Webchat with Femicide Census co-founder Karen Ingala Smith, Wednesday March 4 at 1pm

[RowanMumsnet]

Hello

We’re pleased to announce a webchat with Karen Ingala Smith on Wednesday 4 March at 1pm.

Karen is Chief Executive of nia, an East London charity providing services for women, girls and children who have been subjected to sexual and domestic violence, including prostitution. nia supports over 1000 women and girls in North East London face-to-face every year and as many through their helpline for East London Rape Crisis. Karen says: “As CEO, I have ensured that nia has maintained an undaunted feminist commitment to woman-centred service provision during an unfavourable economic and political climate. I have almost 30 years’ experience in the women’s sector encompassing frontline delivery, operational and strategic management and governance.”

Karen has been recording and commemorating UK women killed by men since 2012 in a campaign called Counting Dead Women. She is co-founder of The Femicide Census in partnership with Clarrie O’Callaghan, supported by Freshfields LLP and Deloitte LLP. Karen says: “The Femicide Census is a unique source of comprehensive information about women who have been killed in the UK and the men who have killed them. It enables analysis of men’s fatal violence against women with the aim of contributing to the increased awareness about the reality of that violence, a tool for research and policy, challenging impunity and state failure, and ultimately the reduction of the number of women harmed and harmed and killed by men.”

Karen is a doctoral candidate on men’s fatal violence against women at the University of Durham. She thought some of you might find it useful to know that she and her partner could not have children; she has written about coming to terms with that here.

Karen has also asked us to share the following with you:

“I'm very much looking forward to the webchat tomorrow and to discussing the Femicide Census, Counting Dead Women, men's violence against women with you and perhaps nia, the charity I work for/specialist women's services. I understand that there may also be some questions around transgender ideology and I'm happy to discuss that but hope that our main focus will be men's violence against women.”

“nia has a Prioritising Women policy. As an organisation we prioritise women and do not use the terms sex and gender interchangeably. It should not need saying, but in case it does, I believe in universal human rights. On a personal level, I refrain from using the terms transwoman or trans woman. For the purposes of the web chat I have agreed to use the term 'males who identify as trans women' for those to whom this term is applicable, should the need arise.”

Please do join the chat on Wednesday at 1pm or if you can’t make it, leave a question here in advance.

As always, please remember our guidelines - one question per user, follow-ups only if there’s time and most questions have been answered, and please keep it civil. Also if one topic is dominating a thread, mods might request that people don't continue to post what's effectively the same question or point. (We may suspend the accounts of anyone who continues after we've posted to ask people to stop, so please take note.) Rest assured we will ALWAYS let the guest know that it's an area of concern to multiple users and will encourage them to engage with those questions.

Many thanks,
MNHQ

Hello Karen.

Do you think that we are making progress in the fight against femicide and violence against women, or are we still in the thick of it?

Sorry - that is probably a really daft question.

What is the most difficult thing for you to do, in relation to keeping Womens Shelters going? What (other than providing donations) can we do to help?

Hi Karen

Why is it women's job to deal with male violence? The narrative often appears to boil down to "Men are dangerous, therefore women must XYZ"

Hello Karen and thank you for your valuable work.
My question is about the general lack of understanding of coercive control. What do you think could be done to increase awareness of it?

Hi Karen. Thank you so much for your vital work on this topic and for your critical thought and clear reporting of the issues facing women and girls today.

I have noticed the media presenting violent men, in particular family annihalators, as "good guys" who have been somehow compelled to violence due to women's behaviour. Do you think the media will ever stop victim blaming and if not, why not?

Hi Karen

In your opinion, which UK based political party is the best for women's rights?

Hi Karen, I've name changed to avoid any link to my thread.

Do you think the housing crisis is the main reason for the increase in deaths? Refuges are temporary, and many have limited spaces for out of area women. Yet it's safer to move away. I'm scared to leave my abusive partner because of the risk of homelessness and the lack of safe secure long-term housing. There's other barriers including emotional but I would've left sooner if housing benefit still met full market rent.

I spoke to a lovely woman at Nia once. She couldn't help as I'm in a different borough but she was very kind, thank you.

Karen, thanks for your work.

Which women have you found most inspiring?

I apologize in advance for replying under someone's comment, the point of which I forgot as soon as I started writing this. So, this comment kinda should stand alone, perhaps, unless there is a observable through-line. My mother whines how society always blames the mother for its ills, and, I DO blame my mother for raising my six brothers to have no compunction about being rude, bullying, brutish and even violent, VERY violent, with their spouses. My dad was violent to her, I saw it only once in my 18 years, but she still had a LOT of influence, a lot of power and strength in the relationship and with the family. She is highly intelligent, voracious reader of political, scientific, historical and high fiction; she is charming, charismatic, powerful, controlling, successful, late in life law school grad, even, after a successful career in business and 8 children: six boys, and more success. I DO blame her for how mean and disrespectful my brothers are to women, esp me and my sister, a lawyer. My mother nurtured that behavior. My brothers were and are not rewarded for being nice and good to women: all women are her competition. Do mothers of violent men figure into your study at all, not like you need a tangent to go on with the enormity of the subject matter, but.. ? It was my dad they modeled, but it was my mother who basically encouraged them to be awful to "other" women. And yes, I think all of us siblings, and my father, have had many reasons to feel homicidal TOWARDS my mom, she is horrible, yet an extraordinarily gifted, brilliant, talented, beautiful and amazing life force. She's an NPD, I've amateur-diagnosed her after years of therapy and research that led to that conclusion. Also, I've heard at least two of my bros express frightening desire to kill their wives, who, in turn, are also horrible women like my mother. I don't think many sisters will stick their necks out and tell how it is from "the inside," but this is where some women murderers are nurtured: in the family. Pacific Standard Time over here. Thank you: I send you warmth and love in gratitude for your work.

