Shutting children in their rooms for safety

[griffy]

Advice needed please. We're moving to a new house tomorrow, which is completely open-plan downstairs - living/dining/kitchen.

DS is 2Y5M, sleeps in a 'big bed' and his bedroom is on the first floor - next to ours - with an easily openable door. Up another floor is the bathroom. We can't fit stairgates because the bannisters/newel posts just won't allow it (but also they'd be no good, since he now climbs over stairgates!).

So, I've decided that we're going to have to lock him into his room at night and have a baby monitor on. In your opinions is this right? DP is very uneasy about closing him into his room, but I just can't let him have unmonitored access to the kitchen/bathroom while I'm perhaps asleep - or during the early evening maybe out in the garden.

I was thinking of a bolt, so that the door didn't tantalizingly open just a bit for him, but my nursery manager told me a horrific story of two children at a previous nursery to hers who had died in a housefire, because their bedroom room was bolted, and with the heat the bolt expanded and couldn't be opened. How awful for them and their families - hearing that story made me shiver, so I've ruled out the bolt.

I then thought about a plastic drawer catch, but a colleague at work has suggested a plastic slip bolt (like a big plastic hook and eye?).

What do others think/do about this?

Sorry GeorginaA wasn't meaning to make you feel bad its just that griffy mentioned "other possible solutions" in her last post. I'm in the fortunate position of not having to use anything so my comments were entirely hypothetical. But since DS has only been in a bed for 9 days I will refrain from any smugness just yet!!! I can see myself coming back to this thread for ideas in a few months time.

I agree Georgina - what's the difference? I do feel a bit concerned about a bolt, though, after the cautionary tale from DS's nursery manager, and would definitely do something plastic rather than metal for that reason.

Lou33 - thank you; what a clever idea - a definitely possible alternative. How loud are these things? Where could one buy them?

I still can't quite get to the root of people's (including my own) discomfort. After all - we're only talking about shutting them in when they're sleeping...

I'm not trying to make anyone feel bad either- just commenting that you can teach children to stay in their rooms (believe me if you can teach a non-verbal autistic child you can teach anyone). We had to becuase we had run out of other options, so just trying to say to Griffy it can be done if she feels uncomfortable locking her son in.

I did try the rope thing - disaster- DS1 went absolutely mad! He'd bruised his head headbutting it by the time I managed to get the door open.

We have a stairgate across DDs' bedroom. Purely because DD1 is disabled and would fall down the stairs as DS can open them. But we have always had a stairgate across the bedroom door, even when DS was in there. Have you thought about an alarm on the door? You can buy a special burglar alarm that is for caravans, when the magentics are moved an alarm sounds. Could be an idea.

Griffy - sorry, just posted my reply on the other thread before reading these responses.

I too am amazed by so many well behaved toddlers responding to their parents requests to stay in their room - where am I going wrong? !!

Lindy/Griffy My DS (nearly 3) sleeps through the night, doesn't get out of bed once in and can be reasoned with about it (hooray) - but he is a fussy eater, loves taking things apart and until recently was a nightmare walking near roads. Swings and roundabouts, isn't it?

Griffy, just a thought (I know I'm late here and you've sort of decided on a solution) but do you know your ds will go downstairs or wander about once you've all gone to bed? As Crunchie says, surely he'd be most likely to come in to you wouldn't he? I was just trying to think about what we did and where we lived when ds was 3, his room was on one floor next door to a bathroom. The stairs going down from his floor went to the front room, kitchen, dining room, front door and basement, with no stairgates, fairly open plan. Although there was one door we never shut it so in theory, he could have gone down in the middle of the night. We were on the floor above and the stairs up to ours were winding attic type ones. I did worry at first about him trying to get up them at night and falling but it didn't occur to me that he would try to go downstairs and wander about in the kitchen or open the front door or anything and he never did. Might this be the case for yours too? I see what you mean about him being into everything but climbing up to get a pen during the day when you're in the loo is one thing, going in the opposite direction to warm mummy for a cuddle in the middle of the night might be quite another! My ds wouldn't have liked me shutting the door either, but I can see why it'd work if it doesn't bother your child.

My ds is in a room with a high door handle which, up until a few months ago, he couldn't reach. So he was in effect locked in. He went to bed beautifully, slept all night and would call for us in the morning when he woke up. We also had a monitor on.

Unfortunately now he can reach the handle. It now takes him about an hour before he finally settles to sleep each evening. And in the morning he is free to go anywhere he likes. Our kitchen doesn't have a door on either and he climbs over gates.

