Breaking news of death...

[Tissy]

Sorry if this topic has cropped up elsewhere, but I've done a search, and couldn't find it.

My MIL has recently died after suffering with lung cancer for two years. Dd is only 6 mos, so we don't have to break the news to her, but I'm sure the situation will crop up again at some point as she has another 3 grandparents to go!!

Dd's cousins, 3 and 4 , were told that Granny has gone to live with Jesus, and seem relatively accepting of the idea, but I have problems with this as an explanation!

How have you all coped with this situation? Is there a way of creating a positive impression, even for a very young child? I realise that we should allow sadness, as its something that we're all going to have to cope with. Do you think that children should go to funerals? (Dd came and had a great time in the cemetery as she loves people and trees (!), the older grandchildren didn't).

Mopsy, I am sorry that you read my post thinking I blamed my friend, I hoped my last line made it clear that I did not. What I meant was simply that she blamed herself and that is only a human reaction. I absolutely believe that it was not down to her but one of those hideous unexplainable happenings in life that is totally and utterly shocking, and totally and utterly unfair!

When I said I could howl with her and at her, I meant exactly that.

I have been trying to get her to take the rest that her body was screaming at her to take for weeks now. She has been feeling unwell off and on for about 3 weeks now and even the hospital told her to slow down. The day she lost her baby, I said to her that I would take her home immediately and she must rest and her answer was 'oh but I cant, I'm even worse at home finding things to do'.

Short of picking her up and physically dragging her home or to the hospital, what could I have done. She is an adult and responsible for her own actions. I am sorry to say at that point I gave up trying and now my assistant has lost her baby. I cannot even begin to express how I feel.

Perhaps I am angry because I feel guilty, or partly to blame. If I had treated her like a child and called an ambulance, then maybe there would have been a different outcome. We will never know, and I'm angry. But nowhere near how she must be feeling.

Unfortunatly babies are stillborn for many reasons though many are unknown. I am sure Leese will agree with me that it is a subject that many people do not know about or expect in this day and age. Women lose babies whether they are working or not, and it is the saddest aspect of a midwife's job.

Kia, love, there must be many mothers all over the third world who work far harder than the most driven, house-proud, unable-to-relax women in our society.

What happened to your colleague is just bad luck - please don't feel she or you could have prevented what happened - tragic though it is, it's just one of those things - more and more uncommon in our society, which makes it harder to accept when it does happen, but please don't feel guilty or let her feel that way either. Be there for her, when she's able, and weep with her, but don't take responsibility or let her feel any.

It's very hard and you scout round trying to find solutions, in my own way I'm as driven as she is.

When I was expecting my first I was in hospital for 12 days and I wasn't even allowed to get out of bed to pee. It was only afterwards that it was explained to me how dangerous my situation was. So, in the run up to my second I did exactly as I was told and I suppose that's why I just cannot understand why she didn't take the advice she was offered, given the alternative. I suppose noone thinks it will happen to them.

Thanks for listening to me thrashing about. Sorry if I've upset anyone, but I thank mumsnet for the opportunity to say the unthinkable in such a 'safe' environment. I wouldn't hurt my assistant for the world, but I had to say the thought and work through the answer. thanks again.

My dd was asking me some difficult questions last night - "do people go in a box under the grass when they die?" etc... I really don't want to lie to her, but she found the truth distressing. I tried to explain that most people believe that what makes you "you" is not there anymore, and your body just becomes like a machine that doesn't work anymore, so whatever happens to it won't matter. She wouldn't be convinced, though, and insisted that she wanted all of her to "go up to God and be in heaven" which is not something I've told her happens - I've left all questions of that nature deliberately vague, as I'd like her to form her own opinions in time. She's asked all the questions about when will she die, when will I die, she doesn't want me to die....Unfortunately, she knows that my mum was only 52 when she died, so she's not convinced by the "not until you're old" explanation. However, she also knows that my mum was ill, and that my grandma (my mum's mum) is still going strong at 88, so she can see that people do live to a ripe old age.
I sometimes feel I make a rod for my own back by my insistance on not lying to my children, or making up stories (although I do give them the Father Christmas and tooth fairy story, but for some reason, I don't like the Easter Bunny story). Oh, it's all so difficult.

