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Original poster

Still refusing to poo on the toilet

44 replies

WigWamBam · 17/11/2004 11:03

This is long, sorry ...

Three months ago I posted that my dd wouldn't poo on the toilet. I had stacks of advice, and I have tried everything that I could think of and all of the suggestions that were made - and we are still getting absolutely nowhere. She's 3.5 and she uses the toilet quite happily for a wee, so she's not frightened of the loo, she's not constipated, it doesn't hurt her - but she just will not use the toilet. She has a particular time and place for her poos, and we can tell that sometimes she's hanging on to one, but she won't do it until it's "poo time". She knows that the toilet is the place for poos but will only try under protest, and then to a chorus of screaming, shouting, crying and working herself up into a terrible state.

Her diet is good, with lots of fluid, fruit, vegetables and so on, so she has no difficulty pooing.

We have tried everything: getting cross, ignoring it, bribery, incentives, sticker charts, getting her to sit on the toilet with a nappy on, putting her in a pair of knickers to use as poo pants, deliberately running out of nappies, promises of a particular toy she wants, blowing a whistle to make her laugh and relax her, getting her to blow the whistle ... the list is endless. And still we get this downright refusal to use the toilet.

This has been going on for 11 months, and I'm at my wits end as to where to go next. I initially thought it was a control thing, but now I'm not so sure. She really does seem horribly distressed by the thought of pooing on a toilet, and has gone so far as to tell me that she doesn't think it's a nice or good thing to do. I don't know where this notion has come from, as we've never made any negative comments about poo, no matter where it's put.

I am at a loss as to where to go next. Can anyone make any further suggestions as to what this is all about and what I can do about it? I am completely stumped.

OP posts:

Are your children’s vaccines up to date?

Set a reminder

hatterselfamerrymerrychristmas · 30/12/2004 20:41

wwb - haven't read all the answers but one thing that occured to me is - do you and your dh/dp poo infront of her? I do know that some people don't like to do this (never occured to me not to, tbh, and maybe you're like me)but if she doesn't get to see it done and/or sees you lock the door etc that could be giving her her particular view?

Original poster

WigWamBam · 30/12/2004 20:48

Yes, we do - she's seen us both poo in the toilet.

OP posts:

hatterselfamerrymerrychristmas · 30/12/2004 21:06

I guessed as much, but thought it was worth a mention. No other ideas only sympathy

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Original poster

WigWamBam · 30/12/2004 22:04

Thanks ... we have tried absolutely everything we can think of (short of a child psychologist and I'm thinking about that one !) and nothing has any effect on her. We've done bribery, incentives, sticker charts, books about poo - you name it, we've done it. All to no avail; you would think we were asking her to chop her own arm off rather than just asking her to poo in the right place.

OP posts:

Yorkiegirl · 30/12/2004 22:09

Message withdrawn

Original poster

WigWamBam · 30/12/2004 22:14

Is it available over the counter, Yorkie?

OP posts:

Yorkiegirl · 30/12/2004 22:15

Message withdrawn

Original poster

WigWamBam · 30/12/2004 22:17

Thanks - I think I'll have to give it a go.

OP posts:

dinkydoo · 13/01/2005 21:48

WWB - we are having exactly the same problem, our ds was potty trained at two, he is now almost three and a half and refuses to poo anywhere but in his night nappy, while he is asleep. he will jump up and down, dance, scream, wiggle etc anything to hold the poo in. We have also tried absolutely everything, star charts, bribes, ignoring it, two differemt types of potties but he just refuses to do one. He seems to think it will hurt but the fact that he goes in his sleep as soon as he relaxes without a murmur signals to me that it can't be hurting him and it is just completely psychological! My health visitor has made many suggestions, we have tried them all but none have worked. She said it is very common and children do eventually grow out of it...often when they see other children going at school or nursery. We keep talking about it and he tells me he will try and do one tomorrow but then the poo dance begins and it is the same again. Have you had any improvements yet?

jangly · 13/01/2005 22:02

Wigwanbam - could you try going the other way for a while. Encourage her to ask for a nappy at any time in the day and let her know that its alright to do it in the nappy. Then perhaps when things have relaxed up a bit all round, you could gradually start again perhaps iwth a potty to start with. 3.5 is still quite young isn't it? Don't think you need worry just yet tbh.

Original poster

WigWamBam · 14/01/2005 09:27

Not much improvement at all. We have encouraged her for some time to tell us when she needs a nappy, she knows she can have one any time she likes - and still she will only poo at the same time and in the same place.

