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We want to be wealthy! A thread to share ideas on how to achieve financial independence

285 replies

ilyana · 26/07/2023 22:53

I asked a question in another forum about how to get wealthier and improve my lifestyle and financial situation in my late thirties, and I got some really helpful advice.

Several posters were keen to set up a thread to talk about topics we don't get taught about at school, such as investing in stocks and shares, lucrative side gig ideas, and air miles on credit cards, and so here we are!

This is a positive thread about encouraging other women to aim high and reach their goals, so please only contribute with positive, relevant advice. Of course, questions are very welcome too!

OP posts:
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ilyana · 28/07/2023 00:03

Has anyone managed to make any decent cash selling their clothes/sunglasses/bags? I've used Vinted in the past, and it was fine, but the buyers weren't willing to pay much, and the faff of making a special trip to the post office doesn't seem worth it now just to make a fiver or a tenner.

I've got a few nice items I'd like to try selling rather than having them taking up space - barely worn Ray Bans sunglasses (sadly lost the certificate), a few no-name leather bags from Amazon, bits and pieces like that. I don't tend to buy many clothes/bags in the first place, but would like to shift some excess as I'm trying to live a minimalist lifestyle!

OP posts:
Hawkins0001 · 28/07/2023 00:10

ilyana · 28/07/2023 00:03

Has anyone managed to make any decent cash selling their clothes/sunglasses/bags? I've used Vinted in the past, and it was fine, but the buyers weren't willing to pay much, and the faff of making a special trip to the post office doesn't seem worth it now just to make a fiver or a tenner.

I've got a few nice items I'd like to try selling rather than having them taking up space - barely worn Ray Bans sunglasses (sadly lost the certificate), a few no-name leather bags from Amazon, bits and pieces like that. I don't tend to buy many clothes/bags in the first place, but would like to shift some excess as I'm trying to live a minimalist lifestyle!

The other issue is if your items are flagged as fakes ect which with some times can be tricky eg buying from charity shops and reselling online. Etc

JamSandle · 28/07/2023 00:18

Joining!

PerfectYear321 · 28/07/2023 00:27

HeWhoDaresWinsRodney · 28/07/2023 00:03

Great thread. In a financially precarious position, once I realised how stupid I’ve been (not entirely my fault, family pressure) I went back to work worked part time as childcare costs would be too much at full time, he wont pay towards childcare and I’m not entitled to benefits because he earns too much but unmarried so I’m stuck! he doesn’t let me pay bills officially as then I could put a claim on the house as nothing is in my name but I pay for kids school meals, wrap around care, shoes uniform piano lessons etc. stuff he can afford to pay for easily but won’t so I do and I’m happy to spend on my kids but even then I count the pennies when they want too much for their hobbies. Before I was working he was controlling but now he can see I have my own money he’s reigned it in abit but I’ll never forgive how he’s treated me so I’m constantly obsessing about money as he withheld it from me and did not let me make any decisions as I wasn’t contributing financially. So I’ve become quite ‘shallow’ and I’m constantly thinking about it! Not what I wanted to become but I have had to learn lessons and realise money is very important in life esp as a woman. Have scrimped and saved (no nice things for myself) and managed to put together £70k but I’ve become so risk averse i don’t know what to do with it, lost a lot of confidence in myself so feel stuck as I want to make this money grow, only thing I can think of is a btl and then do more once I go full time. Have some shares which aren’t increasing in value so might just sell. Anyway sorry for the unnecessary story I’m following this thread with interest!

Wow!

You must be in a high-earning job , though, as you couldn't save £70k on a low wage while having to pay out all that? Can I ask how many years you have managed to accumulate that over and was it just in a savings account?

Your partner is financially abusive but I'm sure you have realised this.

A BLT would usually be a great decision. I bought one a few years ago and it has been an amazing investment. It brings in a really high return because I went for high cashflow rather than capital return (ie bought in a not so good area- but I knew this and balanced the return versus capital appreciation). In a rubbish area the rent you receive is high compared to your costs, whereas in a good area you get less cashflow but in time the value of the house goes up more. I did this because I needed money to get me going. Once I started getting the monthly cash I invested it in the stock market. So let's say I received 15% return on my rental I then invested the return with the hopes of getting 8-10%in equities. So I was making money on the money I made from my rental. And obviously the house goes up in value as well (though not as fast as houses in better areas)

