Election - how soon for VAT on school fees?

[Labtastic]

So I see we're likely to have an election in early July. Obviously that spells the end of the godawful tories which is great, but also hastens the incoming VAT on school fees which, for us, is bad. We are one of those families that no one believes exists who stretch ourselves with school fees, and are going to be very pushed for an extra 20%.

Question is - do we think Labour can make this happen in time for September? It'll be our DC's last year of fee paid education and was hoping the timeline for VAT coming in would be stretched out a bit...

Absolutely. I’ll happily pay VAT on fees if I get a credit for the £8k per year the taxpayer is not having to spend on my child using the state system. Other countries have a system where the state subsidises private schools (New Zealand and Finland for example).

Maybe so. But if a new party is to succeed then they have to show that they support funding state schools again. Because if you keep cutting funding for a service then clearly it will stop working.

People like me who had children at school in the 00s and children at school now, have seen the dramatic change in resources which were once available which now are not. Teachers will say the same thing.

This policy isn’t going to fund meaningful increased state school spending though. The optimistic IFS estimates around 1% of the state education budget will be raised by this policy - in reality it’ll be less than that because of some of the unrealistic assumptions made in their calculation. The Labour Party are being disingenuous to suggest to the electorate that this policy is going to fund increased state school spending.

Same here. I think a lot of people think we all live in million pound houses. Maybe in London but not in Manchester.

But how is that the fault of children in private schools?

I come from an estate in Manchester. Exdh has a small business and I have one. We are not ‘rich’ - the extra money we have at the end of the month goes on school fees.

Your logic is that if your kids can’t have a good education then yours shouldn’t ether. It’s spite.

And that’s what this whole policy is aimed at. Getting to the people who are so fucked off with the system they’d bring down thousands of other families with them - just for votes. Do not expect your kids to benefit from mine struggling

Ours is a family like yours. We've homeschooled until now but DD has a scholarship for private sixth form in September. For reasons I don't want to go into it's our only option. The extra on top is a big deal to us. We're a single income family. It's not punishing the rich who won't even notice it. It's punishing hard working parents who see private as their only solution for a variety of reasons - previous bullying, SEN, very poor local state schools etc.

I've voted Labour all my life but I'm afraid on this issue alone, I'm out. They won't get my vote.

Your logic is that if your kids can’t have a good education then yours shouldn’t ether. It’s spite.

Wrong, you’re talking bollocks. I was privately educated and so were / are some of my children on and off due to their SEN and unsuitability for big class sizes. One of them might again and I will be affected by this because although my DD’s dad will pay for it, he will stop paying me any child support if so.

I still support VAT on private schools. Because it is a luxury.

much as I support left leaning policies, I think this VAT will have the opposite of the desired effect.

atm a great number of families scrimp and save to send their children to private schools (I know some of them) and when these children are pulled out, they will go into the already severely over burdened state sector. the recruitment of 6000 new teachers will not be enough to assuage the detrimental effects. also where are they finding these new teachers? a magic lamp?

this policy will only worsen inequality as the super rich will not be affected, the majority of schools will simply become more exclusive and smaller less exclusive independent schools will just go out of business.

So you’re hoping the VAT will prove him out so you continue getting your CM?

By the way - the judge will not accept that if you took it to court

VAT isn’t a luxury tax.

Why ? Cos the money for bursaries should be used to keep fees down.

This isn't universally spread across all areas though.

And, let's face it, those using private schools are unlikely to be trying to get their children into your bottom of the league type.

Those in catchment areas for sought after schools may be impacted - ime, most local private school users live in areas with good catchment schools too. Means that there will be some state school pupils may lose out in places for September 2025 entry to primary and secondaries.

Wonder whether the use of facilities such as swimming pools, etc will be affected too. Locally one of the private schools offers use of their swimming and sports facilities to people who aren't at the school at reduced fees. I wonder if they will continue to do so, or if users will find the costs to use such facilities, including local state schools, rise a fair bit.

Your own ‘arguments’ on this thread have been pretty flimsy. To say the least.

I’m not hoping anything. My point is that I would like to live in a country where things are better for the majority rather than the few as is currently the case.

Anything I’ve written on the subject is entirely factual.

Of course those in favour of the policy have to ignore the facts otherwise their stance on the matter very quickly appears bigoted.

And where will those children who are in private SEND schools go?
That will definitely put extra pressure on some state schools and their budgets.

But no one really things about that type of private school, ime.

Wonder if private 'alternative' education providers would come under this banner? Or will there be a way to exempt them? This would cover not just SEND schools, but also 'not in education and training' providers, potentially.

The government picks up the tab for children in private SEN schools. Only children with an EHCP are able to get a place and it’s usually the LA’s responsibility to pay for this and that school is named in the EHCP.

I don’t think that will wash. People who support this policy want all parents to pay the VAT.

What I can't understand is why Labour want to punish the CHILDREN because they are the ones who'll be forced out if their schools and face huge changes .. not their "rich" parents. Find it very distasteful that one of their first acts is going to be to destabilise the lives of children

If it was announced that the government was going to make it impossible for YOUR child to attend a school where they were happy there would be outrage..

Still brace yourselves for house prices shooting up around certain schools which will become private in all but name ( amd fees!) and if your in a grammar area the competition is about to rocket. I know plenty if kids who passed 11 plus but went to independents

Luckily both of mine are in state

I think that poster is suggesting that the schools who have children on bursaries pay the extra VAT themselves and don’t pass it on to those parents.

How is it sustainable for them to have 30% of students on bursaries? Do they have lots of beneficiaries? There are few private schools in my area that offer bursaries for new starters. Prep schools, that is. Most of the senior schools offer bursaries for year 7.

VAT isn’t a luxury tax. The poster is correct. There are lots of examples where luxury items are not subject to VAT. I don’t think a decent education should be seen as a luxury anyway.

@longma you're right about pools. I know of at least 2 local schools that have weekly swimming lessons at an independent girls school

So, by your logic all children are entitled to private education because it isn’t a luxury? Or is it just children from rich families who are entitled to private education because the oiks who have to go to state schools are second class citizens?