She had diarrhoea the other week, and even when she was in obvious distress because she desperately needed to poo, she still wouldn't use the toilet, and got really upset when we put her in a nappy so that she could go. We thought that that might reinforce the message that she should poo whenever she needs to but it hasn't - she sometimes comes and tells me that her tummy hurts, I suggest a nappy or a go on the toilet, and she screams the place down (although a couple of times she has agreed to having a nappy and pooed in it - which I guess is a small improvement, even if it is done under protest!

OP posts:

crazymum1 · 14/01/2005 21:42

Hi Wigwambam

Just logged onto Mumsnet for the first time as I have a problem with my son 2.8yrs old in that he holds on and screams if I suggest toilet/potty or even for him to squat so that it makes it easier.

However with regard to your daughter - have you tried one of those potties that actually looks like a mini toilet (I considered getting one for my son but haven't yet) - it has lid, realistic flush sounds etc. You could put that in the bathroom next to the real one, perhaps get her own special loo paper, put up pictures around it and tell her that it is ok to go and poo in her own toilet! Maybe you have tried this already but its the only other thing I can think of after reading all the other postings.

Can anyone help me - my son has been on Lactulose since Sept 04 and it hasn't really helped. He strains like mad but doesn't help himself in that he holds it in - up on tippy toes, squeezes legs together - have even held him on toilet when we could see he was trying but to no avail - managed to let out tiny amount, then urge passes - have tried him without any thing on but he cries for nappy and then goes through holding in scenario again. Have tried charts/bribes/reading stories/demonstrating but nothing seems to work. Message has got through though because when he doesn't need to go - he tells me to sit down because it is easier to do a poo! All goes out the window when its his turn. Has anyone been through this and found the answer??

Original poster

WigWamBam · 15/01/2005 21:20

Would he poo if you just gave him a nappy to do it in rather than asking him to use the toilet - it sounds as if he might be associating the toilet with pain or difficulty, and if you ease up a bit and let him have a nappy, it might ease the problem at bit. I know you may then have a problem getting him back onto the toilet again, but he is still very young and may just not be ready to poo on the toilet yet - someone said to me that sometimes you have to treat toilet training for wee and for poo as two spearate things, and I think they were right.

OP posts:

jampots · 15/01/2005 21:37

Hate to tell you girls but my ds who is now 8! still has severe constipation problems. We have used senna, lactulose and even picolax but it would appear the message is getting rather mixed up between his head and his backside. I remember back to when he was 3.5 and the HV saying "he's still young" etc. Then we got to nursery and then school etc and he sometimes still soils his pants now.

KBear · 15/01/2005 21:56

crazymum - haven't read the whole thread but my DS is 3.3 and does the same thing. Alot of it stems from the fact that he can't be bothered to stop playing and go and poo so he holds it in for days and then screams cos it hurts.

Last week we had a particularly fraught incident where he was desperate to go and kept doing little bits in his pants so I took him upstairs, sat him on the loo, he was crying but I ignored him and started reading his favourite book whilst sitting on the bathroom floor. He eventually calmed down and listened. Well, a ton of books and 45 minutes later we were still there. I was determined not to give up until he'd been.

After an almighty scream he finally went and I heaped on the praise and how much better it was out than in etc etc.

Last few days we've been doing the same thing and gradually he's realising that the more he goes the less it hurts.

it's an ongoing struggle but I'm hoping we'll get there in the end.

crazymum1 · 16/01/2005 20:37

Hi Ladies

Another 'pooie' day! DS has same problem with nappy on - he still won't let go. He spent at least 30mins out of every hour today saying he was doing a poo - but holding and squeezing it in - crying in the bath, not able to sit properly etc. During this time he stops whatever he is doing - he can't play, can't sit, can't even watch tv! He did manage to go but those small ones just escaped I think. We have got appointment at hospital on 31st Jan. People keep saying its a boy thing and they will grow out of it - Jampots - you are scaring me!

janeybops · 16/01/2005 20:59

sorry to hijack this thread but my dd has poo problems too. Has been toilet trained for a year now. Always had constipation 'issues' since about 12 months I think.

Anyway she now holds poo in and sometimes doesn't go for 6 days! Been to HV who gave me loads of lit on sunject. Been to GP who gave me suppositaries and laxative type medicine which she had to take for a week. This was early DEC 04. It worked for about 2-3 weeks and she was pooing every couple of days pretty normally.

However, we are now back to no poos and soiled pants . Taday I have had 5 pairs of pooey knickers but no poo - if that makes sense?!

Any ideas. Thinking I may go back to GP.

janeybops · 16/01/2005 21:00

she is nealry 4

Rosebudz · 19/01/2005 08:23

To the last few posters, can you guys please do a search with the word ENCOPRESIS put in, my daughter has just begun to get over this, it is a problem that comes about due to ongoing constipation. It may help you understand things with your kids problem.

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