Interest rates have gone up now and the government has made lots of unfavourable changes to the rules for small time landlord so while I was going to try and buy another I have decided against it/put it on hold for now as the numbers are no longer making sense unfortunately

ilyana · 28/07/2023 00:29

Hawkins0001 · 28/07/2023 00:10

The other issue is if your items are flagged as fakes ect which with some times can be tricky eg buying from charity shops and reselling online. Etc

Yeah, I'm a bit worried about that. The sunglasses definitely aren't fakes - I bought them at an international airport for over £100 - but I can't prove it 100%. I wonder if taking them to a physical second-hand store might be better, as they do authenticity checks. I can't wear them anymore as I had to get prescription glasses and can't do contacts, so any money back for them is a win for me!

OP posts:
Hawkins0001 · 28/07/2023 00:29

ilyana · 28/07/2023 00:29

Yeah, I'm a bit worried about that. The sunglasses definitely aren't fakes - I bought them at an international airport for over £100 - but I can't prove it 100%. I wonder if taking them to a physical second-hand store might be better, as they do authenticity checks. I can't wear them anymore as I had to get prescription glasses and can't do contacts, so any money back for them is a win for me!

That's understandable. All the best

PerfectYear321 · 28/07/2023 00:49

I just realised I should explain how I got the BTL.

At the time I was working part time, had just split from my husband, and had no savings. I actually took an employer to tribunal and won so got a payout. The payout was a lot less than I had sued them for so I vowed to myself that I was going to invest it in something that would return me the amount that I had originally sued them for. Tbh if it wasn't for that vow I would have frittered the payout on every day life as a single mum!

It wasn't a huge sum as I'm not down south so up here you can buy houses in not-so-good areas really cheaply, or you could have a few years ago!

PerfectYear321 · 28/07/2023 01:04

PerfectYear321 · 28/07/2023 00:49

I just realised I should explain how I got the BTL.

At the time I was working part time, had just split from my husband, and had no savings. I actually took an employer to tribunal and won so got a payout. The payout was a lot less than I had sued them for so I vowed to myself that I was going to invest it in something that would return me the amount that I had originally sued them for. Tbh if it wasn't for that vow I would have frittered the payout on every day life as a single mum!

It wasn't a huge sum as I'm not down south so up here you can buy houses in not-so-good areas really cheaply, or you could have a few years ago!

People will rightly be sceptical that the payout was modest because of house prices today, but I'm not kidding it was small payout and an amount you wouldn't be able to put down for a BTL today. But context matters and back then as a single mum working part time it was incredible to achieve that. Some might say it's luck but I actually sued the company by myself with no lawyers. It was a four day trial and I cross-examined my bosses myself while they had fancy schmancy lawyers!

SameOldTed · 28/07/2023 01:21

For some frugal lifestyle inspiration, try Frugalwoods or A Purple Life blogs (no connection).

Both have different styles but have some good take-home messages (focus on both saving the pennies AND maximising money from career, etc. As getting own brand jam isn't as big a win as a 25k pay rise or not paying for qualifications you don't need).

They both invest in index trackers/vanguard I think and Frugalwoods has an "idiots guide to investing".

TL:DR version is the stock market isn't a "get rich quick" option but consistently outperforms savings OVER TIME (i think its in chunks of 10 years or so - stick money in and leave it there. Like pensions).

Index trackers "track and represent the overall market" so you're not picking any individual investments.

HeWhoDaresWinsRodney · 28/07/2023 01:34

@PerfectYear321 thanks for your advice and taking the time to write. Yes I am thinking the same now regarding btl from what I’m seeing on the news too. It’s embarrassing but I really don’t know much about the technicalities as I’m still learning how to adult after being kept uneducated about this stuff by my parents. I literally need to do a whole course on this stuff then I can at least educate my own children!

