you can keep the not to worry line sounding genuine :)

Bossybootsmum, that sounds like your DD is making good progress if I have understood correctly. Hope it continues, Everyone has an opinion on potty training (and parenting generally!) so I would not worry too much if your DD is doing so well. I hope we follow your footsteps.

[tinypumpkin]

Sorry, thought I had sorted the link. I should have previewed.

Here it is. ERIC

[threepiecesuite]

Thank you for the link tinypumpkin- I've sat and had a really good read. I know it's not an easy problem to solve and we may have a long road ahead, but it's good to know some people are in the same boat.
I've felt very down about it - esp when my DDs peer group all seemed to potty train practically overnight and we are still dealing with at least 3 wet accidents on a daily basis.
DD has just gone to bed. She said to me 'I want you to get me some nappies because I don't like all the shouting'. I came downstairs and had a little cry.

[Bossybootsmum]

Thanks Tiny.

She has done all wees at nursery on toilet today, then came home and weed in her pull up pants! Think its the peer pressure of all her friends going to the toilet that's doing it. Ah well, I suppose they all get there in the end. There's not many kids that take their GCSEs in pull ups :-)

[tinypumpkin]

Oh threepiecesuite, I am sorry that you are feeling so rubbish about it. It's so hard not to take it personally isn't it. It feels like a slight on your parenting. My DD's peer group have done the same and I just can't get her to do it. I also don't know what else to do. Perhaps a chat with your HV might help. I did call ERIC and found them useful. Just good to know that you are not alone sometimes.

Can you just try and relax for the rest of the evening, tomorrow is another day. As you say, a long road ahead but one step at a time. That's what I am trying to tell myself anyway. You are not alone I promise. I felt better just finding this thread tbh.

[Fishandjam]

three, I really feel for you. It may sound like a regressive step, but could you put her in nappies/pullups for a few weeks, and sit back? Cos if you've been trying for 15 months, it seems like she really isn't ready (I know, I know, that's what everyone says!) And I bet you're all fed up with the stress...

[Fishandjam]

DS is still having poo accidents...

[stillenacht]

My DS is v late to train. He is 10 and still in nappies (he does have autism though). My aim is to get it done before 12, dreading puberty with nappies! I guess I should really discuss this on a SN thread but ah bugger it. Good luck to one and all!I am heartily sick of nappies!!!!

[tinypumpkin]

We are in nappies here still if that makes you feel any better three.

Sorry to hear that your DS is still having poo accidents fishandjam.

[tinypumpkin]

Missed your reply Bossy. That sounds good about nursery, perhaps you are right about peer pressure. Ironically has no effect on my DD but sounds great if it works for yours :)

Good point about the GCSEs, I will keep remembering that!

[Fishandjam]

tiny, DD (aged 15 months) has had a hideous dose of the shits lately - really horrible, smelling of rotten eggs and squelching out of her nappy left and right - so it's one long festival of turds in our house Even the cats joined in; one of them pinched one off on the bathroom floor sometime last night, little bastard.

[tinypumpkin]

Oh Fish, that sounds horrendous. Bloody grim indeed. Hoping the turd fest stops asap.

[BranchingOut]

Coming back to the thread to report some minor steps forward with my DS, 4.0.

We did several things all at once, in a potty-focused day towards the end of last week!

He and I moved all his changing gear from his bedroom to the bathroom, just to change the dynamic a little bit and move it closer to the toilet. This involved lots of cleaning things with soapy water, hoovering and he thought it was all good fun. We couldn't have done this where we were living before as the bathroom was too small.

Established a sticker book that he can only use on the potty. I also have a whole reward system that I am keeping in reserve, as the sticker book is being quite succesful at the moment, see below.

Had a callback from the HV, who said that we were basically doing everything right, but just needed to 'wait for it to click'. Her main recommendation was to try to move to changing standing up after poos.

Introduced the idea of wiping, as I thought that I might as well allow him a year or so to get used to the idea!

Bought a load of new pants, which he has been eagerly awaiting.

What has happened:

Still resistance to getting cleaned up after poos standing up, but I am going to work towards it by first of all just taking his trousers down standing up, then progressing to pants.

Potty sticker book has been very succesful - he loves using it and we have got several wees out of it - he then also awards himself a sticker from the book!

He has voluntarily done some wiping, front and back, after a wee.

He actually did a wee standing up into the potty yesterday, which he has never done before and might make it so much easier when we are out and about.

Still no progress on the poo front, but I am hopeful that we are making some progress in other areas.

Keen to hear others' posts and views. I really am happy to have this thread to not feel so unusual in a world of professional toilet-going toddlers!

[tinypumpkin]

Branching, that is utterly fab. Go your DS

It's really encouraging to hear your progress. Thanks for sharing.

