Do MPs need more protection?

[OneMerryRedSnail]

If so what needs to be done?

Or do they take on the job knowing the risks?

https://news.sky.com/story/left-wing-anarchist-guilty-of-terror-offences-after-declaring-he-wanted-to-kill-mps-13072775

The former chair of the Conservative Muslim Forum disagrees with you.

https://twitter.com/implausibleblog/status/1762401214472262042?s=20

It’s increasing difficult for politicians on all sides to stay neutral. The British public overwhelmingly support an immediate ceasefire.

And there is a threat to MPs from the far right too. Which the OP seems determined to ignore.

I think people who hang around outside MPs homes should be arrested and charged. I agree that Sunak is part of the problem with his dithering and obfuscation.

@MrsBennetsPoorNerves Agree entirely but listening to the Nicky Campbell show this morning we have a very intolerant electorate - some of Anderson’s constituents phoned in. Awful people who back his views all the way - and more. We have a big problem - it’s going to get divisive and Trumpian.

Sunak is NOT Anderson. Or Jones or Ali! These people seek to represent the worst of constituents . It’s nothing to do with Sunak. People of the far right and far left are problematic. Sunak is not extreme. He alone cannot get rid of extreme views any more than Starmer can. Look how long he’s been trying. We just have awful people in this country.

Of course it’s to do with Sunak. He’s leader of the bloody party. He’s meant to be in charge.

The issue is, and it isn’t restricted to the Tory’s, or even to UK politics, governments thrive on creating division. The whole idea of you vote for us because them over there don’t care about you and won’t help you. In truth politicians care very little about the general public and mostly about themselves. Again, this isn’t a one party problem, I find politicians across the world to be very similar.

When politicians who are meant to be representative of the country insight racial hatred and their colleagues refuse to condemn them, of course maniacs thrive.
Right now we have a choice of a bunch of anti-semites or a crowd of islamophobics. Fantastic.

Agree with this. My own Tory MP is of a similar ilk, and I assume that there are constituents that agree with her.

I disagree with you though with regard to Sunak. He is the party leader and needs to show leadership. By refusing to call Anderson's behaviour racist or Islamophobic, he is failing to exercise effective leadership. He can't just shrug his shoulders and say "it's not me".

Skipping quickly past the fact that this person is clearly mentally ill, and that it is politically impossible to be both left wing and an anarchist...

Everyone should be safe at all times. Including MPs. What I find difficult to stomach is diverting more public resources to protect a bunch of people presiding over the destruction of the public services that the rest of us have to live with, some of whom (yes, looking at you Anderson) are very deliberately fuelling the fires. No, MPs should not be at risk due to their jobs, but why should they get more protection when I can't get a single officer to take a report of hate crime, or it takes five days to respond to burglary that they won't even bother to try to detect anyway?

Yes I agree Neriah

@MrsBennetsPoorNerves Well no he cannot entirely say “it’s not me” but Starmer is in the same boat. These parties are choosing unsuitable candidates to win over the local electorate because they know their feelings. This was maybe fairly benign politics 50 years ago but seems far more strategic and pandering to the masses now. Listen to the views expressed this morning. We need to hear them but we need to do something about it.

I’ve no doubt the parties try and select suitable candidates but local activists want who they want, left and right. A labour mp was sent to prison who represented Sheffield Hallam. Momentum is big in Sheffield. He suited them. Clearly not a suitable person to be an mp though. Are we saying that’s the leader’s fault or the fault of local selection who wanted one of their own? Tricky.

Starmer is in the same boat, but there is a difference in that Starmer has acknowledged that there is a problem and has made significant attempts to tackle it. I won't say that he has got every judgement right on this, because clearly he hasn't, but he is at least publicly committed to rooting it out.

Sunak has suspended Lee Anderson - quite rightly - but refuses to acknowledge that Anderson is part of a wider problem of islamophbia within the Tory Party, despite senior party members such as Baroness Warsi repeatedly saying that there is an issue. Why is he afraid of naming it?

@MrsBennetsPoorNerves Because of red wall politics. Labour can probably win back red wall seats. The local Cons want the “working class anti immigrant” vote so try and cling on. Why is Braverman still around? They might as well be Reform. If the right wing, Brexit, anti immigrant Tories left they might be able to buy old up a better Con party. As they are, no hope.

Labour might have issues in a few seats where there’s a Jewish population and antisemitic views are still seen to be an issue (eh North London) but it’s a small number of seats. The Cons have problems everywhere so act with caution about right ring candidates. We have a Truss supporting idiot here . I don’t agree any party not rooting out these people but they don’t for political reasons. And how long did it take Labour to start dealing with antisemitism? Decades!

Ahh - last sentence in first para was mangled!” They might be able to build up a better Con party “ that should have read.

Sorry, my "why" was largely rhetorical. I understand that it's political. But there comes a point when ethics should take precedence over politics - otherwise what's the point?

