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Are NURSERIES EVER TO BLAME for ............

56 replies

drosophila · 16/01/2007 09:58

the incredible amount of sickness a child gets while at nursery. Until DD went to Nursery she had the average amount of colds but since being to Nursery she has a cold (often quite bad) virtually every week. It is getting to the point where it is simply unsustainable.

Can the Nursery be at fault in any way? I often see kids there with snot hanging out of their nose and it is not being wiped. Once when I picked DD up she needed a tissues and they had to run and find some and came back with toilet paper. Shouldn't there be boxes of tissues dotted around the nursery. I also wonder if they send kids home when they should.

I know many Mums here have a similar experience but I wonder if some people find their Nursery better in this respect.

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Are your children’s vaccines up to date?
handlemecarefully · 16/01/2007 13:46

oh yeah and where do you get your stats?

handlemecarefully · 16/01/2007 13:46

I'm not arguing against clean hands and wiped noses - just pointing out that the lo's will contract colds in any case...

Blandmum · 16/01/2007 13:53

No, I don't think it is too much to expect children to have their noses wiped. For no other reason than it makes thm more confortable.

I think that such nose wiping is unlikely to reduce coughs and colds.

Yes hand washing does have an effect, but it will not be that great in an enviroment when aerosol spray will be reasonably common.

My GP told me that there are around 200 different cold viruses. You have no resistance to them until you catch them. So young children go through phases of having lots, mine did and thet didn't go to nursery until later in life. But they still got the coughs and sniffles. It is part of life, I'm afraid

bundle · 16/01/2007 13:53

there are boxes of tissues dotted around out nursery. Viruses can also be spread by people breathing them in, so unless you prohibit breathing then yes, they will spread. if you sit in a tube carriage and someone sneezes, after 20 minutes apparently everyone in the carriage will have breathed in their little viral guests

dd1 had a lot of infections but dd2 has had fewer, even though she's done the same amount of days at nursery as her sister. it took her 3 and a half years to get chickenpox (she was definitely exposed 3 or 4 times at nursery) and I think getting childhood illnesses is part of the "deal" with using any type of childcare. if you're unhappy with the way your nursery is run you should write to the manager.

bundle · 16/01/2007 13:57

ahhhh Ron

drosophila, that sounds like a statistic put about by the kind of company which distributes handwipes

Blandmum · 16/01/2007 14:04

The reason she didn't get so many while she was not in nursery is that she didn't see so many people. the more people you see, the greater your risk of catching something.

Even if you kept her at home, she'd still get the coughs etc, but it might take her a bit longer. She get lots when she started full time school.

It is just one of the things that comes with sending them to nursery.

Can can you imagine the fuss there would be on MN if nurseries sent children home for any cough or cold?

Jimjams2 · 16/01/2007 14:07

yes agree MB.

Mega- I found that the year I spent in Japan I was constantly ill with minor stuff- I thought it was probably because I was meeting new Japanese strains all the time so was more susceptible.

TBH she'll get them at some stage, whether they're spread out or not- each time she meets a "new" one there'll be a chance she'll get it. May as well get it over and done with. Even with wiped noses there'll be sneezing and snotty hands and no nursery is going to be able to be constantly washing hands- even if they keep up with the nose wiping.

I've also heard the bit about childhood leukemia that MB mentions below.

Sounds like a good place Enid!

handlemecarefully · 16/01/2007 14:09

Re the 200 different cold viruses - I reckon I am probably up to about 150 now. There are some compensations for growing older.

Blandmum · 16/01/2007 14:17

and the last thing you can't to do is to get kids twitchy about having to wash their hands all the time. Dd has a 'tendency' to this and we have to control it. God knows how she developed it, we are vaguely 'midden-like' in this house

I have just cleared a bin bag of rubbish and a bin bag for the charity shop from the play room . there was dust there that you could knit with!

bundle · 16/01/2007 14:27

MB - lol!

she's right though, there's always a little bit of OCD looming (did anyone see Trial & Retribution? would have been a lot easier to sort out whodunnit if the mother hadn't been such a hand-wringing, stair-wiping cleaning obsessive)

drosophila · 16/01/2007 15:56

I don't think I am being understood. The stats I got was from a local paper quoting some Doc the specialises in colds - see if I can find a link.

So why do some children seem to get more cold/viruses than others at different nurseries?

I don't think it is necessarily reasonable to catch a cold every week even with the increased exposure of going to a Nursery. It's not the same with all kids at Nursery and it is not that common an experience amongst friends. I just think a little increase in hygiene such as wiping surfaces and washing hands (say every time they went to the loo).

My DS's Nursery did NOT allow the kids to use soap after using the toilet and they were told not to do a poo at the Nursery so strange practices can go on at nurseries.

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drosophila · 16/01/2007 16:04

This has some info about the common cold. Can't find paper link yet here

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liquidclocks · 16/01/2007 16:13

Hi drosophilia, I think I know what you're on about. I don't think it's too much to ask that they have their noses wiped and of course they should wash their hands to eat and after messy play etc.

Could the nursery also have a window open for fresh air?