Good question regarding how I saved it, I would say it’s been about 10 years but also included a bursary from when I retrained. He gives me a (small!) allowance also so every little helps, he sounds generous to some people but I had to threaten to leave before he coughed up, otherwise I had to ask for money (this is before I worked but he has not stopped giving me that money as it goes on the kids anyway) he says he’s made allowances in wills etc and is looking at making me secure but there is no way I’m going to trust him again, once bitten and all that. I think he’s probably doing it so I lose my financial ambitions as he knows I’m finding it all very empowering and it’s threatening for him. The current salary I am on is great for part time so I cannot wait to do full time but it’s not secure compared to public sector so I’m going to try and work as much as I can while i am still in the job! Also since my company tupe’d it is clear they have been paying me too much compared this new one so I’m worried they will try to oust me or not let me increase my hours but I could be paranoid. I have been extremely frugal to the point i get decision fatigue over the tiniest purchases, I have no social life or friends so no money spent there so I guess (but I have a lot of take aways!) if you look at my lifestyle it might make more sense how I’ve saved it? I grew up with parents with money I wasn’t spoilt at all but I didn’t worry about not having money so it’s such a u turn from my former self I guess I learned lessons hard and brought me back down to earth! I am also being referred for suspected neurodiversity i hyperfocus which helps in some cases as it makes me very determined. I guess I’m becoming more like him!

ilyana · 28/07/2023 02:33

SameOldTed · 28/07/2023 01:21

For some frugal lifestyle inspiration, try Frugalwoods or A Purple Life blogs (no connection).

Both have different styles but have some good take-home messages (focus on both saving the pennies AND maximising money from career, etc. As getting own brand jam isn't as big a win as a 25k pay rise or not paying for qualifications you don't need).

They both invest in index trackers/vanguard I think and Frugalwoods has an "idiots guide to investing".

TL:DR version is the stock market isn't a "get rich quick" option but consistently outperforms savings OVER TIME (i think its in chunks of 10 years or so - stick money in and leave it there. Like pensions).

Index trackers "track and represent the overall market" so you're not picking any individual investments.

The frugal lifestyle point is interesting because for a long time, I think my obsession with frugal living and counting the pennies (thanks to years of avocado toast type gaslighting) meant I couldn't see the wood for the trees.

I was so focused on living on as little as possible that I wasn't spending enough time thinking about how to increase my income or how to use my time wisely. I would spent 20 hours doing three connecting flights to save £200 rather than spend 7 hours flying direct. I would walk an extra 15 minutes to save a total of about £4 on my weekly shop. Things like that.

Then I did eventually get a big payrise, and I realised how much easier it is to just have more money in the first place! Now I don't think twice about booking direct flights at a time that suits me. I'll still try to find a bargain if I can, be flexible with dates if I can, but it wouldn't occur to me to take a connecting flight unless I absolutely had to. I hope to be in a position one day where I can book business class without worrying too much about the cost, because the comfort and convenience make it worthwhile.

OP posts:
Netaporter · 28/07/2023 05:12

What a great thread, thanks for starting.

Re: the Amex BA card for those asking above. It used to be very good and the companion voucher would match the class being booked. Now it can only be used for your free ticket in economy. You also earn far less points on your spending and have to spend more to get one (from memory was £9k spend now £12k). We are now looking elsewhere for our card spend as we run all household spending through it - grocery shops, the lot. We’ve found avios gives actual value in services you would’ve booked anyway - hotel rooms or short haul flights rather than long haul business class.

To simplify, there are a few elements to the Amex Avios scheme if you want to get free/cheap flights

  1. Companion vouchers - irrelevant how many avios you have in your account, it is achievable through spending. The voucher is a basic 2for1 flight but does not include taxes. You cannot combine the companion voucher with one paid for using Avios, one seat must be paid using £.
  2. Avios spending. You can use Avios to upgrade to the next class, save money on your booking, use to pay for a hotel room or use to purchase flights.

Spending avios for flights, here’s what you need to know:

  1. For the best chance of bagging ‘big ticket’ flights such as NYC business class/Maldives/whatever you need to be ready 365 (might be 360?) days ahead of the date you want to fly as BA release those seats then. Usually 2 per class. You’ll need substantial air miles for these seats (think 180,000 for business class return to the Maldives) You’ll need to pay for the taxes though and these are ££.
  2. The most effective use of avios are the short haul ‘flight savers’ which are also released 365 days ahead but you can still find flight easily for this week (popular destinations such as Marbella in July/August excluded) and can be used on business or economy. Flight savers are all taxes included but you pay a nominal £1. We use these a lot. Usually 9000 avios gets you a return in econ but 18000 will bag you a business class seat which doesn’t have any extra leg room but does come with lounge access, Priority boarding and two checked bags. These are worth having for sure and there are more than 2 per class.
  3. flight upgrades - tend to be 2 per class and booked 365 days in advance. You can only bump up one class and only once per flight (you can’t buy an econ ticket in long haul and bump up to business for example)

Spending avios for a night/couple of nights away can also be a good use of them and you can stay in top hotels providing you have enough.

