5 year old won’t listen

[Childwillnotlisten]

Just that. Our 5 year old, who has always been an angel, will not listen to a word we say. He’s just finished his first year of reception and boy what a change in him.

We will ask him not to do something, and he will literally ignore us and do it. All day, every day. Sometimes he will say “I can’t hear anyone” when we are talking. He is worse with his dad.

At school he got a glowing report, and is always following class rules we are told.

It’s exhausting. We are sick of threatening play date cancellations and treats, he almost knows now that we rarely follow through and the only thing that ever gets him to stop in his tracks is threatening to call his head teacher! I know we should always follow through but it’s not always that easy when he’s such a wonderful kid.

What have you found that works for you?

Ah, I'm right there with you! My 1st who is almost 5 has been like this since turned 3yo (when I was pregnant with my 2nd). I lose my rag sometimes, it's so frustrating. No advice I'm afraid

This can be a challenging age for pushing the boundaries. The truth, as hard as it is is that you need to follow through with punishments otherwise it's pointless. Your son will soon learn that he can get away with doing whatever he likes.
Give one warning that you need him to stop XYZ and that if he doesn't then he won't go to XYZ, and mean it. Definatley don't use speaking to the head teacher as a threat, do you want him thinking that if he's naughty at home that he will get into trouble at school too? Don't run the risk of him being scared to go to school.
It's lovely he's a generally a good kid, always make a point of praising good behaviour.

What worked with my kids was following through.
It's not rocket science. You have given him permission to behave however he wants as he knows your words are meaningless.
The only way to change this is to implement the consequences you threaten. That's literally the only way to change things.

He does listen, he has simply learned that he doesn’t have to listen to you because there are no consequences. What works is following through otherwise it’s just empty words. A fair and measurable consequence every time. He will soon stop.

Yes you have to follow through with whatever consequences you’ve set.

So the art is in crafting the consequence. If you need a minute to think of one that you can follow through on, take a minute. My most used relates to the removal of the £1 a week pocket money they get for doing a few things around the house (shoes away etc). Don’t use play dates as you yourself would probably feel rude to cancel.

It’s hard work - my 5yo is very oppositional.

Well he may be a "wonderful kid" but ignoring you continuously is not wonderful behaviour. If you can't be consistent, stop telling him things won't happen - he already knows you are not able to follow through and he's only 5. If you are going to give a consequence, make it happen. Repeated ignoring is rude, and if he can get away with it with you, he'll start doing it with everyone.

Eeek. We have a 20 month old too, who now finds big brother hilarious 😅

We will ask him not to do something, and he will literally ignore us and do it

What sort of things are you asking him not to do? Can you give some concrete examples of a standard few hours?

We are sick of threatening play date cancellations and treats, he almost knows now that we rarely follow through

So this is a problem. Never threaten anything you can’t follow through with. It becomes meaningless and almost a game. If he’s generally a good kid but is having a ‘not listening’ phase, I wouldn’t go straight to cancelling play dates - that’s far too heavy handed. I’d try and stop telling him off for stuff that doesn’t matter and concentrate on the big things. If they hear ‘no…stop…don’t do that…put that down’ etc too much they tune out.

Following through works. If you say something you need to do it. He knows that your talking shit and is testing the boundaries. You won't need to punish him repeatedly. You just need to do it until he understands that you mean what you say. I try to keep to natural consequences that make sense and are proportional.

We have a dismantled cot in the spare room at the moment, and our youngest (20 months) has been climbing the bars on it. He wanted to do the same but we explained he was older and none of us could do that as it could break, but he went ahead and did it anyway and then said “see, it didn’t break.”

Earlier on he kept slyly head butting my boobs in a “cuddle” and I asked him to stop, but he left it a min and then started trying to do it again from a different angle. And again.

We had Alexa on in the kitchen earlier and he repeatedly told it to put the volume up to 20. He kept doing it again and again, each time I turned it down. Laughing, or course, he thinks it’s all a game.

You’ve answered your own question. You rarely follow through.

Im in the trenches with a 5 year old who won't listen. I'm not looking to make excuses but there's been a lot of change in the last 12 months and possibly a mild hearing issue. I say mild because it hasn't stopped her at school but we are awaiting audiology review. I've started using a listening jar, so every time she does something first time she gets a mini pom pom. If she doesn't listen I take one out. Once the jar is full we'll do a day out she's asked for. Early days but seems to have improved things so far.

Like what? The thing he loves most and what used to work was treat foods, but this kid is an incredibly fussy eater and we were advised not to treat any food as a “treat” in any context. It’s just food, all of it.

