Live webchat with Royal College of Midwives CEO Cathy Warwick, 13 October 1 - 2pm

[KateHMumsnet]

Today, midwives in England are due to go on strike. Midwives and thousands of other health service staff are taking action after the NHS Pay Review Body’s recommendation of a 1% pay rise for all staff in England was rejected earlier this year by the Health Secretary, Jeremy Hunt. It’s the first strike over NHS pay in more than three decades, and the first-ever strike by the Royal College of Midwives, which nevertheless has the backing of 82% of its members for industrial action.

RCM Chief Executive Cathy Warwick will be joining us for a webchat on Monday from 1 - 2pm to answer your questions about the strike, and about maternity services in general. Please do join us live on the day, or post your questions in advance on this thread.

Oh good we appear to be stickied. Thanks HQ :)

I am presume we are also allowed to say we are against the strike if we are? I certainly agree with the right in law for people to withdraw labour but NHS workers are getting rises when those outside the state sector have not had rises and often never even get increments based on length of service. There is too much of a divide between higher pay in the state service and usually younger retirement ages and higher pensions and the private sector who are paying for it.

I don't have a question, but just want to say that I support this strike fully and wish the midwives and NHS workers the best of luck with your campaign. I always think that nursing personnel are exploited because they are 'caring' in nature and (most...) genuinely want to make a difference. It's such a valuable profession, and should be adequately compensated.

Do you think more needs to be done to support mothers having multiple births?

Some hospitals have been known to turn away mothers expecting twins or triplets as they don't have the facilities or staff to deal with multiple births. But surely if they can accommodate two mothers giving birth to a child each, they can give a bed to a mother having twins?

Hi Cathy,
I've just heard Jeremy Vine state midwives earn 39,000 pa. Please set the record straight, that the vast majority of midwives will not be on a pay scale of more than 34,000 pa. (excluding London Weighting) and that only at the end of a considerable incremental progression which reflects the increasing experience and responsibility gained over years of service.
I have also noticed an increasing trend of downgrading posts being advertised so that positions which would previously have been paid at Band 8 are now Band 7, former Band 7 jobs being paid at Band 6 and so on.

It is also true that many many midwives are unable to work full-time , because the job IS TOO STRESSFUL AND EXHAUSTING TO DO SO. It needn't be if the midwife/ woman ratio was appropriate to the levels of care needed but this is not the case.

I am not a midwife but work in healthcare and have 20+ years experience. I support this strike.

My question is:-

As local hospitals are closing consultant led units and moving them further away (50 miles plus) what is the Royal College of Midwives doing to ensure that women in rural areas are able to receive maternity care.

I speak as someone with a history of preeclampsia so Midwife units are not an option.

nethunsreject the Treasury is always happy to receive voluntary contributions if you'd happily pay more tax and NI.

Cathy - How many Midwives participating in today's strike will be receiving their incremental 3% pay rise this year? I accept that at some point Cost of Living increases do need to be given, but I do think the strike is being played out slightly disingenuously in the media, as many HCPs on strike today will be seeing increased pay, just not a cost of living increase.

I too am more concerned to hear about the conditions MWs have to work in - no breaks, not allowed a drink etc. I think that would be an equally legitimate thing to raise awareness over.

Hi everyone,

Great to be on Mumsnet, thanks so much for all the positive messages about our action this morning. Really appreciate it, looking forward to answering all of your questions!

So let's start with the action.

@lateSeptember1964

Cathy was my Personal Tutor when I trained as a Midwife back in 1987/88 at St Mary's Paddington. Together with Caroline and Jeanette we were very lucky to have all three teach our group. Although back in General Nursing I am grateful to her for sharing her knowledge and skills and passing them on to our group as I often need my Midwifery knowledge. Her passion and commitment is truly appreciated

Wow! Fantastic to join together again, so glad to have your support and general nursing lucky to have you. Thanks for the compliments. Keep in touch, let me know who you are!

@HeeHiles

I fully support your right to strike - just so disappointed it's come to this. I hope you get what you ask for, you all deserve so much more!

Me too, I'm disappointed. We took this action with a very heavy heart. I only met the Secretary of State three weeks ago, and told him how keen we all were to keep talking. But looks like we're going to the brink. Thanks for your support.

@Catsize

Thanks Seattle, you have quashed many of my concerns. For how long has there been a pay freeze? We have suffered similarly in my job, which is primarily government funded. Only they have actually reduced our fees by up to a third or so. And that was after no increase since the 80s. Bless 'em. I understand your frustration! Interesting re:formula adverts!

Midwives had a two year pay freeze, then they had a year where they got a 1% pay rise, and then this year the offer is 1%, but that is only for midwives at the top of their pay band, and it is taken away at the end of the year. Next year, the proposal is that the same thing happens. Sorry you're having shabby treatment in your job too! We certainly know that we're not the only group of workers struggling with serious pay restraint.