A few years ago a seventeen year old neighbour was killed in a car accident - he was really good with my ds - then aged four. This was the first death that he had to deal with so we were unable to go down the 'he was old and poorly' route. I have always tried to answer my kids' questions on anything as honestly and unopinioned as possible - but this was difficult. My ds wanted to know what was to happen to xxxxx's body and where he was etc. etc. Once I explained about a funeral etc. he said he wanted to go - I felt that this funeral would be very emotional and decided that he was too young, he was at school for the funeral and when we told him we had been to say goodbye to xxxxx he was upset that he had not gone. The next day I took him to the graveyard and let him place a flower on the grave to allow him to say goodbye - this seemed to be enough and even now he will ask to pop down to 'see' xxxxx.

We have had to break the news to our children this afternoon that their granddad is dying.
My dh had a call from his brother to say that granddad doesn't have long to live (he has been in hospital a few weeks now) and is unable to get out of bed these past few days and the nurses are increasing the dose of tablets.
DH told the children - the eldest hid behind his hands and looked very sad, the other two had completely the wrong emotions, dd said "Oh he is going to go to heaven" and ds2 actually was smiling and said "don't make me laugh".
It is very hard for dh he lost his mum only 4 years ago and his dad has been in hospital every winter for the past so many years and has managed to come back from the brink but this year he has lost the will to live and has not been able to manage. It will be a happy release because the hospital were pushing for him to go either to a home or anywhere, they said that they could do no more, even though a home wouldn't take him as he got MRSA in the hospital and he wanted to go home, but he couldn't manage by himself.
Sorry I have ranted on, I just feel so helpless, upset and dreading the next few days..

Oh kkgirl hugs

I have no practical advice to give - I can't honestly say that I have experience of the situation (my father died some years ago but that was so sudden and my ds wasn't even thought of then - but even that had such a huge impact on our lives as a newly married couple). Will be thinking of you in this difficult time.

When my mum died in 1999, my oldest was almost 7, the others were 2 and 10 weeks old. It remains one of the hardest things I have ever done, and honestly don't think there is a best way of breaking such devastating news. I came back home after she died , and remember thinking how my youngest (at the time) would never know her or have any memories of her, and my 2 year old just wouldnt understand what I was saying. I went to collect my oldest from school and as I looked at her walking home I thought to myself how could I possibly break this news to her, I was about to change her life forever? She was absolutely heartbroken, which in turn broke mine again having to see her like that. All I can say is just be as gentle but as factual as you can, or you think they can cope with. I don't think you can have any wrong emotions where children are concerned, they don't know how they are supposed to react, and quite possibly it was because they were scared they reacted as you say. I didn't take mine to the funeral,nor did my sister. We thought it would be far better they all went to the park for the day and had a picnic and played together, rather than putting them through the stress of seeing a coffin and expecting them not to get terrified that someone they loved so much was inside. My mum would much rather they had gone and had a good time anyway.

I'm so sorry for you and your family, I hope you are able to get through this. Just remember that whatever you do or say to the children will be because you know them best and what is right for them. Good luck.

Dear kkgirl, sorry to hear your sad news.

I can only offer this advice based on my experience. My mother-in-law died in October and we decided to tell our 2 eldest children (8 & 5) straight away. It was very sad but we felt it was the best thing to do. The eldest was very accepting. Our 5 year old was shocked and for several weeks would touch on the conversation of death and grandma at the most strangest of times. We knew this was very normal, he was just slowly making sense of this sad situation.

We also allowed them to attend the funeral. I personally think this helps. It was their wish and I think this helped their understanding of saying goodbye to grandma. I think we imagine that children will be very traumatised and fearful but infact they are probably more accepting of the situation than adults.

Talk to them about their grandad's deteriorating health and what this might possibly mean. This is a good way of preparing them. It's so difficult to break the news, but children will want honest and truthful explanations.

I hope this helps you.

kkgirl, so sorry to hear this. Be good to yourself if you can, it's hard supporting someone who is trying to cope with their grief.

Kkgirl, I'm sorry to learn of your sad news. My dad died four years ago and it was a difficult time. As has been said, children don't know how they are expected to react and, if they are very young, may have no true idea of what 'dying' means as they can't imagine what 'forever' is. My children all came to their granddad's funeral. It wasn't gloomy although it was emational, but there's nothing wrong with emotions, and it was a very good way to say 'Goodbye.'
Thinking of you, Sue.

kk girl, if you've already talked to your children, hope things went OK. You are in the position of having to support your dh and your children in coming to terms with this, so I wish you lots of strength.

When my mother was diagnosed with a terminal illness, my oldest son was aged five. He loved his grandmother very much and the news was a shock to him, though he was young enough to forget it for long stretches of time as well. He also realised I was very upset and this in itself made him sad and confused. I tried to talk about the happy and funny times we had shared with my mum and this, I think, reassured him that the grown ups in his life were not all about to cave in to grief or disappear for ever. We also broke the news gently, beginning with telling him that nanny was very ill, so he could get used to the idea.