[mrsfrumble]

Can I join in too please?

My boy is 2.10 and it's been about 4 months since his first successful wee in the potty. Things are progressing at a snail's pace partly because he's the most strong-willed child on the planet, and partly because I have no idea what I'm doing.

He's completely reliable for wees at home, but absolutely on his own terms. He will take himself off to the loo and flush by himself, but he will not wear pants. He will not go if I prompt him, which makes the "one last wee before we leave home" impossible. Out and about is tricky; he has only once submitted to using a public toilet. Otherwise he screams and slides off the seat when I take him, even if he's told me needs to go beforehand. So we're in a limbo of bare-bottomed at home, training pants for short journeys (which are always wet by the time we get home) and pull-ups if we're going to be out for longer than an hour or so.

He will only poo in a pull-up, but I'm not concerned about that yet, I just want to get wees sorted. I feel under pressure because no one in my family or DH's family has ever trained so late before.

I'm considering a sticker / reward chart for wearing pants, hand washing and using public toilets. What do you think?

[BranchingOut]

I think a reward can only help! I think just focusing on one thing for now, wearing pants, would be best.

Maybe give up on the public loos for now and just take a potty with you if needed, rather than wearing pull ups.

[BranchingOut]

Update: yesterday he said that he wanted to put the potties away as 'they are a little bit small for me'. So far so good, he is using the little loo seat!

A bonus is that I have finally found a seat to fit a square loo - tippitoes seat.

Still no progress on the poo!

Anyone else have any updates to share? Even if it is just to say that things are still the same...;)

[tinypumpkin]

Still the same sadly here but we are in the don't talk about it month at the moment.

Yay for finding a seat that fits and for putting the potties away. Love the reason :)

[thedicewoman]

Hi, can I join please?

my DD 3.2 has been training since easter, so 7 months (god, is it really that long...). She has occasional days when she is dry, but more often than not she has umpteen changes of pants every day. this is mainly due to her doing little bits of wee in her pants before finally going to the toilet, it's like she's just relieving the pressure a bit. I am finding it so frustrating and all consuming because I KNOW she can do it (because she has previously!). I was actually so relieved to read your message threepiecesuite, as this is exactly like us and we too have tried everything, from rewards to threats and everything in between; it really is a bit comforting to know you're not the only one!

As for poos, she had been doing really well with these, but has started doing them in her pants, it's like she can't get to the toilet quick enough sometimes, although her poo is solid so there isn't an issue there. she tells me that she "didn't notice" that she needed, but I also see her holding her bottom and she has told me more than once that she just "pushed the poo back in" (?!). Also, she sometimes says I need a poo or I need a wee, then goes to the toilet and the opposite thing appears and she seems quite surprised.

Another thing that she routinely does is tell me she doesn't need, even when I can see that she is a bit wet and she is sticking her bottom out to try to stop herself going, I just don't understand it!!? why won't she just go?

So I guess in summary, she definitely knows what to do, knows that she needs as she will go of her own accord sometimes, though more often she is taken/made to go. I'm not sure what to try next, though I will have a good look at the ERIC pages...

[BranchingOut]

Welcome aboard! The more the, er, soggier!

On this thread we have no use for phrases like:

'Ooh, I can't remember, she just trained herself'

'One day she woke up and said she didn't want to wear nappies and never wet herself ever again'.

'Surely he is trained now, he is nearly 3/3.6/4/5...?'

[thedicewoman]

Sorry that was so epic!! It's been a long haul....

[threepiecesuite]

Hi thedicewoman and others.
I posted about my DD who is 3.8 last week, when I'd reached the point of desperation.
I tried 3 new things this week, not the most orthodox methods and you probably won't see this advice in books, but:

-told (and reminded a few times) DD Father Christmas could see her having lots of accidents while he was busy making toys

• warned her she might have to go to the doctors and 'have a tube put up her bottom' to find the problem

-went back to pull-ups at night and for a portion of the day, usually 5pm-bedtime when she's tired and most accidents were happening

And guess what? 5 dry days in a row (still wet at night in pull-up). Seriously, this has never ever happened before. So we are cautiously moving forward. And I have a little more patience with her.
Not counting my chickens just yet though!

thedicewoman your DD sounds like mine. She just won't go sometimes, even though she and I knows she needs to. I honestly think part of it is laziness. We only have one loo and its upstairs and I sometimes believe she just can't be bothered.

[thedicewoman]

That's excellent threepiecesuite, unorthodox as it may well be, I'm also at the stage of not caring how it's achieved so long as it is achieved! I've gone back to a reward sticker chart with rewards such as playing on iPad or computer for 5 stickers, we've had two days of only one accident each but I refuse to be even cautiously optimistic, we've been here before...

I definitely agree that a lot if the time it is laziness on my DDs part!