Elderly people's deaths in Britain since the 80's.

[ivanhoe]

Although excess winter mortality is associated with low temperatures, conditions directly relating to cold, such as hypothermia, are not the main cause of excess winter mortality. The majority of additional winter deaths are caused by cerebrovascular diseases, ischaemic heart disease and respiratory diseases.
Excess winter mortality in England and Wales, 1986/86 to 2009/10
Winter Excess winter deaths Deaths per day Deaths per hour

1986/1987 26,370 220 9
1987/1988 32,970 275 11
1988/1989 21,160 176 7
1989/1990 47,200 393 16
1990/1991 37,940 316 13
1991/1992 34,850 290 12
1992/1993 25,650 214 9
1993/1994 25,900 216 9
1994/1995 27,290 227 9
1995/1996 40,190 335 14
1996/1997 47,690 397 17
1997/1998 22,900 191 8
1998/1999 46,840 390 16
1999/2000 48,440 404 17
2000/2001 24,840 207 9
2001/2002 27,230 227 9
2002/2003 23,970 200 8
2003/2004 23,450 195 8
2004/2005 31,640 264 11
2005/2006 25,270 211 9
2006/2007 23,740 198 8
2007/2008 24,690 206 9
2008/2009 36,450 304 13
2009/2010 25,400 212 9
Source: Office for National Statistics

So Ivanhoe...what's your solution?

Have you looked at my graph? Its really quite pretty.....

Aw, Ivanhoe's back

Anyway - we're living too frigging long. I don't want to be pissing my pants and talking shite for my last 20 years. If I could have an extra 10 years in my twenties that would be useful. Propping up shares in Tena lady and lining nursing home owners pockets is not my idea of a fun old age.

Personally I'd legalise Class A's for the over 60's. It would solve the ageing population problem and the pensions crisis in one fell swoop.

I see the Mumsnet founder appearing on Question Time now, representing the middle classes.

Why dont Question Time have on their panel somebody representing our elderly people ?, because the oldest of this generation fought for this country and played their part in creating this country's wealth.

After 30 40 and 50 years of contributions and taxes, pensioners have literally nobody representing them.

Because all political parties now, need the middle classes vote, for it is they who are running this country.

And it's a disgrace.

Bollocks Ivanhoe, it's purely because we're living longer putting more pressure on resources that aren't in place for people to live 35 years beyond retirement. You can dress it up with as much sentimentality as you like, but the cold hard fact is that we didnt' see it coming. People are surviving things like cancer (my grandmother has breast cancer for 15 years, the drugs she has been given by the NHS have stopped the tumour in it's track - years ago she would have died from it). The way we treat the illnesses of old age has changed, but we forgot to change the infrastructure to support the elderly as well. It's our fault, governments fault, blame whoever you like but it doesn't change a thing. We need huge changes to stop it happening to our generation.

Ivanhoe - politics is all bollocks. Politicians are all wankers.

Typical Ivanhoe... Only ever comes to Mumsnet to try and convince us that we all hate elderly people. Totally fails to make the point, every single time. Blaming 'the British'?...... Racist as well!!!! Full-marks for being offensive.

Totally fails to offer a practical solution too.

I kinda agree with alouise; having worked with people over 100 I have zeroo intenmtion of getting tehre and will be dosing on diazepam and whisky well before. I'll look after ds3 as long as I am fit but once I can't then- bye!

You're like noisome sharks nosing around MN on the sniff for a whiff of blood and then you all pile in.

MN smells like the sweaty environs of a right wing think tank. Not a nice place to be....and for Cogitoblabloodybla to call a poster offensive is pot, kettle, black of the worst kind seeing as she resorts to telling posters to fuck off who don't defer to her rancid right wing view of things.

And ivanhoe's wrong in one respect: it's not the Bits who're callous - it's the Engerlanders.

The Bits and even the Brits.

""Politicians are all wankers"", errrr no, it's the British who are largely politically ignorant wankers.

""Full-marks for being offensive"". Thanks, I fight fire with even more fire.

""Politicians are all wankers"", errrr no, it's the British who are largely politically ignorant wankers."

I hope you include yourself in that Ivanhoe

Where's Engerland?

What's wrong with the British? (Other than bizarrely bad taste in politicians...?)

Ivanhoe - the elderly are fortunate in that they mostly live in houses that they bought when they were cheap. And can sell to poor young people for sackloads of cash to pay for their care, if need be. They also get full pensions, get extra cash for heating, even luxuries like free TV licences - even if they are multi-millionaires.

When you start caring as much for the welfare of young people who have and will have none of these benefits, then I'll start caring about what you say.

Sure, there are some poor old people. There are some (lots) of very poor people of all ages. At least the old people have had some time to plan for old age. What about children who did not?

Your posts might go down a storm on gransnet. But on mumsnet, frankly, they rather miss the point.

Go away. You make me really cross. Am feeling like shit today - v ill, bad asthma so can hardly breathe, but will have to drag myself in to work tomorrow as I'm on a zero hours contract so won't get paid otherwise. Already know I have a shortfall for next month and will run out of money in the middle of the month again, same as this month. And survive on a wing and a prayer.

Bog off about old people already.

My 93 year old MIL has been in hospitals and a nursing home most of this year. She has received caring care; she happens to be mostly self-funding at the moment but apparently most of her fellow residents aren't and she's about to be assessed for 'continuing care' which should cover her fees.

There has been not a shred of 'callousness'. People who have used such terms owe an apology to carers and nurses, social workers et al.

Ivanhoe, I think I asked you this with regards to a similar topic you started elsewhere on this site. Which bit of current governmental expenditure should be cut to save more money for the elderly?

I can't believe you're still so upset about me using the phrase 'fuck off'. Sweet...

pensioners have literally nobody representing them.

According to Table 1 there are actually quite a lot of OAP MPs - and then the House of Lords isn't exactly a youth club.

Quite. Ivanhoe also ignores the fact that OAPs vote vastly out of proprtion to their numbers. Their voices are over-represented, not under-represented.

A serious point from the side: the elderly as a population are more vulnerable to influenza and other respiratory viruses which, in UK, circulate predominantly in the winter months. The higher rates of "excess" deaths occurred in years with a more severe cold/flu season.

I have yet to hear of a Government which can legislate against viruses.

Aren't OAPs the only ones that vote any more?

I feel a bit nervous about dipping in here, but Scandinavian countries are much colder yet their excess winter death figures are much lower. Other countries with high excess winter deaths are Italy and Spain/Portugal. So it's not just about the climate, but the suitability of housing to keep people well during severe weather. There's an interesting report called something like The Cost of Poor Housing that attempts to explain all this.

ivanhoe- do you actually have a hypothesis you'd like to discuss?

And re QT, surely elderly people are represented every week by Dimblebot? [tongue in cheek]