House selling - have I been out of order?

[Ange8]

I wonder if you wise mumsnetters could answer that age-old question - have I been unreasonable?

We put our house on the market at £5k below the price suggested by the estate agent because we were worried that his valuation was too high. The idea (accepted by the agent) was to encourage viewers in the hope that, once inside, there might be a few who would like it enough to put in higher offers.

The house went on the market on Monday, and by today we had received two offers. The estate agents said they would put the offers in writing and send them to us, but basically both were from first time buyers, and both had offered the asking price (although one had asked if we would include kitchen appliances that are not fitted in the price).

So far, so good. I expected to be able to consider the offers and let the agents know how we wanted to proceed tomorrow - or maybe sit on them for a couple of days to see if there was any other interest over the weekend. Instead, at teatime I received a call from surveyors instructed by the buyer who had asked for the appliances if they could come tomorrow to do a full structural survey. I was surprised, as we had not yet received her offer in writing, let alone accepted it.

When I spoke to the estate agents, they said that, if they receive an offer of the asking price, they accept the offer. In this case where there were 2 offers of the asking price, they told the offerors that the first one to get a survey 'wins'. They said the the nuyer who had asked about the appliances was the first one to find a surveyor who could come the next day, so they had 'accepted' her offer. I was flabbergasted! When I said that, in pure financial terms, her offer was less good because she wanted more for her money, they hedged around this and said 'oh, that's just a request, I'm sure she would pay you extra for the appliances if you wanted'. - well, I guess I would have known that if I'd actually seen the details of her offer as promised.

Quite apart from the fact that I cannot be at home tommorrow for the surveyor (so they will have to wait until at least next wednesday in any case) it is of absolutely no benefit to us to chose the buyer who can organise a survey at breakneck speed - the estate agents might just as well have asked them to run an egg-and-spoon race as a tye-breaker. We haven't found a property we want to buy yet.

I would have preferred interested buyers to be encouraged to differentiate themselves in a way which is more important to me - cash! I suggested to the agent that the two parties be asked if they would like to increase their offer, and then we would consider their best offer. The estate agent wasn't into this, however, because they said it was the same as gazumping.

In the end, the agent suggested that we raise the asking price by £5,000. I was worried about this, as I thought this would be more irritating to the two potential buyers than asking them if they wanted to offer more because someone else had come in with the same offer. It might result in them both pulling out because they were cheesed off, or couldn't afford an extra £5k.

Anyway, I succumbed to the suggestion in the end, and the agents said that they wanted to give the buyer who had 'won' the survey race the first opportunity to raise her offer by £5k - if she did, she would win. If she does not offer the extra £5k, they will go to the other people and ask them if they want to increase their offer. If neither come up with the extra, they will continue to market the house with the new price and look for other buyers.

This all seems highly unsatisfactory to me - I don't like the idea of giving the two prospective buyers the kind of ultimatum they will now be geting, and I think this starts things off on a bad foot. But I did expect the agents to work for their commission and get us the best price - not just take one from the person who (I suspect, reading between the lines) they feel sorry for because she has viewed a few properties with them and had disappointennts in the past.

I know I was stupid and naive not to ask the estate agents how they would deal with multiple offers, but do you think it was unreasonable to ask them to go back to the propsective buyers?

Boy - that's long - sorry - and thanks to anyone who bothers to read it and offer advice!

Ange8 - my sister has just sold her house and she also had 2 offers at the asking price but the agent didn't faff around with all this 'quickest' nonsense. He went back to each and said there was another offer, what did they want to do. Each raised their offer by 5.5k and so my sis still had to choose. She didn't want to start a gazumping war so in the end she went for the person that she liked best (the other one was buying it to rent, which she wasn't keen on). SO now she's sold her house and still has a while to move out, and got extra money too.

You're paying the agent, so you get to tell them what to do. Tell them to ask each buyer to up their offer and tell them that's what's happening and you want it your way (throw a tantrum if needs be!! ).