I'm not suggesting that the Labour Party is any less guilty of prioritising political expediency by the way.

I just despair of a political culture in which our politicians apparently stand for nothing other than their own chances of getting re-elected.

I agree @MrsBennetsPoorNerves I feel homeless and not happy about local candidates at all. I do see political parties exist to get elected but it’s how they are going about it that’s the issue. They should mostly stand behind their manifesto and a shared ethos. Now they have factions - it’s not totally new as we had Derek Hatton et al but it’s not what I want to see.

You're right @Neriah. Talking of public services, why do they get to strip the NHS when they're unlikely to use it themselves, and just the rest of us who have to?

But I do think mobbing a persons family home is a bit much.

Yes, this. Two murders in less than a decade plus multiple planned killings. There are only 650 of them- it must be one of the most dangerous jobs in the world. We need to rethink their security completely.

Most MPs are fairly decent people. Not all are good enough to be MPs and I believe how they are selected is flawed. They are there to take tough decisions and governments of all colours have taken decisions people don’t like.

Many of us don’t like all sorts of policies brought in by all sorts of governments but that’s politics. I don’t want to keep paying into the nhs money pit for worsening services and low productivity. I would be happy to see reform. What I want to see is a government with the brains to look at and implement some reform. We need to look at how other countries work because so many of them are better than us. However any elected members making hard decisions should not be attacked or intimidated by residents. We already have an issue with poor quality MPs. We are making it so only people like Anderson will come forward. We deserve better but decent intelligent people will not do the job. It doesn’t pay enough or offer enough protection.

The fish rots from the head.

Even if most local MPs are decent people, when you have those corrupt racist liars at Westminster, the hate filters through

As it did with the jailed Labour MP for Sheffield Hallam too I guess. We really need to keep away from calling MPs corrupt, racist liars. They are not this in the main. None of these things. MPs have always, mostly, followed policy and the whips. If they speak as individuals they need to be elected as individuals. It’s that simple. If you disagree with the line your party is taking, resign and have a by election. Most MPs are decent people but harassment and protests outside their homes is too much and made worse by inflammatory language like corrup - racist - liars. We need to stop this rhetoric. Now.

I agree that most MPs are, on balance, decent people, but it seems to me that the proportion of MPs that don't fit that description may have increased. Is this the Boris effect?

My old Tory MP was a decent woman. I didn't agree with her politics at all, but she was a good constituency MP, she worked hard and I believe that she was motivated by a genuine sense of duty/public service etc.

Our current Tory MP appears to be primarily focused on self promotion and getting herself re-elected, but without any of the hard work or service that might actually make anyone want to vote for her. If you write to her, she doesn't respond. She appears to have no moral fibre at all.

There are certainly other Tories like her, and I've no doubt that there are some equally crap Labour MPs as well. And in the other parties too. I agree that the security threats don't help to bring in the best talent.

I'm not sure what I think about not calling people corrupt or liars etc. I see where you're coming from, and we certainly shouldn't be generalising about all MPs as if they are corrupt liars, because that certainly isn't the case. But where they have actually been found to be corrupt (such as the recent case involving Scott Benton) or lying (as in the case of Boris Johnson) then I think we should call it out for what it is. A failure to do this will surely just send the message that it's normal and they're all at it.

@MrsBennetsPoorNerves I have no issue with anyone saying a MP is corrupt if they are. If they have been removed because of corruption that’s fair. However this word is used to describe lots of MPs who are not corrupt. For example, some, quite properly, have other advisory jobs. They keep up to date with their areas of knowledge. I don’t see this as corrupt and we need MPs with varied experience and interests.

Ditto lying. They follow the party line but that’s hardly a new thing. It might feel wrong to some and it might not be what people like, but it’s frequently not lying. It’s an opinion. They do use statistics questionably at times but overall most MPs don’t lie.

Racist. There’s another problem. To me we have a problem when the police don’t deal with issue because they think they will be seen as racist if they do so they didn’t investigate what was going on at Rochdale. Obviously more going on there regarding non investigation and we see the same now at Strathclyde. We now have MPs with similar problems to face regarding what’s racist and what’s not .

It is not racist to say someone is breaking the law. It’s racist to say they are doing so solely because they are a Muslim (or black, or Jewish etc). I really don’t see many MPs who are racist but they can be loose with language which they must guard against. I don’t like the general public using words that whip up hatred that isn’t deserved. Plus with the level of nastiness in the Commons at the moment, do I want to vote for any of them? No. I don’t want them to feel unsafe either. The leaders need to calm things down. All of them.

But the issues that are causing concern, eg groups of protesters outside parliament or peoples homes, are more often angry white reform type men. I've seen it. Thats not about racism only.

What's your definition description of an "angry white reform type man".; I can see some women at this protest

https://news.sky.com/story/tobias-ellwood-pro-palestinian-protesters-hold-demonstration-outside-mps-home-13070531