Goodbye Spongers!

[ShakesPear]

Anyone else thrilled that the family on benefits living in a £12,000 pcm in London house paid by us will no longer be getting that benefit?

In fact I wonder if the cap on unemployment benefit is to high!

I think it's great that we take steps to avoid "the cradle to grave approach" to benefits.

I don't think that anyone who is able to work has the right to expect their lifestyle to be funded by other people - and it is PEOPLE & FAMILIES who fund this through their taxes, not the mythical being that is "the government"

When I see how much of my hard earned money disappears in tax I do want to know that this is going to people who REALLY need it. The mentally ill & disabled/less abled, for example, IMO need more help than they currently get.

Should people have the right to expect other families to support them long term ? I think it should be a saftey net to support those who find themselves temporarily in trouble - or those who cannot physically work. We should not have a system that allows people to NEVER work. I don't want to financially support these people.

I'd rather give more to the most needy and give a higher amount to temporarily help out those through redundancy or serious illness. I'd rather see "top-up" payments for low earners than pay for someone who simply doesn't want to work....

The 5 million on benefits are also people who work.

I have friends who are both haematologists working in London hospitals and providing a vital service. They claim benefits.

'Personally I'd like to see more people starting their own small businesses if they can't find employment.'

Would love to, mumble! There'a post office and shop for sale in a nearby village as the owner wishes to retire.

But we don't qualify for a loan. No property, no collateral to use.

Bet there will be plenty of money from the taxpayer next year when the banks need more to keep going.

But none left for education, health services and police.

ShakesPear, don't forget, it was the council that failed to find cheaper accommodation for that family. And of what political persuasion was that council? Yes, that's right. Tory.

Actually, the entire housing benefit scandal is a direct result of the Tory policy of giving people the right to buy their council homes.

People bought their council homes, sold them at a profit to a private landlord, who now leases them back the state at market rates through housing benefits.

If we still had anything approaching social housing in this country there would be very little need for housing benefit.

'Personally I'd like to see more people starting their own small businesses if they can't find employment.'

mumblechum I think you live in a fantasy world in which cause and effect are apparently divorced from each other.

Totally agree with your point about house prices rantyknickers. A movement away from the idea that it's good to have large amounts of (fantasy) equity tied up in the housing market would be good news for a lot of people.

The only thing that pleases me about this is that I can be absolutely ruthless in culling a couple of people I know from my thoughts.
The benefits system isn't ideal, anyone will admit that.

Crowing about knowingly moving people into long-term poverty, enjoying it even, is pretty evil (have always thought so and am saddened by it).

This is something that I have been stewing about for a while

I come from a different country, and I was shocked by how many employed people are in receipt of some benefit or another (beyond cb)

It seems to me that something is seriously wrong when working full time is not enough to be able to make ends meet without receiving topups to help cover rent compensate for tax, help meet the cost of childcare

I don't mean this in a grr slash benefits way but a what is it about the way our society is structured that makes it all but inevitable that many people need benefits to keep the wolf from the door way

Or maybe, OP, the unemployed should just go straight to prison, where they will now apparently be 'incentivised' into minimum-wage jobs.

here

Poorhouses, that's the way. And make the bastards build them themselves.
Or perhaps send them round to every higher-rate taxpayer to do odd jobs and cleaning.

good point chibi the taxpayer is forced to top up low wages via tax credits so that large businesses can get away with paying low wages while creaming off huge profits

Raise the minimum wage SUBSTANTIALLY and you could also slash the benefit bill

And, chibi, perhaps the country you come from doesn't have a housing market that is so overinflated it eats over 50% of many people's earnings?

Well, quite, but no govt is brave enough to tell business to take a hike.

Who lives in a £12000 PCM house? Surely, even for London that is a bit on the steep side for a rent? I do not think a lot of people on benefit actually leave in houses like that(disclaimer could not find anything with price tag from OP so went for the next thing up. Next thing down in London was £3700 PCM.)

Anyone else thrilled that the family on benefits living in a £12,000 pcm in London house paid by us will no longer be getting that benefit?

Not particularly.

You work, do you Shakespear?

No no no

I don't mean that as so many employed people need benefits we should take them away and I dont know eat them or flog them or both

But that something is wrong here

Wrong in that say a hospital porter and a cashier with 2 kids can't hope to make ends meet without government help

I don't want to deny them their tax credits etc

But surely it is wrong that they need them

does this make sense?

absolutely chibi, but it's the cost of housing that does that.

Everybody is under the impression that homeownership is a wonderful thing and rent is dead money. But actually all that has happened is that house prices have got so over inflated that most of people's money goes directly to the bank every month in interest payments.

Not into the economy, not into goods and services, not supporting businesses with their custom.

It's all bloody wrong my son!

Rantyknickers

High house prices are a key problem in this country. The older generation have made an (unearned) fortune from rampant house price inflation which is not taxed at all.

When we people realize that high house prices just lead to a higher cost of living, leading people to need higher wages and making our companies less competitive in the global market. Lower house prices are a good thing for this country.

Nonetheless the structural of unemployment in this country is only going to go up. This is the reality of globalization. Expect unemployment to be 20%+ in 10-20 years time ... in some countries in Europe such as Spain its already 20%+.

God, I could just fancy a chai latte.

Wow Hb.

I pity your caps lock key lol

Erm I think you might need to calm down a bit Hbouquet. MN is actually a lot more diverse than the media would have you believe. Many of us are on benefits or struggling to cope on low incomes.

As you can see from this thread, opinions like the op's are in the minority.

With regard to 4x4s ... do you have any recommendations?

Without wishing to give you the time of day hbouquet, actually what Mumsnet is is a place where we can have rational, intelligent discussions about issues with a wide variety of people with different circumstances and views.

You're clearly not very comfortable with that. If you would like to join this discussion without the offensive insults and capital letters, feel free.

If not, trot on.