Ange8, we were on the buying end of a nightmare like that when I was 7 months pregnant. It was awful and I even called up the sellers afterwards when we "lost" the contract race and gave them a piece of my mind and told them how disgusted I was with the whole process. It was fairly clear that the estate agents never actually intended for us to be able to win the contract race and were just using us to egg on the other buyers. It seems that they were selling the other buyers house so were looking to make two sales out of one. I think you should tell the agents in no uncertain terms that they had no authority to accept an offer on your behalf and that you are thinking of reporting them to the regulatory board. I would instruct them to ask for better offers as there are two the same and let the buyers decide what they want to do. In fact, I would probably at this point (in my disgust with estate agents) contact the buyers myself and tell them myself what I wanted. This wouldn't absolve you from having to pay the estate agents, but at least the sale would be dealt with efficiently and ethically.

No you're not unreasonable. The estate agent is supposed to be acting for YOU and in YOUR best interests. You're paying them a huge amount of money to do this. I'd tell em to eff off but hey, that's just me! No way should they have made any kind of arrangement or agreement wrt your sale without your express permission. It's NOT the same as gazumping, asking for best offers. Not at all! I'd fire them and get other agents in personally. They are NOT acting in your best interests and sound like f*ckwits. IMO. Hey, wonder if it had anything to do with having to hit their month end sales targets? i.e they had to have offers in by today to get it included in their results. Just a cynical thought.

You employ the estate agents to market your property. Unless you authorise them to, they have no right to accept or reject offers made for your property. Go back to the agents and tell them in no uncertain terms that you do not like the way they are acting and that you are considering withdrawing from them and placing your property with a more ethical agency. I really don't see the difference in raising the asking price and what they are suggesting. You are both effectively asking for more money.

I'm not sure it's a good idea to put the house on the market at less than you expect to get. It's a rising market, so you are likely to get what you ask, and, if people can't afford that, they'll put in a lower offer, which you can then consider.

Thank you everyone for your quick responses. I've been up since 5am, having tossed and turned all night, because I'm so upset about this. The agents actually went back yesterday evening (with my reluctant permission) to the woman who put in the offer which the agents seem to prefer, and asked if she would offer a further £5k to secure the house. They reported to me that she was upset but would think about it and get back to them today. (well, I don't think she would have been upset if they hadn't handled the whole thing so badly.) I really wish now that I had not felt press-ganged into agreeing to this, but had instead insisted that they go back to both buyers and ask what they would like to do - or lose my business. I don't even know, at this stage, anything at all about the other buyers.

I'll wait to see if the buyer agrees to increase her offer today and, if she doesn't, I think I will tell them that I don't want them to put the same ultimatum to the other buyers - one person upset is more than enough for me. I'll ask them to thank the others for their offer but explain that there is an identical one on the table (assuming that there still is at that stage) - and ask them, as everyone has suggested, to decide what they want to do.

Good point about the targets www - I bet you're not far wrong.

Ange8, haven't got much time right now, but if it hasn't already been said, you are the one that accepts/declines offers, not the estate agent.

I would be sitting in the estate agents manager?s office at 9am wanting a few answers and really laying down the law. You pay them so much money and they think that they are these Gods who can just sort out your lives for you and then charge you loads for a few photos, a bit of advertising and maybe 30 photocopies and 5 phone calls....disgracefully over rated service. The only reason they can get away with it is that so many people are so wary of buying a home without going through an official estate agent and so doing it yourself can limit your market hugely.
To have put you in this position with no warning and to learn from it first by a call from a surveyor is outrageous. Have you looked at your paperwork from the estate agent and seen if there is any mention of them acting on your behalf and not needing your verbal consent when accepting offers on your behalf?
We were gazumped on our last house thanks to unscrupulous estate agents who played the game rather "efficiently" - despite a verbal acceptance of our offer, when we sold our house very quickly afterwards we were then told that it had been bought by someone else for a higher price a week before - first we had heard of it and we dropped our price on our property because we had thought we were in a rush... All fell through and cost a lot for all those concerned in surveyors fees etc. Still very angry as we ended up selling at much less than we could have done - and lost a wonderful house that I still dream about.
I really feel for your potential buyer as the estate agent seems to have really duped her into thinking she has just bought ehr first home which is such a major emotional event. I have got to say that if I were ever put in the position where I had an offer accepted and then the estate agents went back and told me to raise it or lose the house, I would now tell them to get stuffed and have no further dealings with that estate agent.
You are not naive and stupide for not asking them about multiple offers policy - it is thier job to give you the paperwork on these type of things and/or discuss it with you. That is what we pay them for. If there was only one offer, I don?t think they should have gone ahead and accepted on your behalf without a quick confirmation call to yourself first anyway.

