Discrimination - yesterdays article in the Times

[Eve]

Did anyone else see yesterdays article in the business section of the Sunday Times. They had interviewed the FEMALE owner of a small business, with 450 employees which supplies Agency Nurses. She was complaining about employess getting pregnant and the amount of hassle and money they cost her and her business. One was complaining about 1 employee in particular who didn't tell her they were pregnant at interview and then went on to milk the system by having lots of sick leave.

The jist of the article was about how unfair the maternity egislation is on small businesses. I was infuriated and thought the point of this legisaltion is to protect female employees from empolyers like you!!!

In another article there was a table showing how the birth rate in declining across the world, in the UK the birth rate is now 1.6%. I think business should realise that we need women to have children, who will there future customers be, who will be working in 20 years time paying taxes for public services and supporting an ageing population, delivering meals on wheels etc!!

The answer to all this is... MARRY A RICH MAN. Something I forgot to do.

eee, Rhubarb - tell that to the kids today and do they believe you?

Rhubarb, I go on strike regularly, but the sad thing is my dh doesn't notice....even when the laundry and dishes are piled high and ds has no clean clothes left. oh well.
Clucks, actually the secret is to marry a poor man and make him rich so that when he leaves you for a younger woman you get lots and lots of money (at least that's what happened to me...).

Frieda, I agree, Americans don't get enough vacation, but we sure pay a heck of a lot less tax than the Europeans so our salaries go a lot further. And at least the lack of vacation is universal, for top executives as well as the lowly worker.

too true clucks

Can't get over the perception that Dr's are poorley paid - My profession (Architecture) requires the same entrance grades to Uni, takes a minimum of 7 year to qualify (often much longer) and has an average salary of circa £22k (incidentally it's male dominated, 11% are women). The hours are long (sometimes up to 70hrs per week) and there's generally no paid overtime and rarely any flexible working. Almost all practices would count as small employers (40 staff being a large practice).

The work is more akin to that of a lawyer than an artist (contrary to general perception) with 80% of my time taken up with, statutory permissions, specifiations, contract documents, administering building contracts on site and buisiness admin. The range of information/knowledge we need to operate is emense and it's a very litigeous business with clients, contractors etc very willing to take us to court for anything that they do not like.

I happen to work for a more enlightened company and have negotiated part time working, but this is a rarity and as a profession we're haemoraging women (college intake is now nearly up to parity, but most drop out before they qualify). Oohh for the conditions and pay of a GP...... (and yes I do know what they are my SIL is one, and my brother is a Consultant)

Rant over... sorry

OK I take it all back on doctors. I had thought the average salary for a GP was closer to £50k. £80k sounds pretty good especially outside of London. SofiaAmes I'm not sure I buy the argument on US taxes. By the time you take into account federal and local taxes, payroll taxes, sales & excise taxes, property taxes not to mention the cost of the necessary private medical insurance and the cost of funding a university education for kids, we worked out we would be better off in London than NYC. And I don't think many Europeans could stomach the US's relative lack of an effective social security safety net.

Am also surprised at the average earnings of an architect given that their fees range from 12-15% of a project. We had to shell out £35k to ours for a project that took less than 6 months (obvioulsy he had others on the go) although I would say it was worth every penny.

miggy, I'm surprised at vet's salaries. I guess they are the salaried ones, not those who own a practise who must be minting it.

Vets fees are horrific. 15 quid to put a bandage on a cat's leg - done by a nurse, takes five minutes, and uses about 2 quid's worth of bandages?

Still anyone who remains salaried and doesn't strike out alone is relatively poor e.g. plumbers (my favourite!). Salaried jobs advertised in the paper - about 15k. Going out on your own - about 70k pa. One plumber I know owns five houses he rents out to students and rakes in the dosh. My borther tripled his salary as a skilled manual worker in a couple of years by setting out on his own, well with a partner.

We're obviously coming from completely opposite political perspectives, SofiaAmes. Personally, I'd rather have a fairer system where people pay a sensible amount of tax to provide a decent standard of living to everyone in the country, not just those who are fortunate enough to work (or fortunate enough to work in a well-paid job). From each according to his means, to each according to his needs. But, hey, that's socialism ? not so popular across the pond.

Croppy - if you're in the US, it's different, salaries are better. Admitedly my figure is biased to Scotland and a bit out of date (£24k now) see here if you're interested (figures by our Chartered institute). Your Architect was very lucky, we only get 15% when we're doing bathroom alterations or other very small works.

lol, clucks and jasper! it's as true today as ever that who we marry determines our wealth and status to a large degree!

croppy, i agree with you re living in the us - at least in ny. i was astonished at the level of taxation and bureaucracy i encountered when i was living there. the cost of living, taking into account accommodation costs and other things (e.g. childcare/school fees), is ime higher than london and salaries smaller (for what i do, at least). i was without doubt relatively poorer when i was living there. other places in the states are more reasonable i believe.

I have to agree with Janeway regarding poorly paid architects. I'm an architect too and although I have had 9 years of further education to get me there, I make £12.50/hour. And my boss is barely making ends meet. And his practice is very successful as small practices go. The problem with the 10-15% is that a good portion of it goes to pay for paperwork. We are doing a project for some japanese and they were astounded at the amount of paperwork/contracts/disclaimers etc. that is involved in hiring an architect and builder. In Japan they just shake hands and if the architect or builder does anything wrong (which they rarely do there) they come back and fix it immediately as a matter of honor!!

Croppy I think that New York City is very unusual in its high costs. You would probably find that your cost of living is significantly cheaper just about anywhere else in the usa. When I moved from nyc to la I sold my 2 bdrm flat and bought a 5 bedroom house with garden and pool for less money. My health insurance costs went from $300/mo to $100/mo. But as you said it really is a difference in philosophy that is more about different cultures than right or wrong.

sofiaAmes

That's terrible - I had no idea Architects were not doing as well as other professions. For such a talented bunch of people wo need artistic as well as engineering ability it's a shame it's not so well rewarded

SofiaAmes, but what use is all the extra money if you don't have any time to spend it or to enjoy the benefits of what you do buy with the dosh?

BTW, the new rights will not force an employee to ask for flexible working nor are employers obliged to accept any requests made. All the law will do is require employers to seriously consider any request, if the request is not reasonably practicable then the employer can refuse the request - surely not an unreasonable burden on employers?