Fortunately he is not too much of a bother in the evenings and in the mornings his older sister and brother look after him. But it was certainly easier when he couldn't get out.

I really don't see what the problem is keeping him confined to his room. A baby or young child in a cot can't get out and several people I know had their nearly 3 year-olds and older in cots. What's the difference? Also my ds seemed to prefer sleeping with his door shut. I can understand why people don't like bolts but there's no practical difference between a bolt and a too-high door handle or cot side.

If I were in your position, griffy, I would either reposition the door handle or put a door chain or similar on. If he wants to come out in the evening he can't; and if he needs you in the night or the morning he can call for you.

Griffy I think places like Toys r Us do them, or Argos. They are called room guards I think. They are for kids to tell if someone has been in their room, an alarm goes off when it has been set up and someone walks in from what I have read.

I don't know your son and don't know your house, so I can't really say you what's best for you, but I can tell you my own experience of similar.

When my oldest son was a toddler, we lived in an a tiny open plan house. The stairs to the top floor bedrooms ran up the side of the kitchen. No bannisters even. My son's bedroom door opened almost directly onto the stairs. We agonised about locking him in or somehow fitting stairgates (difficult). Our son was very active as well, and like yours adept at climbing and dragging chairs over to high surfaces. We played things by ear and I have to say that he never did fall down the stairs at night or explored the kitchen or bathroom on his own. When he woke up and wandered, he made straight for our bed, a much warmer option.

Going on this, I would move into your house, give things a few weeks and then see if any guards or locks are really necessary. You may find it's not such an issue as you fear. I would also turn the heating off at night, just to make sure that warm bed of yours the most attractive place if your toddler tries to wander.

Griffy - as someone mentioned, the solution we used to this problem was using a stretchie (strong elastic with hooks on either end) to keep the door shut. (It's hooked onto the door handle and then the door handle of a built-in cupboard that is very close to his bedroom door).It means he can open the door an inch, but can't get out - and it is easily removable by us. It also meant we don't have to screw anthing into the wall.

This solution was inspired by Toddler Taming's rope trick.

For us it works - ds is not upset by it. He might try the door a couple of times when we put him down at night, but at least he does now go to sleep (sometimes on the floor on the other side of the door - at the moment he goes to sleep anywhere BUT the bed and we have to put him in later), and more importantly, we get to sleep through to at least 6.45, when sometimes he started calling for us to open the door.

Hopefully, once he's got used to the "freedom" of being in a bed a bit longer, we'll be able to stop using the stretchie.

I must be evil because we used to lock DD in at night..

We used a hook & eye bolt (I don't know what the proper name is?) with the hook on the door jamb & the eye bit on the top of the door. When in place it held the door open far enough for her to see out, but not far enough to get her head stuck in the gap.

We used it for a year or so in the gap between being able to get out of the cot to needing the toilet at night (she was in night nappies until 3.5 though so it may have been longer).

She's now 17, sleeps with her bedroom door shut, doesn't have claustrophobia & isn't afraid of the dark! (unlike DS2 whom we never shut in & is now all those things).

JanZ- my ds1 used to do that- go to sleep anywhere but the bed!

I had this discussion with dd's pediatrician recently. She suggested a tall gate or replacing the door with a screen door. Not sure what I think about that, but it's an idea!

My ds once fell asleep in a cardboard box

Griffy - we will have the same proble m when we move soon. Our apartment is one floor and the living areas are all open plan bar the bedrooms and bathrooms. I am planning to put bolts at the top of the two bathroom doors out of reach so I can lock them. I am concerned about shutting her in her room (I think it is a fire door so unopenable by her when shut). I was thinking of a tall stair gate for her room (like the idea of the tall one mentioned - will look into it). I'd be really inmterested to know what you do to solve it. We have a little time yet as DD is still in a cot - we are thinking of putting her in a toddler bed around Christmas time.

I've been pondering this a lot. I feel it's not right but don't really know why. After all my ds is in a cot with the door shut and is, of course, totally trapped and couldn't get out if he wanted to, so he is effectively locked in his room (his prison ). I suppose we associate it with claustrophobia and punishment - kids locked in cupboards etc - which it isn't at all. I suppose I think my ds is so small he doesn't know any different... I think if a child was genuinely distressed and frightened by being locked in then that would be a problem... but then I have let my ds cry at night to cure sleep problems, so is that any different?? He certainly isn't frightened of his cot as a consequence (tried to climb IN tonight!). Hmm... can't really work out why I instinctively don't like it, but am happy to have ds trapped in his cot at the mercy of fires, burglars etc etc!