TalkRoundtheTable · 28/07/2023 06:14

My tips

Live within your means always

Pay into a private pension

Pay into a work based share save scheme

Have some emergency savings

Have a side hustle eg work overtime, work an extra job, sell "stuff", sell a skill, rent out an asset

Use the cash back schemes, the points, the freebies, coupons, yellow stickers, Too Good To Go, Olio

Stooze

Do not put all your eggs into one basket, shop around for the best yearly insurances, savings, holidays

CirreltheSquirrel · 28/07/2023 06:53

I'm starting to think about this a bit more seriously. I'm naturally more of a spender than a saver but rather than just putting stuff away I'm thinking more carefully about whether I'm putting it in the right place. Thankfully what I've done so far has given me a great start!

I'm 45, I have a well paid job and no kids. Two ticks. I live with a partner but we have completely separate finances other than him giving me a monthly contribution to bills etc (it's my house and everything is in my name).

House - I bought it in 2003 with a bit of help from my parents. I repaid them within a few years and am now 2 months away from paying the mortgage off from savings when my fixed rate expires (it's so small that the increase in rates doesn't actually increase the payment much, but it's also at a point where it's not worth paying a fee to remortgage and I'd rather just see it gone). It hasn't had the eye watering increase in value that houses in the south have had, but it's my home and that's only really relevant if I sell which I don't intend to do as it suits me fine.

Pension - I've always paid in but in the last few years bumped my contribution up to 20 and then 25%. A few years I changed job to a job with a worse employers pension contribution so negotiated an equivalent amount to be added to my salary and paid it into a sipp. I moved some old workplace pensions there too so I can manage them (not that I really do, beyond putting them into low cost trackers). I still keep that contribution going on top of the 25%

I also pay into a S&S ISA and LISA. Again these are in low cost trackers.

I've got cash savings for my emergency fund. I used to mainly use regular savers for this, but have started to move my money round a bit more to chase the best rates and put some into cash ISAs.

And finally I'm just dipping my toe into stoozing. This was partly triggered by wanting to take out a 0% purchase card because I need to need some of my cash to clear the mortgage when my fixed deal expires so wanted a bit of access to credit. Then I realised that I could spend on it and put an equivalent into savings and use that for emergencies if needed, rather than just using the credit unused. I need to be disciplined with this and not spend it, but I'm fairly confident that my past spending habits indicate it will be fine.

I kind of feel like I've got the basics and I'm now mainly fine tuning and working out how many more years I need to do this before I can retire and spend it 😀

Wallywobbles · 28/07/2023 06:54

I have one kid that I've always talked to about money, tax, investment. I have a good dividend income on top of a decent salary. Both kids do too. But it goes into savings they can't access until 25.

Last year they had an investment opportunity and I left it up to them the amount of their savings they wanted to invest. One put in twice as much as the other.

The one that's interested in money is 17 now. Earns a fair bit buying &selling through vinted. Now working as a waitress this holidays.

When I had my own company she was 7 and worked 4 hours a week and had very good pocket money as a result.

My kids have had bank accounts with their own clothes & spending allowance in since the age of 10. How they choose to spend it is interesting.

The eldest is at uni. Does budget, food plans etc. Should have enough savings to cover her final year at uni. She's risk adverse so would prefer to have less debt.

It takes having a bit of money to understand what you can do with it.

I've always bought property (not Uk) and have 4 mortgages that will end in under 3 years DH has 1. This will free up over 40k a year. And provide an income instead of outgoing.

I'll be 55 then and unlikely to buy more. I could retire then, but DH wants to get his full pension which will be another 6 years on top.

Netaporter · 28/07/2023 07:07

Without sounding morbid, there are also matters to consider regarding wealth and incapacitation or unexpected illness/death. Whilst attending to affairs it is really important and prudent to pay attention to POA for both health/welfare and property/finance and Wills. Having family/shared wealth/investments/assets in sole names without a POA in place leaves you/loved ones in a precarious financial position in the event of an unexpected turn of events. Similarly if you have recently separated or divorced, make sure your wills/death in service beneficiaries/pension beneficiaries are up to date.

WhatdidIdoyesterday · 28/07/2023 07:09

Great ideas on this thread.