Hi Karen. In an earlier statement you mentioned the importance of using the correct language to describe experiences and instances of discrimination.

I would be interested in hearing your opinion on the issue of compelled speech and how that feeds in to the culture of male entitlement, intimidation and violence.

For example should women be forced to consider the feelings of the woman who showed her penis in the changing room when discussing the issue of same sex provision or face being censored?

Hi Karen

How can employers support women staff who are in coercive or violent relationships?

BeeWoman

Your work is very important to keeping women safe. There is so much male violence against women and your work is very important in highlighting the dangers women face from men.

If a transwoman is murdered by a man, do you count them as well?

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/sep/25/man-murdered-naomi-hersi-three-day-sex-and-drugs-old-bailey-told

kareningalasmith.com/2018/03/10/2018/

Hi Karen, have you a view on the proposal in the current Domestic Abuse bill to "lie detector" offenders on release and on licence? Do you think that offers women any protection?

Hi Karen
Firstly thank you. I'm in awe of people (especially women) like you who tirelessly and publicly work to make the world better for all women. This, at a time when the patriarchy seems to be in ascendance and the very fact of naming women as a class, let alone counting their names, is considered risky, unfashionable or bad for business.

My question is how can we (as a society and as professionals) do more to stop abusive males before they commit extreme harm? In my work with children I am seeing that it is easier for social workers to start care proceedings for a child from a family with an abusive, dangerous male (usually father or step father but also uncles etc) than it is to prosecute or remove the dangerous male from the family. Although what seems to be most common of all is that nothing happens beyond endless meetings and cancelled meetings; with abuse continuing but seemingly at a level where social workers feel powerless to meaningfully intervene. I worry that children's lives are being ruined in plain sight of services and the longer they spend in homes dominated by abusive males, the more likely they are to reenact these situations either as perpetrator or victim when older.

Hi Karen, thank you from the bottom of my heart for all you do.

One of the most frustrating things I find about talking about male VAWG is the whataboutery. “Women are violent too; what about the male victims; NAMALT”

What’s your tactic to deal with this? It’s like hitting my head on a brick wall sometimes with my brother, male friends and colleagues.

Hi Karen,

Thank you for all that you and NIA do for women.

My question is, how do we fight back against sex game gone wrong or rough sex gone wrong? How can we make it so that this cannot be used by abusive men as a way of evading justice?

Hi Karen, lovely to see you here, I admire your work so much.

I was coming on to ask about the "rough sex" defence when women are killed by male sexual partners too - as it seems such a clear risk to women's rights, safety and ultimately, justice, but I see it has already been mentioned.

So, as an extension to that question - I have great concerns about how mainstream and normalised choking is becoming, with many women reporting being choked without warning/consent during sex - and media using the euphemism "breath play." I'm an old married, but as a young woman I never experienced this. It seems society's idea of sex is increasingly involving more violence towards women?

Karen Ingala Smith WPUK speeches:
A Woman's Place is speaking the Truth (Leeds, 28th September 2018)
www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldBKo6F6S2M

A Woman's Place is Resolute - An end to violence against women (London, 26 Jan 2019)
www.youtube.com/watch?v=KtsTwURgejM

Hello Karen, am I allowed to say i think what you do is so important?

That wasn't my real question, which is, can you tell @JeanHatchet how wonderful her women only ride for murdered women is? Keeping us men out is the right thing to do. Quite a few of us are arseholes.

Hello Karen, big admirer of your work.

I work in a very male dominated industry and chances are there are male perpetrators of domestic abuse in amongst my colleagues. I would love there to be talk around this issue, but wouldn't know where to start with suggestions (or even if it should come from me/women). Do you know if any examples in industry where this has been talked about/addressed?

Hi Karen, lovely to see you here and thank you for all your work.

As a mother who had to protect herself and her two children from a very violent partner in and out of the relationship these words resonated with me - "Once women are separated there is some notion that children will magically be safe and nurtured by domestically violent fathers" & "Children are being divided up and sent off to fathers who believe they are entitled to extensive time with their children, regardless of their abuse history. Women actually have more chance of leaving a violent and abusive relationship than their children do".

Here is the link to the article: www.smh.com.au/national/clarke-family-murders-highlight-the-failings-of-our-custody-system-20200226-p544iv.html

So my question is: Is post-separation an issue that is being addressed within the DV Bill and what are the key factors that you think should be addressed in the Bill that have to be ensured to make progress?

Thank you Karen.

As a mother to three adolescent boys, I try to do what I can to make them as kind and respectful and aware of the inequalities in society, and amongst men and women, but sometimes wish I had a daughter so that I could demonstrate‘treating and bringing them up equally’.

Resources and thoughts on bringing up the next generation of men the best they can be at this would be welcome. Modelling good relationships and behaviour is obviously the best, but I know as a woman I am only now realising how conditioned we all are to behave certain ways or expect/not expect certain things from men or women- so I’m a work in progress too...

Thank you Karen for everything you do for women and girls.

My question is how do you look after yourself emotionally in the face of the all the unrelenting awfulness that you deal with everyday? And where do you find the energy to keep fighting against the wilful ignorance of so many who just don't want to see how bad things really are?

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