IAmAPaleontologist thankyou. I would have struggled to look after DS when I was in HDU I think (he was in NICU though so I didn't need to), although I had a midwife looking after me most of the time so maybe she would have looked after us both. I remember someone telling me I could have extra morphine because I didn't have a baby to look after so without that I might have been a bit more capable. When I visited DS in NICU a nurse had to stay with me when I cuddled him in case I dropped him.

But Greengrow state sector workers are also paying for their pensions and their salary, as they pay tax too. There are also far fewer jobs in the state sector that don't require a degree and therefore a higher level of debt (doctor, nurse, dentist, teacher, SENCO etc) As Izzy24 said there is often the salary figure of the very highest earners in a state field quoted when the reality is the trainees, new-starters and vast majority are on far less. I support the right to strike and hope that midwives, like so much of the public sector, finally get the thanks and recognition they deserve.

Cathy do you think this will begin rolling strikes or further action?

@Mumonabroom

I completely agree with your right to strike and the fact you deserve (much) more, but at 36 weeks pregnant, I have to say I feel worried by the strike and work to rule.

I have a c section booked (as last two emergency c sections) and know that it would be really difficult if the operation was postponed for political reasons. I completely understand that this is selfish, but with so much focus on childcare being arranged for my other two children, as well as their absolute excitement on having a new sibling, combined with hormones, I'm not sure how I would feel. I am praying I don't go into labour or need monitoring this week. It's such a stressful time anyway, I'd rather not have the additional worry to be honest.

I hope you at least achieve what you set out to do and hope that all the women that need help this week are ok and looked after. I hope they won't be put off routine screening for reduced movements etc, as I know some hesitste even without a strike on. I'm a big supporter of Count the Kicks and hope this doesn't dent confidence, with talk of picket lines etc.

Thanks so much for your support, particularly when you're 36 weeks pregnant. I can totally sympathise that you don't want the additional worry of going into labour whilst we're on strike. Of course, the action is over now but in any case, someone like you who has had two previous sections would be considered as very high priority for care, and should this happen again in the future, believe me, midwives would welcome you at the picket line with open arms and show you straight into the maternity unit!

I too would have a worry that word of strike action would make women feel they couldn't call the maternity unit. In all our publicity, we have tried to reassure women that they really mustn't be put off and any woman who's worried should pick up the phone to the labour ward if she doesn't get a reply on any other numbers. Your baby is the most important person in the world and please do everything that you think is right for him/her would be my message to all mums.

It also irks me (sorry to derail) when people complain about the private sector not getting pay rises, lets not race to the bottom. My mum complained to me, after reading something in a certain newspaper, about public sector strikes, yet she was happy enough when times were good and she got a bonus in her private sector job.

Hello Cathy, can I ask if there's any chance of staffing levels increasing?

Our local community teams seem to be constantly 1-2 members down, and have been for years. A friend who is on one of these teams is frequently in tears from stress. I've known a couple of MWs leave the profession because they just couldn't cope with it any more. I now hear that, in contrast to when I had my son 5 years ago, post natal home visits have been dropped, as the community teams just can't manage any more.

It's not fair on mothers, babies- or midwives

Hi Cathy, good to see you on here. Other than pay (and not diminishing the importance of pay) what are the top things we should be doing to attract and retain amazing midwives?

@hairyporter

Another one curious about how work to rule will be carried out. Surely this will compromise patient safety? Am completely in support of the strike btw. Agree midwives work in appalling conditions for very little pay.

Hi hairporter (and also TheDowagerDuchessofDinglyDell and Lezprechaun),

You asked questions about future work to rule and also mentioned poor working conditions, possibly worse than pay. Yep, you've hit nails on heads!

So, to start with the work to rule, what is going to happen is that midwives are going to say that they won't work overtime unless it's guaranteed to be paid. However, because we know that a midwife can't just walk away from a woman, what the RCM is saying is that midwives should carry on doing the overtime (hopefully their unit has agreed to pay them), and if they don't get paid, the RCM will be logging all the work that's been done and then arguing with their trust for them to be paid. I know this sounds very complicated, and it just highlights how hard it is for us to take action when we must put women's interests first. Interesting fact is that all it takes is for a midwife to work 13 hours overtime and then it costs as much as if she got a 1% pay rise! Most midwives do a minimum of 2 hours a week overtime, which is unpaid.

Then the issue of conditions - I couldn't agree more that this is probably troubling midwives more than pay, and the RCM will probably run a campaign in the near future about issues like midwives not getting their breaks, staff shortages (which we've already been campaigning on), and also midwives being pulled in from community services to cover labour ward. When I go out and about talking to midwives, these are definitely the things that bother them, as well as the paperwork that's also been mentioned on the thread by VivaLeBeaver.