Does anyone have a pensions calculator which shows how much you should be saving per month based on age and retirement income? I have a pension which I started 15 years ago but I'm worried its not that big. I don't have much disposable income due to childcare costs but once all DC are in school I need to work out whether to increase my pension or invest that money elsewhere. Childcare currently costs me £2k per month so its a huge outgoing at the moment.

BarbaraofSeville · 28/07/2023 07:20

grosslyunfair · 27/07/2023 17:45

I think having clear goals is important, because saving will involve choices so it helps to know what you are doing it for! Also a long term mindset- my view is that buying assets and leaving them alone to grow is pretty effective! Know what you need- so money you need in the short term shouldn't be in long term investments. And thinking about what you need. I have no dependants and have downsized to be mortgage free and have more cash now so I save more. Tracking spending to be sure that what you spend on things matches what you value. I'm not anti spending but I shop in Lidl and buy fairly cheap clothes so I can have nice holidays without blowing the budget!

For investment, I'm in the industry and I'd advise buying cheap products- most fund and wealth managers make obscene profits! Index or passive funds invest across a wide spread of investments for low costs. Also accepting that things go up and down through time- many investors (amateur and professional) panic and sell when prices drop and miss any rebound. Also if buying shares directly don't over trade- buying and selling too much, especially at small volumes, means transaction costs could eat your profits.

Property can be good but have a decent float in case tenants let you down or big repairs need to happen.

Sorry - stream of conciousness alert:

A lot of good advice here. Never underestimate the impact of lots of small spending that really adds up and could be cut down/out without a huge impact on your lifestyle.

Food and drink out of the house/takeaways is a biggy. People can spend hundreds of pounds a month on these, which is thousands of pounds a year or tens of thousands of pounds a decade. So try to avoid it where you can. If you don't want to cook, look for cheaper equivalents in supermarkets, some are perfectly decent.

Likewise clothes, and bits for the house. Apparently there are people who buy new Christmas decorations every year, or are always getting new cushions, bedding etc when they already have what they need. If you don't need it, save the money instead - better for the planet too. Aim to be a 'low consumer' of stuff.

Putting aside the people who don't have enough money to afford the basics, and those who will never run out of money, most of us are in the middle, where a lot of our financial comfort is down to decisions we make about spending and doing this wisely by not spending where possible, and if we decide to do so, making sure we get the best price, is the main factor in how far our money goes and how much we have left to generate wealth after the money we've spent.

Cars are another one. Think of the difference in cost between running a small, lower spec, basic branded, efficient car vs a larger, prestige brand, more thirsty, higher spec version. Yes, the latter is more comfortable, but they both get you from A to B but a more basic car is hundreds of pounds a month cheaper.

Then there's hair/beauty treatments etc - something else that could be costing tens/hundreds of pounds a month that's slowing down becoming wealthy.

There's a lot of luck/right place/right time at play too. Anyone who's got in and out of a buoyant property market at the right time could have a massive six figure boost to their wealth that's simply not been available to many, no matter how hard working/enterprising etc they've been. So always be mindful of comparing yourself to others who may have had different opportunities to you.

If you're a single parent without qualifications working multiple jobs to try and make ends meet, you're less likely to be able to retrain into a highly paid career or make money in property, but there are things you can do to improve your situation that might pay off later, eg have egg on toast (or whatever cheap low effort meal you enjoy) instead of a takeaway, make sure you pay as little as possible for things like mobile phones, etc etc.

Don't be a brand snob, it's very expensive. Is your preferred brand really worth the extra money. In Eat Well for Less, in just about all cases, when they did blind tests, the participants couldn't pick out 'their' brand, that they had confidently declared was the only one they could possibly eat and often preferred a cheaper one.

Loads of ways to reduce your spend by a few quid, that if you make a habit of it, can free up hundreds, or even £1k+ of pounds a month for other things or to add to your aim of being wealthy as you can only spend each pound once.

If you're a spender, you might see the above as 'miserable' or 'what's the point' but if that's you, you'll have to accept that, unless you already have a lot of money, you'll probably never be comfortable/wealthy because you're always spending and you'll never run out of things to spend your money on, so your money will probably never exceed your desire for 'stuff' unless you change your mindset. I don't know if this is possible, because I genuinely don't want much stuff. I buy what I want, and it just happens that what I want isn't very much.