Like enid my DS1 went to a nursery where the children slept outside in prams (unless it was blowing a gale of course!) and I thought that was quite good for them if a little old fashioned.

Are all the other children the same? Do you know any of theother parents? - Just wondering if it's worth considering any other underlying problems like allergies?

drosophila · 16/01/2007 16:50

Well given DS's history with alergies and asthma probably not a bad idea to consider. She does not have the classic anaphalxis type reactions that DS can have but perhaps food intolerances etc...

If it contiues at this rate I may have to quit my job. 200 cold virsus could translate to 200 weeks roughly 4 years . No employer is going to put up with that.

It really is geting me down. I don't know any of the parents there really. Working with kids is never easy is it?

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handlemecarefully · 16/01/2007 20:29

I remember having to take a lot of time off whilst I was still working and lo's were at Day Nursery. I always took it out of my annual leave entitlement, but my boss was still purse lipped and disapproving about it. I sympathise - it is difficult.

Katymac · 16/01/2007 20:38

According to OFSTED when a nursery worker sees a snotty nose she should
A) Wash her hands
b) put on rubber gloves
c) remove a clean tissue from a box
d) wipe childs nose
e) dispose of tissue (possibly change gloves at this point - I am awaiting clarification)
f) use wipe to clean up childs face
g) dispose of wipe
h) dispose of gloves
i) wash hands
j) start on next child (or even same child if nase is very drippy)

Is it any wonder childrens noses don't get blown when she might be responsible for 8 children 6 of which have a cold????

Pinkmazza · 16/01/2007 21:14

I agree with you totally Drosophila.

Good point about the nursery nurse who was ill but was still at work.. the same thing seems to happen with our nursery and I have been told by one of the girls there that they do not get paid if they are off sick so they go into work even if they are ill...
Also, mngmt do not send them home because it then leaves them understaffed..

Sounds like our nurseries are quite similar. I have dealt with a few and mngmt wise this is by far the worst..
I wonder whether its because it is apart of a big chain??

drosophila · 17/01/2007 08:09

Katymac is all that true? I would settle for just a quick wipe and the occassional washing of hands.

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Katymac · 17/01/2007 08:17

Well I was asking (cos I'm trying to open a nursery) I wondered if a tube of that hand cleaning gel (like they have in hospitals) in every apron pocket might help....but they didn't like that idea - apparently gloves are better

I wonder if they would like staff to wear disposable clothes as by the time they have
GLoves
Apron for changing nappies
Mask if they have a cold

They might as well be in a nurses uniform or a wet suit

Bozza · 17/01/2007 09:18

dros I know it is hard. But it is very unlikely that your DD will get all 200 viruses in her first 4 years. There is usually still one or two around each winter that I have not previously had - although I suppose there has been sufficient time in the last 30odd years for a few mutations to take place. Surely she will pick up in the spring and have fewer colds? Most people and especially children do.

How old is she?

Enid · 17/01/2007 10:31

fireflyfairy they sleep in big old silver cross prams, rocked off to sleep then wheeled outside (there is a little roof above them to stop them getting soaked)

I was a bit concerned about cold but they bundle them up and dd3 seems to sleep incredibly well there (they put her on her tummy too bless them)

drosophila · 17/01/2007 20:27

Almost 2.

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Blandmum · 17/01/2007 20:33

it would be impossible for her to 'meet' all 200 in the first 4 years of life.

But we all meet them at some point. Every one she gets now, she will not gate later on in her school days.

My dd at 18 months to 2.5 seemed to have an endless cold, and she didn't go to nursery. This is a natural effect of meeting people and is largly unavoidable.

Lazylou · 17/01/2007 20:40

When I started working with children 8 years ago, the first 2 years were spent catching everything under the sun, including conjunctivitis, ring worm, colds, stomach bugs. Trust me, you name it, I caught it.

The trouble is, some parents won't come to collect their children when requested to, some even go as far as giving fake numbers to the nursery so cannot be contacted anyway.

I think it is swings and roundabouts in some places. For example, I won't stand for an ill child in my unit, yet my manager is always reluctant to send an ill child home. One child was so ill just before Xmas that his parents had to rush him to hospital, but he was back at nursery the next day, suffering and terribly poorly. I had to harrass my manager for three hours before she would make the call home and then when she did, we still had to wait until the end of the day for the child to be collected, as his parents wouldn't leave work before their finish time.

Not all nursery staff are poor in the hygiene department though. My unit (and I swear this is all true!) clean noses non stop (we don't wear gloves, we would be in them all day!), we disinfect and sterilise toys and equipment weekly and we wash all our soft toys, cushions, fabricy things weekly. Obviously bibs and flannels are cleaned daily, bed mats and cots are wiped after every use with sterilising solution. There is only so much we can do and still the children are coming down with everything going!

It's part and parcel of nursery life IMO.

Flumpytina · 17/01/2007 21:04

Lazylou, as you are in the childcare business could I ask you a sort of related question to this thread. What is your nursery's policy with regard to the children washing their hands after they've been to the loo, and before eating??

I am currently getting embroiled in a complaint/argument about this at dd1's preschool (I am pro handwashing!!) and was wondering if there are any official guidelines?