@brandnewinformation

Hi Cathy - thanks for coming on. While you're here, I was wondering what your thoughts are on the presence of Bounty reps on maternity wards (something Mumsnet is campaigning on)? What are you experiences of the effects this practice has on women who have recently given birth? Best of luck to you and all your members

Funnily enough, when I was working at King's in southeast London, I didn't have Bounty packs on the maternity unit because I was worried about women potentially being pressurised to buy branded goods. But in the end, I decided to go ahead with the packs, because the women themselves wanted them and Bounty had done a lot of work, particularly in relation to their engagement with baby milk companies.

I do think that it's really important that we don't pressure women to spend lots of money they might not have on photographs, and the RCM has been reassured by Bounty that this is not meant to happen and if it does, the Head of Midwifery needs to let them know and they'll speak to the rep. I also know that the ex-Chief Exec of the RCM is on an advisory board set up by Bounty to try to make sure their practices were in the interests of women.

So I guess my bottom line is - a good thing, as long as the reps are doing their job according to Bounty's guidelines.

@SeattleGraceMercyDeath

Quick question for Cathy Warwick, why when promoting breastfeeding is at an all time high and as midwives we're not allowed to distinguish between one formula and another to recommend to new parents, do the RCM take money from formula companies to advertise in their Midwives magazine?

Thanks for your question. Midwives Magazine no longer takes formula adverts. I stopped this shortly after becoming Chief Executive, so probably five years ago now.

@whohasnickedmyvodka

I completely support your strike today all I would like to say to you is to praise my current midwife I'm currently 17+4 weeks pregnant and my little girl has downs syndrome and severe hydrops we currently don't know if my little girl will survive.My midwife has been absolutely fantastic and has gone out of her way to find any information she can has gone above and beyond the call of duty to support me .What I am trying to say you deserve a decent wage for an amazing job you do

Hi whohasnickedmyvodka

Thanks so much for your post! I can't tell you how great it makes me feel when I hear that women have had such fantastic support from their midwife. It's especially great when someone with the issues you describe gets what they need and deserve. I do so hope things work out for you in a way that you can manage.

I don't have a question but I wanted to add my voice to the support!

My eldest has erbs palsy as a result of shoulder dystocia. I know what would have happened to us both without enough midwives!

what you are asking for is VERY modest for the vital job you do. We need you and it is not unreasonable that you have a living wage!

@halfdrunkcoffee

The town where I live, Stafford, faces losing its maternity services in the New Year as the consultant-led unit is likely to be downgraded to a MLU. (Link to the local NCT's petition against this here). There are women who are six months pregnant who don't know whether they will still be able to give birth at Stafford as the timescale for change has not yet been decided and is not being communicated well by the decision-makers, leading to a great deal of anxiety, confusion and uncertainty not to mention worry about having to travel to distant hospitals when in labour. Do you have any comments on this issue and suggestions on how local women can be supported in the unfortunate but sadly likely event that we lose maternity services?

Oh gosh, this is a tricky one! I just think all these reorganisations are really difficult for women and I'm not sure we always end up doing the right thing. I guess from the RCM's point of view, what we're trying to achieve is that we don't end up with massive, impersonal obstetric units and from this point of view we would very often argue that the local unit, eg at Stafford, stays open.

And in fact, that's exactly what we've done in this case. However, when a decision is made to close an obstetric unit, we would argue that there needs to be a midwifery-led unit. Around 40% of women should be able to choose to birth in such units, and although if it's a woman's first baby, she has a high chance of transfer to the obstetric unit, outcomes are still better than if she chose the obstetric unit in the first place.

The situation in Stafford is really worrying midwives as well as women, because the time scale for final decisions being made seems to change all the time. The RCM has told politicians how difficult this is for everybody. I guess my suggestion for local women is if you should lose the current obstetric unit, please have confidence that if your pregnancy is straightforward, a midwifery-led unit is a very positive option for you. Also, remember, labour takes a while and journey times are usually manageable if you would prefer to choose the further away obstetric unit or have to because your pregnancy is more complicated. You certainly won't be left in the lurch!

Just to say that I fully support the strike and wish the midwives the best of luck improving their pay and conditions. Also, MN is always a good place to get signatures for petitions if needed

If this is a thread for general questions about maternity services I would like to ask about midwives' training and their attitude to ELCSs.

My experience was that most of the MWs in our hospital had plenty of time to stand around at reception having a chat but were apparently too busy to provide pain relief at the right time or any practical assistance the day after my CS. I got a very strong feeling that they thought my pain was my own fault for having an ELCS, which I did for reasons connected to my medical history but not necessarily reasons I wanted to share with every midwife who asked (most of them I saw once and never saw them again because of shift changes).

So my question: what is your organisation's attitude to ELCS (as agreed by a consultant) and how are your members being encouraged to support women post-ELCS? And do your members have some archaic sense that women who have ELCSs are 'too posh to push'? If so, what is being done to challenge this view?