Someone upthread mentioned Stoozing - I've done this for about 15 years now, not particularly enthusiastically, but now that interest rates have risen again, I'm making a few hundred pounds a year. Related to this for anyone who has a low rate fixed mortgage DO NOT RUSH TO PAY IT OFF. Put the money in savings instead and pay it down only when your mortgage rate exceeds your savings rate. When we had a mortgage, it was effectively interest free and at some times actually made a profit because the rate was between 0.5 and 1% and we were getting 3-5% in various regular savers and current accounts.

Defintely use a cashback (or cashback-like - eg rewards for a shop you use anyway) credit card for all your day to day spending (paid off in full every month). Avios ones might be more beneficial if you actually would use the flights that you can use the points for and they're available when you want them.

But this is something I've never bothered with because we tend to fly from northern England to Europe and the choice for these routes is very limited and mostly non existent. Then it sounds faffy to find the flights at the right time - it will probably be different if you travel long haul from London airports and plan far enough ahead that the right flights for points are available. But we rarely book anything more than about 3 months ahead and often it could literally be more like 3 weeks - benefits of travelling outside peak times and being flexible about where we go.

Surprisingly, I can't see any mention of compound interest on this thread, definitely something to make sure you understand and appreciate how it can benefit you. Likewise investment growth over time and the importance of picking funds that charge lower fees, because the effect of higher fees over time can be significant. Behind all those higher fees are often a lot of highly paid people who's salaries are being paid out of your money.

Other things to add - the financial flowchart is excellent as a 'to do' list for your path to wealth:

https://ukpersonal.finance/flowchart/

Plus the Meaningful Money podcast, the current series of which is discussing the above in detail, so a good place to start.

https://meaningfulmoney.tv/

I'll shut up now - hope it helps the thread.

The Flowchart - UKPersonalFinance Wiki

A starting point for your financial planning journey in 8 steps, from the wiki for Reddit's /r/ukpersonalfinance!

https://ukpersonal.finance/flowchart

BarbaraofSeville · 28/07/2023 07:22

A lot of that could have been covered by 'look after the pennies and the pounds will look after themselves' it really does make a difference.

Legselevens · 28/07/2023 07:36

Are premium bonds worth it?

RegentCafe · 28/07/2023 07:39

BTL becomes very challenging the higher your tax rate becomes. Your personal tax rate also impacts on what they will will lend for BTL and so higher deposits can be required

BarbaraofSeville · 28/07/2023 07:55

Legselevens · 28/07/2023 07:36

Are premium bonds worth it?

They can be a legitimate place to store your emergency cash if you have around £5-10k+ and don't need to touch it for a few months, because the money you put in doesn't go into the first draw, so you have a month where you cannot get a return, so not good for dipping in and out of, but if you put it in and leave it there, the effect of the first month is minimised.

The pay out rate is currently around 3% I believe, based on average luck, you should average this sort of return over time unless your holding is small, hence being better if you have a few £k upwards.

So not as good as the best paying instant access accounts but almost certainly better than the money languishing somewhere paying 0.1% or similar. You're basically gambling the interest you will definitely receive in a savings account for the chance of a higher return

The prizes are tax free, so their worth is increased if you're a higher rate tax payer and/or you've used up your ISA allowance.

Parsley1234 · 28/07/2023 08:02

I run a clearance and declutter business I buy and sell anything l. I started buying bundles of clothes from the rag mill called cream then I advertised for full bags of clothes for £10 so people dropped them to my house and got the cash. Then I boot sale them or if good sell on eBay etc.My neighbours had a new kitchen put out the old to be collected for landfill I sold the white goods for £500 other neighbour had a skip I made £120 out of taking items out and reselling them. I sell everything I never throw anything away if it doesn’t sell I give it away someone will always want what you have at the right price. At a boot sale I go to from 9am the house clearance chaps will give away items as they want a clear van people make a good living from that my friend bought a sideboard for £50 last time it was sold similar it reached £3000 you just have to open your eyes there’s money to be made. I put my son through public school through this mindset

burnoutbabe · 28/07/2023 08:04

I need to look into stopping again

But only if you can transfer money out fee free. Not sure they do that anymore.

Airline flights -with the money on taxes and the amount you need to spend on items to get the points, I don't think they are worth it for me. I do have virgin miles so I could upgrade at sone point but the taxes generally are more than I'd think an upgrade "worth it" (

I tend to spend that extra money on a nicer hotel for the rest of the holiday -had too many idiots on flights making it rubbish for all around them or crying babies - so I could spend extra and not enjoy it anyway)