Of course not everyone is a bit autistic...

[PeacefulPrune]

...but do you think some people can be a bit autistic?

I know there's that analogy about a pregnant person. That just because you have lower back pain and have morning sickness but not a baby growing inside you, you can't be a bit pregnant. You just are or you're not. But that makes it sound as if autism is always caused by one factor. Which it's not is it?

My issues are that my processing speed slows right down when in a new place and meeting new people.
Separate to that I would say I have good social skills, can read between the lines, body language and facial expressions etc.

I don't have meltdowns. But I am very emotionally sensitive. I don't feel anger I just cry.
I struggle with eye contact if I'm talking but not when listening though.

Unless the slow processing speed in new situations is classed as a sensory issue I don't have any sensory issues.

I struggle to switch and start tasks but have built up ways to manage this.

I can't stop overthinking whether I'm autistic or not. I've already spoke to GP about it, hopefully I'm on a waitinglist to get assessed but in the meantime I keep trying to work it out.

I'd welcome any insights or further reading on any of this.

Also I'm not trying to I wriggle out of being autistic I completely support the neurodiversity movement and would be proud to be autistic I just don't relate to all of it.

I think that's why a lot of doctors talk of it in functioning levels. I know lots of people don't agree with the functioning theory and I totally respect that.

I think the fact that these conditions are described and debated primarily from an NT perspective is a huge part of the problem.

I also don’t think it’s helpful to think of NDs as static - what happens when we are put under certain pressures is key, how sensitive we are to said pressures is another factor.

Some of what you’ve described overlaps with adhd too. Unfortunately most research to date was on toddler boys and young adult white males, missing huge cohorts for decades.

For me it’s not so much about the definitions (which I think are years off being fit for purpose) but more about unlocking the puzzle if my brain, and accessing whatever I need for optimal performance. A diagnosis can help access accommodations and supports but your identity is bigger than the DSM.

The way it was explained to me during the diagnostic process is that a lot of what can just be personality traits are also autistic traits.

Therefore of course there are people out there with autistic traits that do not have autism.
However to get a diagnosis what they are looking for is proof that you have a sufficient number of these traits, in certain combinations and to a point it causes you impairment i.e. if you sometimes cry in emotional scenarios that’s fine but if you cannot manage your emotions to the point you cannot maintain relationships or a job for example, that is impairment.

I felt that when going through the diagnostic process there was actually a really high bar to prove these impairments and it was a very intensive and at times upsetting process. Therefore I do get offended when people say we’re all a bit autistic because I had to fight and wait over a number of months to get the diagnosis. The diagnosis validates the struggles that I have had over and above someone neurotypical so people saying this invalidates that process and the diagnosis. The diagnosis is what makes me stop feeling like a shit human- it’s simply the way I’m built. If everyone is a little bit autistic, that puts me back to being a shit human!

No. I don't think you can be a "bit Autistic".

Autism is very much part of the make up of a person so you either are or aren't imo.

With that said you don't have to display or relate to all aspects/typical traits to be Autistic but you do need to have significant impact on a few areas e.g. my son's emotional regulation and social development are affected but his cognitive and physical skills are NT.

@ofwarren yeah it is tricky.

Absolutely @LadyCordeliaFitzgerald I have thought that so many times when doing online tests. Like it ask if you have difficulty doing something and I'm like in comparison to what? I've only ever been me.

Also please could you let me know which if things I've mentioned that overlap with ADHD?

Thanks @DoucheCanoe

@user1471548941 yeah. I wish that when doing online tests for autism they would break it down into the Triad of impairments.

I'm pretty certain I don't have any impairments in the social imaginations one but I don't know because I've not really seen a breakdown of what that would be.

I'm not knowledgeable enough to comment on this theory but as someone who is currently seeking diagnosis, I'd really like to learn more about it.

Someone said to me that autism is a spectrum because everyone is different not because it's a 0-10 best to worst of symptoms. I'm autistic, I do have meltdowns, I do struggle socially but that doesn't mean I'm more autistic than you.

Have you done this op? embrace-autism.com/raads-r/#Taking_the_test

That breaks it down a little better I found.

I just did it not sure I understand the results...

The parts of your op that I thought overlapped with adhd were
processing speed
Switching/starting tasks
Emotional sensitivity - take a look at RSD
Overthinking

Obviously bear in mind I’m only reading a very short post and a bit hyperfocused on adhd at the moment because I’m prepping for ds’ assessment.

this might be worth a look too. I’m not suggesting you should diagnose yourself online but it’s quite interesting and there are a lot of Co-morbidities

Thanks @LadyCordeliaFitzgerald. Well I defo have RSD without a doubt and I can see that my son has it too and I don't think it's a nurture thing with him I can see that it's nature.

I've found a place that does private assessments for dyslexia, dysplaxia and ADHD for £350 for all. But I'm going to go down the NHS route for autism as they are way more expensive to do privately.

All the best with your son.

If you read the DSM 5 diagnostic criteria, it gives a pretty good definition about how traits have to impair the individual in order for a diagnosis to be given.
www.autism.org.uk/advice-and-guidance/topics/diagnosis/diagnostic-criteria/all-audiences
"The DSM-5 Manual defines autism spectrum disorder as “persistent difficulties with social communication and social interaction” and “restricted and repetitive patterns of behaviours, activities or interests” (this includes sensory behaviour), present since early childhood, to the extent that these “limit and impair everyday functioning”.

It's the “limit and impair everyday functioning” bit that makes all the difference.