I know what you mean, aloha. I still feel bad, but I've thought all the options through and tried everything else. Maybe when ds is a little older (closer to 3 years old) rewards and reasoning will go a little further.

All that said, the last 2 nights have been bliss. He's only whined for ten minutes rather than tantrumed for an hour over going to bed. He's tried the door in the night then without a whimper happily played until he's tired again and gone to sleep in his bed. He's tried the door this morning (6am) then again without fuss got his toys out and played until I went and got him at 7am. He's been so much happier, and I'm beginning to feel human again with less interrupted sleep.

Maybe my kid is just weird and feels more secure by having the boundaries. It works for us. I stress again that I intend for it to be a short term measure until a) the family has moved and together again (so less stress all round) and b) ds has got out of the habit of waking several times a night and expecting quality attention. I'm sorry if some people think that I'm somehow deliberately harming my child, but I really think that in a roundabout way I am doing the best I can for him and me. I'm really glad that other parents are able to keep their toddler in their bed by persuasion alone - more than glad, I'm extremely impressed!

On the plus side, as someone else mentioned about swings and roundabouts, his eating is great, no complaints there

I'm glad you can see I'm not criticising, GeorginaA. In fact I'm baffled by my own feelings on this issue! If your child is safe and happy, well I suppose that's what counts.

Another thought - how about those heavy spring mechanisms that make the door shut again after they've been opened. Often they're too strong for my 5 year old to pull so might be an effective way of keeping the door shut without putting a lock on.

I used to shut the door of my DS room ... until he was about 14 months old and it became clear to me that he was afraid of the dark. And then we left the door open ... but he was then in a cot so it was ok.
When we moved to NZ (where most houses are on one level and pretty much open plan) we had a similar problem Griffy ... as DS was by then in a bed and was a 'wanderer'.
Luckily, although I am not a light sleeper ... I ALWAYS hear DS when he wakes up ... and so have never had a problem with it.
We did get a bunny clock and he learned pretty quickly that if he didn't want a telling off he should stay in his room until the bunny wakes up. He was about 2 and a half when he worked this out.
We have never bothered with childproofing the kitchen or anything ... mainly because I hear DS and also because DS will come and wake me first if he wants to get up to go to the toilet or anything ... he is a wanderer but he likes me to know what he is doing ... ... I guess we are lucky.
I think what most NZ families do is put stair gates up at the child's door if they need to.
I personally could never shut my DS in his room ... because he is a sensitive soul and like I say, he is afraid of the dark ... but if your DS is doing better after the last two nights then go for it!!!

Aloha, I agree with what you said. Why do we all feel uneasy about this. I used to put my children in their cots and on occassion shut the door. I do still put them in their room as a punishment, and on odd times use a stair gate to keep them in. What is so different about a small lock/bolt?? I think you are right it feels like it is prison or something. However on second thoughts I can totally understand why griffy and GeorginaA need to do his, again if you don't have a 'wanderer' you shouldn't really express your feelings.

I am sorry if I made either of you feel bad about your choices, I realised that I sometimes do exactly what you are proposing, so what's the difference!

GeorginaA - I hope you don't think that I think you're deliberately harming your child because I don't. My commenets about teaching DS1 to stay in his cot were aimed at griffy really becuase I thought she was saying that she still felt uncomfortable with the idea of locking her DS in. I only meant that you can teach a child to stay in their room when they don't have enough language to reason with- I know because I've done it.

Nothing to do with my parenting skills and nothing to be impressed with ds1 about. We just had to. I couldn't shut the door becuase he would headbutt it until he bled, I couldn't use stairgates because he would headbut those as well. I couldn't have him wandering around the house as he has no sense of danger, I couldn't use star charts becuase he doesn't have the language skills to understand those. I was just trying to show what had worked for us, and just trying to reassure Griffy that if she really didn't want to lock the door- she didn't have to. That even a child with very limited language skills can learn to stay in thier bed. I really wasn't casting any judgement on anyone who does- honestly!

Don't stress, Jimjams, I didn't

Oh good- I was worried I'm come across as saying "my child stays in his bed" or something like that! IYKWIM (Never mind that 2 days ago I found him sucking the floor mop which had bleach on it- 2 hours after I'd found him eating hair conditioner). Such fun