He came to the funeral, but was put in the care of his other set of grandparents. They played it by ear, and, when he got fidgity and uncomfortable, decided to take him for a little walk outside when the speeches began. It really helped to know that other adults, close to him, but less bound up in the emotions of the day, were caring for him.

Well we haven't had any bad news overnight.
DH went to the hospital yesterday and his dad was very weak, couldn't talk much at all and DH had to feed him. It doesn't look like he has long left at all.
DH went back to work this morning and was very snappy (understandable I know, but I find it hard to cope with the backlash) and it feels like our lives are on hold waiting for the call which will say its all over. I don't feel like I can make any sort of plans, ie I have been invited to a girls night out on Saturday for two girls who are leaving work, but I don't feel like I can commit myself to anything over the next weeks.
As for the children, the eldest ds came to MILs' funeral 4 years ago, and was adamant he wanted to see her in the chapel of rest. I rang Winstons' Wish (~ a charity set up to help children who have lost their parents) and they were very helpful and said that you should consider what the children feel they want to do very carefully. I'm not sure that one nearly 9 year old and two 6 1/2 year olds would be manageable at a funeral, as we have said they don't understand the emotion of sadness, respect and grieving and it will be bad enough for DH, BIL and SIL.
I think we would probably do as Tigermoth has suggested, I could sit at the back with the children and my parents (take some quiet toys) and pop in and out as necessary.
It is a very worrying time and I am very grateful for all the messages and supportive suggestions to help ease the difficult situation.
I just pray that FIL can pass away quickly so that he doesn't have to suffer anymore, that sounds morbid but he has been through such a lot and if they can't make him better then at least he won't be in pain.
Thanks

I didn't really want to get involved in this situation as it is too painful for me for various reasons but I do remember when I first experienced the death of someone I loved and thought I would mention it.

When I was almost 9 my uncle died. I cried and cried and thought I would never stop. I was really fond of him and my Mum, his sister, was so so sad, it shattered my little world. My Mum and Dad decided that they wouldn't take me and my older sister to the funeral and none of my cousins went either. We just went to school as normal. To this day I regret not going to that funeral. I felt old enough to go, old enough to understand what it was all about and old enough to need to grieve properly.

I, in no way, felt bad at Mum and Dad for their decision as they were trying to do what was best for us and the decision was taken about all the nephews and nieces but, 17 years later, I still wish I had been allowed to go.

My thoughts, for what they are worth, are that children don't necessarily need to be over protected, they do have an understanding of what is going on and might need to be a part of it all. Having said that, my Mum and Dad might have been right, it might have been as well that I didn't go!

I really feel for you, what a sad time for you all.

Hilary

Thanks for your posting. I'm sorry to have involved you and put you through such pain. Your message is what I feel in my heart that the children should decide. We talked about it today and eldest ds wants to go to the funeral and dd and ds said that they did although they don't really understand.

My dad lost his brother during the war (he was killed on the railway line and there was always a question mark as to whether it was an accident or suicide). Granddad wouldn't let dad go to the funeral (presumably trying to protect dad) and my dad still is traumatised over Franks' death and the unanswered questions and not being allowed to go to the funeral.
I think that it may be best to be honest with the children - at their level of course and try to take away the fear surrounding death.
Thanks so much for your help.
DH has been called to the hospital tonight so I think his dad may not make it through.
Take care.

kk girl, been thinking of you & your family. I don't know how old your youngest is, but when I was with in laws over Christmas they had the new Mog book, the one where the cat dies and they get a new kitten but the spirit of Mog lives on (cheeky, as ever!) amongst the family. Just thought the older ones could guide the younger ones through it if you could get a copy. x

kkgirl, so sorry you are going through this difficult time; my DH lost his brother a few years ago & it changed his personality for a while & made our relationship very strained, so do take care of yourself as well as everyone else.

I agree that the children should make their own minds up about the funeral; my DH & his sisters were not invited to go to their father's funeral when he died (DH was 13) - they just had to go to school as usual - he still feels bitter about it.

MIL died last year - our DS was obviously too young (& noisy) to go into the service but my mother looked after him outside & everyone seemed to 'enjoy' having a baby around; the other nieces & nephews were allowed to make up their own minds - one nephew (10) couldn't face it so sat in the 'office' with the undertakers who were apparently incredibly kind to him; the others, the youngest being 4 sat in the front row.

Thinking of you.