At this point, please don't think you're not limited and impaired enough for a diagnosis, simply because you've reached adulthood and will have put interventions into place that will help you to cope. These will be second nature to you because it's your 'ordinary' The assessors are very skilled in unpicking things like that and can see what is you masking or implementing your own homemade interventions much better than you can see those things yourself.

You mentioned other assessments for around £300. Please be ultra-careful if you go down that route that what you are paying for is an actual assessment which could give you a full diagnosis and not just an in-depth screening test which says things like you show signs of X condition but need a full diagnostic assessment after that.
I've seen a few people saying their private assessment was not accepted, then on questioning, they had only had a screening test, not a full diagnostic assessment.

People hate the term ‘functioning’ but to me it helps to make sense of it and it was how it was explained when my DC was diagnosed. Essentially he has a diagnosis because he has enough difficulties across the spectrum of social and communication issues that cause him enough difficulty in day to day life to warrant a diagnosis. He is ‘high functioning’ in as much as he doesn’t have any specific physical or academic need, but he is frequently overwhelmed by daily life in itself that it is very challenging for all concerned.

Whereas, if you look at me, I possess some of the traits he does, but I don’t really have significant difficulty going about my life. I’m a high achiever educationally, I am pretty successful in a high pressure job. I think I do probably have some/several autistic traits but they don’t seem to have made a significant impact on my life overall.

It was explained to me that it's the impact on daily function, not necessarily individual traits themselves, that lead to the diagnosis. The consultant was clear that the 'spectrum' only has autistic people on it, even if there are traits that appear in the general population.

The language around autism can take some getting used to. Until I talked to the consultant during assessment I had only understood things like meltdowns through the way they happen for DC - I hadn't thought I had them. Then we talked about my responses in various situations and it was suddenly clear that I do have them, but they're completely different from DCs.

Also, you don't need to be 'proud' of being autistic - it isn't an automatic thing. Some people are, some aren't. For me it's just another feature like eye colour in that I can't change it, obviously it has a much bigger impact though. For other people it's defined who they are and it's a much larger part of how they see themselves. Either is fine.

Maybe this should be another thread but how about can someone be a little neurodivergent?

It was explained to me that it's the impact on daily function, not necessarily individual traits themselves, that lead to the diagnosis.

That's really interesting. I wonder how masking is factored into that - i.e. masking is often necessary to function.

I wonder how masking is factored into that - i.e. masking is often necessary to function.

I don't know specifically, but I do know that I hadn't heard of masking until the assessment. I think it came out in how exhausting I found certain things and how I needed time to be completely alone or things got worse. Also how distressed I get when I get certain social stuff wrong despite trying. My guess is it's the cost of masking that's used.

@Percie you are describing me right there. If I don’t get alone time then all the wheels fall off. Was awful when I had small children. I also agonise about something I might have said and how others perceive that when I know logically most don’t even notice.

I think that there are still a lot of people who haven’t realised that they are neurodivergent - you hear of many people coming to this awareness about themselves through social media and then pursuing a diagnosis.

It made me wonder if the “everyone’s a little bit…” thinking might sometimes be coming from people who are in fact ND themselves but either haven’t worked out that other people aren’t, or are psychologically defending themselves from a painful realisation.

We need to shift away from the idea that nd means “something wrong”. That idea is still very much embedded in the dsm definitions (the idea of impairment discussed above), because a key function of diagnosis is to access services which are expensive to provide. Money is a huge driver here (for research as well).

But clearly, you can have asd or adhd traits and function comfortably. And you can have functioned comfortably up to a point and then hit a wall when life adds pressure like babies, or menopause or a different job.

I think that when a family member is diagnosed, all the immediate family should be offered assessments as standard. It bugs me that services for children with asd are based on an assumption that parents are NT. I can’t help thinking they could be more effective if they took into account where parents are challenged too.

But that won’t happen as long as being ND is understood as having something wrong with you.

It made me wonder if the “everyone’s a little bit…” thinking might sometimes be coming from people who are in fact ND themselves but either haven’t worked out that other people aren’t, or are psychologically defending themselves from a painful realisation.

I find this a compelling theory.

Relatedly, this comes up in the explanations of the RAADS-R thresholds.

I think one of the main problems with the online tests is that there’s such an overlap with some of the questions asked in these and the “armchair psychology” ones for personality traits - introversion being perhaps the biggest overlap. I’m (diagnosed) autistic and actually an extrovert so perhaps have a slightly different viewpoint, but I can see that someone who is a NT introvert could come out fairly highly if they just did the test. I may answer some of the questions the same way, but the drivers would be different. So for instance I may say that I would rather go to a museum than a party, as may an introvert. But for me the driver wouldn’t be towards the less sociable activity, but an awareness that typical party noise would lead to sensory overload - I’d prefer the sociable option but know it’s not possible IYSWIM?

@BachAndByte I definitely see what you mean.

I feel there are a lot of issues with these tests. Questions like “The phrase, “He wears his heart on his sleeve,” does not make sense to me.” I think are really difficult. I definitely do know what the phrase means and I somewhat understand why it means that, but I do also find it a weird phrase and an odd way to express this idea. I’d never use it. So…how should I answer?

I have diagnosed ADHD and I’m sure I do have that and that’s what led me to this excellent board. As a young child I was diagnosed with OCD and GAD and struggled massively. I still do. My
answers to these quizzes tend to put me within the threshold for autism, but not massively so, but depending on how accurate the other diagnoses are, those diagnoses could also be the explanation for the scores, rather than autism itself. Or perhaps having experienced early life through the lens of quite several mental illness has affected my skills and personality in a way that now mimics some traits. I don’t know how to make sense of it all and the seeming impossibility of having a verifiable answer is upsetting!

*quite severe