How to stop 4yo winding (manual) car window down

[Bearbun]

DH and I have just had the mother of all rows about whether it's unsafe for 4.5yo DS to wind his window down when it's hot. The compromise we've reached is to try and find some kind of gadget that allows him to wind it an inch or so but no further. Does such a thing exist? I've found locks online that make it impossible to wind it at all, but ideally I'd like him to be able to wind it a little bit a) to avoid him overheating in the summer and b) to allow him a little bit of autonomy/control over his environment. Any ideas?

Why would it be unsafe for him to wind it down? They usually only go halfway anyway.

your voice

Why would it be unsafe? Presumably he is strapped into a car seat so isn't going to fall out.

put a it of yellow tape on the frame and tell him to go no further than that

Wtf? What a non-issue. Most car windows don’t go down all the way in the back for this reason. Children are strapped into car seats for this reason. There is a child lock function on the drivers window controls on most cars. I have never ever heard of a child falling out of a car window which is what I presume one of you is worrying about? Do you really think ypur 4 year old would launch themselves out of a moving car??

Erm, I’d not be letting him do that at all.

This!

if it’s hot let him roll it down. If you want it back up tell him!

I have a sun visor that sort of blocks the window going down any further than about 3-4 inches, so enough for the window to be cracked to get a breeze in. Would one of these work in your car? I got them in boots for around a fiver I think.

You wouldn't let your 4.5 year old wind a window down a bit when it's really hot? Seems a bizarre hill to die on to be honest, unless I'm missing something?

Op, my son has been doing this since he was 3 (he's also 4.5 now) We have an agreement he can't wind his window down "on big roads" and that seems to work. Last year on the way back from holiday, as soon as we were close to home he said "back on little road!" And promptly wound down his window with his foot.

Why the fuck can't he wind it down? This seems like such a none issue it's not even worth writing about and the fact you've had the mother of all rows over it is just completely ridiculous.

What's the issue with him winding it down? Why would it be unsafe? If he's strapped in he won't jump out!

I should clarify that the row was probably more about our different approaches to risk in general - DH thinks I'm reckless and I think he wraps the DC in cotton wool - and about him feeling undermined when I question him in front of the DC. His concern about the window is that DS will throw something out that will distract an oncoming driver and cause them to swerve, or will stick his arm out when a car is passing too close and get his hand broken. My POV is that he should be allowed to open/close the window a little if he's hot/cold.
DH suffers from pretty bad anxiety in general and literally lies awake in bed imagining awful fates that might befall the DC and figuring out how to avoid them. Also our marriage is in the toilet so non-issues turn into issues very easily.
I think @cranberrypi's and @Fivebyfive2's suggestions will work. DS is generally quite compliant when there's a clear rule in place (especially with a visual!) but is verrrry argumentative if you just spring a request on him - like if we were driving and suddenly said "don't open your window!"
Alternatively @Mammma91 do you have a picture of what you mean? I'm trying to imagine it but can't! Probably just being dense!

I presume your DH is getting help for his anxiety and I sincerely hope he doesn't spout complete nonsense like he will put his hand out and his arm will get broken around your poor son.

Your son doesn't need a visual guide or rules on winding down the window, if he's hot he should be allowed the autonomy of just opening the bleeding window.

Just tell him he is not to stick anything out the window or he loses window privileges. The only time DS threw something out was a book when he was 18 months old!

Give DS some ground rules such as never throwing anything out including rubbish. ALL children (and actually some adults) should be taught this. Same for not sticking anything out of the window, whether it's an arm, leg or teddy's arm. You are never too young to have this drummed into you, the same as not crossing a road or touching matches/flames.

Tell DH he needs to sort his anxiety out with GP as a matter of urgency as this is something your son will pick up on and start mirroring. Otherwise he needs to move out until then.

hmm, I have worked in a unit for people with missing hands and fingers, and this is not an unheard of way to lose a hand

Whilst it's not unheard of its not common and I stand by the fact that saying such things in front of a 4 year old is indeed the definition of spouting nonsense, unless your intention is to raise a child who is pathologically afraid of living their life.

It's the same as telling your 4 year old that they have to wear their seatbelt or they will go flying through the window and decapitate themselves.

A simple you keep your hands inside of the car and you wear your seatbelt to keep you safe is sufficient a warning. There's no need to terrify the poor kid with catastrophising.

DH suffers from pretty bad anxiety in general and literally lies awake in bed imagining awful fates that might befall the DC and figuring out how to avoid them.

Nature and nurture cause MH issues. DS could already be genetically predisposed to anxiety from his dad and if the nurture is all high threat, scary as well, he's not got a chance.

Leave nothing in the back to throw and tell DS not to put his arm out. DD was like the Arm Police at that age, stopping me leaning my elbow on the sill.

Presumably it's more that the child can chuck things out of the window, hold their arm out and it gets caught in something etc?

I'm also on team "let him just open the window". But I've found many on mumsnet are like your dh - I got into a long thread-argument once where lots of mumsnetters were insisting my 2yo would simply launch herself onto a road in front of fast moving cars if I didn't put her on reins. The vast majority of kids (barring any with SEN) have enough common sense and self-preservation instinct not to do anything like that. Does your ds have SEN or any kind of special learning needs? If not, he is 4, he will not stick his hand in front of a fast moving car...!

Has your dh spoken to other parents about how they handle this? Do you have friends with kids the same age? They can tell him he's BU

Fine to not use reins. But the majority of 2yos don't have enough sense to keep themselves safe next to roads. Just because you have a biddable one, don't assume everyone does.

And almost no children with ADHD (for example) are diagnosed before 2yo, so how would the 'barring SEN' which always gets trotted out work?

Most four year olds can be taught how to behave in the car. My DS threw a book out once, on the motorway at 18 months. He would not have dreamed of doing it again! I was shocked and I shouted.

As @cranberrypi says, use your voice. And frame it like a privilege.

"Ds you're so grown up now, you're allowed to control your window yourself because we know you'd never stick your arm out, or throw litter out, now would you?"

I think you and I had this very discussion! Sure, you eouldnt know yet. But I'm talking about on a statistical level. The vast majority of kids, ie not the ones who will later be diagnosed with SEN, are capable of the above things. Therefore having a blanket advice of reins and closed windows is excessive.

Most parents know their own kids' capabilities. You knew your dd needed reins, and used them. I knew mine didn't, so I didn't.

Op doesn't mention her 4yo ds being likely to do anything so unusual as throwing litter out of a window. He'd be a very unusual 4yo if he did that

You could stick something to the inside of the glass so it can only go so far down