Nurseries threatening they wont offer the 30-hour funded places

[winterwonder1]

Looks like some big issues ahead - ours say they will, keeping our fingers crossed

30 and 15 hours free childcare places cut as costs spiral | The Bolton News

The big chains still make big profits - here the amount the council pays is similar to the hourly rate anyway, but the chains say they charge top-ups across the country so have to here too (and that there are shared costs across the country so it's OK for parents here to subsidise the south east).

Yes, seems like there is a big north/south divide on funding and top-ups.

It's like care homes - the big chains always make a profit.

I suppose we will always need people to look after our little children and older relatives.

Broken system that should be reformed and doesn't act as advertised - news at 11

It’s because the government are advertising it as free, but aren’t paying for it.

It’s all disastrous! The free entitlement has never been properly funded, even when it was back at 15 hours for three year olds and older.

There is nothing to stop any private setting from operating entirely outside the free entitlement and just charging fees for the hours that they want to offer. I think there are a lot of parents (albeit wealthier ones) who would still be willing to pay for that service.

In many areas they are paying for it - the council pay the same as the regular fees. But the nursery chains say that because they don't meet their fees in all areas (mostly the south east, where fees are higher), they charge national fees as standard.

Tiny violins for me I know, but since I'm not eligible for funding yes I'd prefer to go to a nursery that doesn't offer free hours.

You know what I wish they did?

Joint family taxation and a higher tax-free threshold for families with young children.

If mum wants to go back to work then that benefits her, and it benefits her more if she has a higher-paying job (i.e., usually the kind of career that would be severely disrupted by a few years out of the workforce).

If the family wants dad to be sole earner for a while while the kids are young, he benefits from sharing a larger joint tax-free threshold + the extra for having kids.

I just don't see the sense in having mums return to work to go earn minimum wage in a job they could pick up again in 5 years time with no trouble.

(My fantasy world also includes a lot more joint investment, savings and pension accounts that women would share with their husbands instead of having to beg him to fund her pension.)

Local authorities paying the same as the hourly rate is extremely rare. The majority of areas, the 3/4 year old funding is woefully inadequate.

This isn't a like for like though... there are so many restrictions in place for the funded hours that your bottom line doesn't work out the same as if I charged privately.

So for example- I could charge a daily rate of £60 for 10 hours and no discount if you want to collect an hour early, you still pay the daily rate.

Funding might be £6.50, you'd think i was making more per hour. But I can only claim for the hours a child needs, so if that's 8 hours then I'm only earning £52...

@ScrewedByFunding - you can set your hours as a 10 hour day. If parents decide to pick up early, that's up to them, but your session length is your session length and that's what you can claim the funding for. (At least that's how it works in my County). Eg in my setting, it's in 3 hour blocks. Parents can't split those blocks.

If it's an occasional early pick up that's one thing, but you cannot claim for hours which are consistently never used. That is completely against the DfE rules, as is forcing parents to pay privately for the hours they dont need to access the funded hours.

I agree, it needs to be an occasional pick up. But you are also within your rights to decide how funded hours are administered eg, how many hours on each day, as long as parents can access 15/30 hours without additional charge.

It doesn’t work like that at ours - if I pick up an hour early I don’t get a funded hour back. Hours are set. If I need more, I pay for those, but I don’t get the others back.

You've misunderstood what I've written.

In my council area the council have now said funded hours can only be used in council nurseries and not private nurseries. There has been a bit of backlash as those currently using funded hours will need to find places in local authority nurseries. They say it's due to budgets and falling numbers using the council nurseries.

My children are beyond nursery age now but we were never able to use funded hours with a private provider. This came in the year after my son started school.

That’s terrible! I can’t see how they can say that though, the funding is available for all settings that accept it

But the government has changed the hours that parents with 3 years+ have to work to get UC. If there are no nursery places how can they expect them to work?

Also, as a nursery practitioner, we are leaving the profession in great numbers. There are too many hoops to jump for not enough pay aswell as the long hours, demanding parents and lack of support for the influx of children with SEN. It is only going to get worse…

The provider needs to be registered with the council scheme to access the funding, and the council are not going to give the funded hours to private nurseries. They will need to be redeemed in council settings. (Scotland)

It actually worked okay when my boys were little as we used funded hours with the council and the private nursery did the wraparound which we paid for. They collected from the school nursery by minibus. It was expensive but childcare has always been expensive.

Unless the government pays a decent hourly rate to providers it won’t work. They expect childcare providers to accept less money so they can offer ‘free’ hours. Shameless.

If you read the new guidelines in one paragraph they say that funding is only for education and not meals and extras but then in the next say that providers can’t put mandatory charges on for meals and consumables. So where is the full cost of a space meant to be coming from? This is why may are starting for refuse funded spaces for 3/4 years. The funding rates are better for younger children due to the higher ratios but 3/4 year olds can be in a 1:13 if a qualified teacher is on site which is probably why they are pushing preschoolers into schools.

I thought it was that they couldn’t make meal charges compulsory and you can send a packed lunch. We did that for preschool anyway.

I think this is a good idea. Means more funding going into council ran nurseries so they can hopefully extend their hours and provision too.