So natural consequences for all those would be:

"Oh dear, no one can go in the spare room anymore, I'm going to lock the door now." I know you probably can't lock it but maybe look for a way to secure it if poss.

"Oh dear, you can't stop hurting me, I'm going to move you away/move away now and do something else."

"Oh dear, you can't stop being silly with Alexa, I'm going to unplug it now and put it on a high shelf. Maybe tomorrow/next week we can plug it back in."

Edited to add - no need for drama with any of this. You can say it calmly and quite neutrally.

Everything in this comment is spot on. None of what you have described is bad behaviour really, it’s just a 5 year old who hasn’t developed either their regulation or logic skills fully being a bit of an ass. Threatening loss of play dates for this behaviour leaves you with nothing for the ‘big stuff’. Natural consequence 100% for low level, annoying, mucking around.

Very true and I feel this. I feel we have lost all control but I’m totally aware that this is just annoying and nothing really bad.

Sometimes there is bigger stuff, last week in a car park we told him to stay next to us and he just ran in to the road instead.

Thank you. I will try this more frequently. Going nuclear with play date cancellation etc felt awful, and so we always gave him a chance to “earn them back”. In reality I never want to deny him a play date.

Toys. Remove toys. No tv or games. Favourite shows or games are not put on. Typical boy to do this. You need to be much firmer and make sure he gets the message. You think he’s wonderful so you are letting his behaviour get worse.

Remove your boobs. Why is he head butting you!? Put him down immediately. A sharp no. It’s non negotiable. No cuddles if he won’t cuddle properly, Put the cot where no child climbs on it! Why allow either of them near it? Turn Alexa off! It’s not vital to parent a child. You need to say what you mesn and mean what you say. Don’t leave temptation around. Be clear there will be consequences and ensure there are.

Of course he’s a fussy eater. He’s ruling the roost.

So with that one, you could say "It seems too hard for you to stay next to me in the car park when I ask you, so you are going to hold my hand now until we get inside." (Or reigns but that might be a bit of overkill).

2 weeks of 100% follow through and the jobs a goodun. I put mine in the corner any corner anywhere. So out shopping, toy shop anywhere. I carried on as best I could within 20m of them and the on we’d go. You have to choose a punishment that you can bare to follow through on. I could bare the corner for a minute or 2 and it. As enough.

Neither of them should be climbing a dismantled cot. Get it stored away or sold.

Headbutting is looking for attention. Don’t we all pester and prod our partners sometimes? If you don’t like it, warn him and then move away if it continues. Or, lighten up and give him a tickle and a bit of a wrestle. If mine was gently headbutting me it would be because he was looking for a bit of mischief and, quite frankly, I’d join him in that.

We don’t have an Alexa, but if mine was dicking about with something like that I’d unplug it.

I don’t think any of these examples need threats of no play dates. Maybe he’s being purposefully combative because your threats are over the top and also never actually carried out. He has confused boundaries so he’s pushing to see where the boundaries actually lie. You need to figure that out and stick to it, otherwise you’re just confusing him. Children who don’t feel secure within the family’s boundaries descend into chaos.

You need firm consistent boundaries but you also need to lighten up a bit.

It is difficult because we have 2. Youngest loves playing with the same toys (hot wheels etc) so if I take those away then he suffers too. Same goes for music on Alexa etc and fav tv shows like Bluey!

He can’t “earn them back”. What does that even look like? Quantify it.

You are expecting far too much for his age. You are the one dishing out inappropriate consequences and then you are expecting the impossible of him: to figure out what would earn back a future play date and to do whatever the hell that might be. He hasn’t even got a concrete concept of time, past, and present yet.

The consequences should be immediate and proportionate. The results should be boring and bland or else he will take his need for attention and misplace it into winding you up until he gets negative attention. Lighten up about things that don’t matter, and give appropriate, proportionate, and immediate consequences for the things that do matter.

Yes that's true - maybe he needs some positive attention too. Do you have the opportunity to spend 1:1 time with him?

Also remember to praise every single tiny good thing you see him doing - even when it feels OTT to you. Literally every positive thing you see, praise it. It will also work as quickly as the 'punishments' - if not more so.

Sometimes there is bigger stuff, last week in a car park we told him to stay next to us and he just ran in to the road instead

Id try being declarative without giving a direct instruction eg ‘Wow this car park is busy today, I’m worried some of these cars
might not see us’ and hold out hand at the same time.

Or you could give a choice: ‘we have to cross this car park now, would you rather hold my hand or your brothers pram?’