interested to know what atheists feel about this

[lorelei9]

saw this this morning
www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-trending-34992061

It was interesting to me because after being a devout Tweeter for years, I have come off Twitter because all the praying post Paris bugged me - no objection to people praying but the fact that it's the default reaction when clearly it doesn't help at all just annoyed me and so many of my Tweeps are on about it, it's a pain.

So I was interested that it's troubling for other atheists as well. Anyone else feel like this?

One, the first two sentences of your last para baffle me. Did you mean that theists should pay more attention to morality and typed atheist by mistake?

The idea of offering prayers generally is mildly offensive. To mean I am not offended per say, its like a child saying something ridiculous but well meaning, you pat them on the head, smile and say thank you. But these are educated adults who usually have an agenda, even those genuine or ignorant adults who dont believe they have an agenda are still proselytising their religions agenda. The question is what god are they praying to, and what are they praying for?

To maybe make a point, imagine instead of picking the Yahweh god they had picked Satan. So would the families of the victims be comforted by genuine mourners, who said we are very sorry for your loss and will pray to Satan for help?
Imagine a JW watching someone die due to lack of a blood transfusion saying dont worry I will pray for you.

Imagine a catholic priest saying I pray you wont get Aids but you are not allowed to use condoms.

Imagine any religion saying I am sorry your family have been killed but I will pray to a god who could have stopped the killing but chose not to, to make you feel better.

Imagine someone praying to a god who tells you to kill unbelievers. Then after your family are killed another person says I am praying to the same god as the killers did to make you feel better but its ok because I think words written thousands of years ago mean something different than the killers did.
Imagine politicians offering prayers from whatever god is followed by the most voters, do I need to say more, really, they would never do that?

A moments silence is for anyone of any belief (or none) to genuinely pray or not, without offending anyone.

My thoughts are with you, is an offer of sympathy, no strings attached, expressing that there is nothing you can do to help and you wish there was.

Remembrance, is meant to be a respectful time to acknowledge, consider, maybe even regret events in history. Hopefully to learn from them.
Prayers, even genuine ones, are an attempt to say my god will make things better and because I have prayed for you I am a good person and wont even think that I could actually do something to make things better but my beliefs prevent me from thinking about it.

For example prayers in American are usually from politicians to disguise the fact that they could do something to reduce gun crime but wont because it would affect their income from the NRA and votes from the people..

Prayers are a socially acceptable form of ignorance, they hide prejudice and become a gateway to radicalization. We should live in an enlightened society and its just not good enough to be a good person because you believe in a god, we have a duty to grow up and have a superior secular morality.

The phrase usually seems to be 'X will be in our thoughts and prayers' which is fine. Offering thoughts and prayers to someone seems much more invasive.

Even with the first example, in general I think prayer, if done, should be private and not discussed except with spiritual advisers. Otherwise it's rather like saying 'X will be discussed in my therapy session' which I think few politicians would say - this is because I believe that prayer has an impact on the person praying, and only on them. I think it's right, if you pray, to pray about people and events and how to deal with them, but why on earth would you tell anyone else, unless you think that they think being a praying person is a good thing to be? In which case you are saying it in order for them to think better of you, which would surely be a sin/taking the Lord's name in vain?

I am an atheist, but I have quite a few Christian friends, and I think that many of them have a more sophisticated and complex view of prayer than is represented in the media.

Most of them are also involved in concrete good works as well.

As for me, while I absolutely do not believe in God or an afterlife, I do think it is possible that meditation, prayer, yoga, things like that, if practiced by a critical mass with the correct mindset, may have some sort of transformative effect on the larger society, in terms of promoting kindness and well-being.

I am irritated when people make a show of praying about people who are suffering. 'Look at me doing nothing by trying to make it look like I care more than someone else who isn't doing nothing'. I also feel like this about people who tell you how generous they have been. I find it stomach churningly self seeking.

Many religious people do good things because they are good people and its usually nothing to do with any particular deity. e.g. Parents care for their children not because they are told to but because they are able to work out its the right thing to do.

Bad people will always do bad things no matter what but the problem is that many good people do (usually specific) bad things because they believe their god dictates it. I could list many examples of prejudice, bigotry, discrimination, greed, abuse etc that is carried out by every religion in the world and it is 'accepted' because their religion says it is a good thing.

PitilessYank: ...prayer, yoga, things like that, if practiced by a critical mass with the correct mindset, may have some sort of transformative effect on the larger society, in terms of promoting kindness and well-being.

The problem is that the transformative effect could just as likely be destructive. Meditation and yoga are not activities directed by a 'higher' being. Prayer is directed to a god whose dictates are issued/interpreted by humans. And when you get a group of 'followers' who blindly accept an ideology that is explained by a human leader .... anything can happen and does.

Bolognese, I see what you mean-your point is well taken. I was basing my comments on the thing that Yoga, meditation, prayer, and other mindfulness-type activities (including knitting!) have in common which is changes in brain wave activity and brain morphology. These may lead to increased compassion in individuals who have these practices, and this may have larger societal effects.

Also, I live in the US, where you can't swing a dead cat without hitting a fundamentalist Christian, so part of this is probably wishful thinking on my part...

I am really NOT having a go at America, have very close siblings living there. Knowing how religious it is, where good people believe in a bible that dictates 'Do not kill', I sometimes despair how they can justify killing under the heading of the death penalty. The only point to a gun is to kill yet you can buy one in the local supermarket.

PitilessYank : are you 'out' as an atheist?

I do love that quote on god's existence oneeyedbloke. Do you think it would be inappropriate for me to put that up as a poster in my classroom of my catholic school (only kidding).

As an atheist I don't find it offensive particularly when just said as a figure of speech, but when prayers are given with the view that they are genuinely doing something useful, I despair. I find the idea frightening that an adult can believe that prayer can actually do something about the problem. The complete lack of logic is staggering. Did it not occur to them that perhaps God could have done something before the shootings, or was he just not paying attention at that point.

Thank you for asking, Bolognese, and it is a very insightful question! I am indeed out as an atheist, and I can't tell you how many times I have had people say-"Wow, I have never met an atheist before!"

But when you ask someone here if they believe in God, they often reflexively say yes, but if you question them a bit further, they will admit to being agnostic, at the very least. It is almost as if it is considered a bit impolite to admit to being an atheist or agnostic. I find it really odd.

Happily, more and more people are talking about their atheism in my part of the US these days, but some are very militant and un-charming in their presentation, which is not making them very popular. I tell friends my goal is to be a one-woman PR campaign for atheism.