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It wouldn't surprise me if their preferred buyer is arranging her mortgage and/or survey through their office as something similar has happened to me.The estate agent tries to keep everything in house in the hope of making more money.Is the buyer also selling via your agents?

The estate agents are the unreasonable party and their actions seem unusual and unprofessional to me.

It is for the estate agent to pass on all offers to the owner - a legal obligation. It is not for the estate agent to accept or refuse offers except on your instructions.

If 2 people offer at the asking price, it is for you to decide how to proceed. You will consider the situation of each interested party - 1st time buyer/ something to sell/ finances in place etc as some buyers are more attractive than others who offer the same money.

If you wish to try to get a higher price then you may indeed alienate your buyers but this is a risk that may be acceptable to you. Who are your estate agents by the way?

The estate agents are definitely at fault, but to be honest, I think you are too. Why on earth did you put your house on the market for less than the price you wanted, particularly against the agent's advice? If I were a buyer, I would be absolutely furious that you had wasted my time and messed me around, and I wouldn't want to do business with you, in case you changed your mind again further down the chain when I had invested time, money and emotional energy in the whole thing.

The ethical, correct thing to do, is to accept the offer of the first person who offered, but nobody does that nowadays and they are certainly not advised to by estate agents.

When we bought the house we are in now, there were two identical (below asking price) offers. The estate agent instructed both parties to put in "sealed bid" offers and the highest would win. For some inexplicable reason, the estate agent told us what the other person's bid was and we simply offered £500 more.

I can't believe the agent accepted an offer on your behalf without telling you - you are not stupid or naive not to ask how they deal with multiple offers. Quite simply, they don't, you deal with them. Our agent advised us on their opinion about the buyer's position but the decision was ours.

You now have no way of knowing how the agent put the price rise to the potential buyer - you can bet it wasn't put forward as a mistake on their part nor would they have admitted that they had no right to accept her offer. I think I would have lost all trust with the agents over this and would consider changing.

You're right Ladeeda - we're asking ourselves the same question about why we put the house on the market at £5k below the agents valuation, when it is now obvious that there's a lot of interest in it. The reason was that his valuation was £20 above the next lowest valuation we had, and we thought that it seemed abnormally high next to the others. But we went with that agent because we had heard bad things about two of the others, and one agent just didn't bother to come back to us within the week with agency papers even though he promised to do so within the day. This agent has a good local reputation.

I do feel bad about the buyer - but as both buyers visited on Wednesday night and made offers first thing Thursday morning, I do feel they should both have been offered a chance to get the house at their best price.

I've just been to see the agent and registered my concern about the way this has been handled - upsetting for us and for the buyers. It turns out that the agent did not even get back to the other buyers to suggest that they get a survey quickly - they haven't responded to that offer at all. So the story I got yesterday was a bit muddled too.

I've now asked them to contact me when the 'preferred' buyer gets back to them, and we'll decide what to do next at that stage. I've made it clear that they do not have authority to accept or reject on my behalf.

I'm erring towards the idea that, if the buyer comes back and says she cannot raise her offer by £5k but still wants the house, I should do as Ladeeda suggested and accept.

There is definitely a reason why they prefer these buyers.We had 2 offers but they didn't really communicate with 1 of them even though she was in a good position and made a good offer.The 2nd offer was from a girl selling her flat through their other branch and also using their conveyancing team so they pushed her offer which was a bit embaressing as the 1st offer was from a mum at the school who I have seen since!Put your foot down and if need be change agents

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I agree with all the comments about targets & using the agents other services etc. I think I would ask the agent to contact both people who offered in writing to say that there has been a miscommunication between themselves (ie the agents) and the vendor for which they the agents apologise.Get them to explain the situation is that two people have offered the asking price and are in identical positions. As a result the seller has now instructed them to contact both parties, explain the situation and ask both parties to put forward their best offer in writing to the vendor's solicitor by a certain date (if your solicitors are agreeable) as they feel this is the fairest way to proceed. Tell them you expect a letter to be hand-delivered (if local) to both parties today and a copy to you. That way there can't be any more dodgy dealings behind your back.

As others have said this is not gazumping, this can only happen if you've accepted an offer, which you hadn't. They had no right accepting an offer or setting up a survey race without your agreement. If they start objecting, tell them you will go else where as by accepting an offer without consulting you, they have breached their contract.

I too would be reading the riot act with the agents. They are exactly that 'agents'. They should not accept any offers without being instructed by you.

I would tell them that you are taking the property off the market. They will no doubt say that they found you a byuyer etc etc but threaten them with reporting them to the estate agents professional body for malpractice.

I would get the property valued again by another agent and put on at a better price. If these people want to bid with the new agents then they can choose to do so.

The agents have not acted in your best interests. This could have gone to sealed bids in say a weeks time, and you would possibly have had more than two offers by then, you may have got far more than the extra £5k out of them.

Also he should not be going to one party for an increased offer, but should have gone to both of those who had made the offer.

This sounds like one real mess, that the agents should never have got you into. The whole moving house thing is stressful enough without worrying about all of this.

That's just amazing, Ange8. Compared to the faff we have had of trying to buy, where both the agents and sellers around here are extremely cagey and just sit and consider offers that are very nearly the asking price for weeks (well, months in one case!) before giving a reply, trying to play off all interested parties against each other. Your agents do sound very strange by comparison... any chance you could contact the interested buyers yourselves and just tell them the situation straight, that you haven't had a chance to properly consider their offers and are very sorry that the agents have pissed them about like this, but you need to consider the offers carefully before saying yes to either? I don't think that would be unreasonable and would show that you are trying to be a decent human being about it all.

Agree with Kitty pickle. The agents have created this mess and should sort it out today. Any agent worth their reputation should do this and if not withdraw and remarket it with someone else. This preferred buyer isn't a friend by any chance.

Just because they have ordered a structural survey quickly doesn't mean they are necessarily in a better position to proceed quickly or will ultimately pay their offer price as most surveys will inlcude caveats and raise a few doubts to cover the surveyor long term. Also you want to get this resolved before anyone proceeds further as the agent could take the opportunity to blame you, rather than take responsibilty, should further delays or difficulties occur.

Supposedly one of the Estate Agents where we used to live acts mostly for their Buy-To-Let clients... it's said that they deliberately value houses low, offer a good spiel & low commission to attract the sellers, and then phone up partners from their own Buy-To-Let service. One of these people buys the property at a 'good' price, and the agents then manage it for them. Scam, or what?!

This thread has been playing on my mind. Are you sure the estate agents are being totally honest with you. When we had our house valued, one agent valued it at 20k under the next lowest, all others (I think 4 others) were within 5k of each other. Later we found out that locally this company has a reputation for undervaluing to make quick sales, get loads of people through the door and make more commission that way..unscrupulous and not too bad if you are buying, but really unfair for those selling and too busy/silly not to get other valuations.
If you are not in too much of a hurry and haven?t yet found anywhere else, why not withdraw it from the market, leave it a couple of weeks and re advertise with another agency at a raised figure that you think reflect the market more accurately - eg. even 15k up so you have room to come down. Most people look at houses just beyond their budget with a view of striking a bargain, not many go in with a view of upping the price, that logic sounds a bit bonkers

I think I agree with you Stripymouse, on reflection. If the first buyer currently being dangled does increase her offer, I think I'm tempted to go with that to get the whole thing over with. Otherwise, I think we might take the house off with this agent (there is no penalty - just a seven day notice period) and contact the other potential buyers to explain that we have done so because of commnunication problems with our agent (not sure whether I should go as far as saying that the agent appeared to be favouring particular buyers). I will invite them to consider our house again when we put it back on with a new agent the week after (at a higher price). I asked the agent this morning to let me have deatils of the offers in writing without delay (as they had promised) so I hope I will find out who the other prospective buyers are at that stage.

Only problem is, most of the houses we want to buy in this area are for sale with the agent we are in dispute with - and on past experience we'll know we won't be favourites with them!

Heard nothing yet from the agent re: the 'preferred' buyer.

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