For anyone wondering why lone parents had children with their no-good exes to begin with:

[HerBeatitudeLittleBella]

I can't speak for everyone else, but I had children with my ex because I genuinely had no idea what a loving, normal, functional relationship was, never having experienced one. I didn't know how normal people behaved in relationships; and so when I met someone who behaved with extreme abnormality, it felt familiar to me and for a long time, I didn't recognise that it was abnormal.

It was only as a result of having children, that I began to question my own upbringing. Which led me out of denial and made me realise that my own relationship was abnormal and that my XP and I were unwittingly repeating damaging family patterns and role-modelling a crap relationship to our child. And that if I couldn't change it (which I couldn't, because my XP refused to recognise that we were not conducting an emotionally healthy relationship), then I had to leave it, in order to give my children the best possible chance of not experiencing the same disadvantage in adult relationships that I had laboured under.

OK? Will that do you? Is your curiosity satsified now? Or would you like some other LP's to come on and justify to you why they had children with their exes? And when you want to moan about your partner, please bear in mind that no-one is going to ask you to account for why you have had children with him, if he's such a PITA.

[HerBeatitudeLittleBella]

Oh and by the way, chances are that if I hadn't had children with my XP, I would still be with him now, conducting a dysfunctional and slightly mad relationship, because it was having children and being responsible for them, which was what led me to wise up.

[harpomarx]

did someone say something, herbeatitude?

(lone parent here who has never been asked to justify why she had children with her ex)

[HerBeatitudeLittleBella]

Oh yes....



On the "what don't you dare to say on mumsnet" thread.

[HerBeatitudeLittleBella]

So I thought I'd let 'em know. Seeing as how they're so bloody interested an' all.

[harpomarx]

oh... will pop in and have a look

[GettingaGrip]

Agree, agree agree!!!!

Also to the poster who said that she wanted to post

'stop telling women they are being abused and filling their heads with rubbish'

or some such....it took me two children and 50 years of life to realise I was being abused, so good was the training/brainwashing done by my parents and exH.

I wish I had had mumsnet or someone, anyone, to tell me I was being abused all those years ago,and I wouldn't be in the mess I am in now.

I had to work it out for myself. Bit by painful bit.

Helping others to escape that Hell on earth is a privilege and a duty. If not for the women involved, then to save their children from perpetuating the terrible cycle.

[Nighbynight]

Agree, many people fall into abusive relationships because they have never known anything else, or just to escape from previous bad situation.

Just another case of people who are LUCKY and IGNORANT congratulating themselves on being SMART.

[mankymummy]

and of course some blokes turn loopy when someone who is more important than their selfish selves (ie dc's) come along...

[HerBeatitudeLittleBella]

LOL Stewie, I did think of posting the usual "fuck off" commment, but then I thought, actually there are a lot of other more sensitive, diplomatic people out there who guiltily feel the same thing but would never be so crass as to voice it. So this attempt at an explanation is mainly for them - the self-righteous thickos won't take any notice anyway.

And yes, I so agree with you Gettingagrip re that one. We live in a society which undermines and minimises the abuse of women - we don't need to worry about filling their pretty little heads with rubbish about abuse, if they are not being, then they will know that, it's when they are that they tend not to recognise it. Why are people so annoyed by having the possibility of abuse mooted? It's an interesting reaction.

[piratecat]

i think most of us have gone into our relationships, marriages with hope and love for the future.

It is not our fault when a partner, husband, wife goes totally mentla, and leaves, and changes.

sad.

[N1]

I didn't know what a real relationship was either. I went out with a girl (who I married). During the time that she and I went out, most of my friends took a step back and I chose the girl over them because I thought it was the right thing to do.

We went out of over a year and I wanted to make changes to my life which ( then girlfriend) wanted to be a part of, but to keep things working, we had to get married.

After a year of being married and all the life changes applied, the marriage was "on the rocks".

I was married to a person who dictated details about who I could talk to and about what. I was told not to visit any fun places with my son because his mother would feel "left out". This being while she was at work.

Me being the idiot that I was, chose to try to keep things working as best I could, so I worked around what the (then) wife wanted. I managed to keep things together for about 2 years. During the 2 years, I was accused of having affairs, seeing other women, going to fun places with out my son's mother, blamed for spending money that (then) wife felt she should have....etc.

Ex left under false pretences.....etc.

Why did I have a child with her..... well during the "going out" time, she didn't fall pregnant, we were just more careful. After we got married, she asked if she should use contraception. I felt that if she wasn't going to get pregnant so quick, that we didn't need to change anything. 2 months later she was pregnant. I felt that we could deal with a child at the time, even though we weren't as stable as we should be.

Meeting my ex is one of the worsted mistakes I ever made.

I got a few good things from my ex though. I got my son, which is one of the best things I ever got. I got to learn about which sort of woman to avoid and thanks to my ex trying to cut me out my son's life, I got forced into learning about how courts work, how to argue in court and how to present a case history.

I personally would rather have done without the court skills because it changes a person's way of thinking. I would have rather been happily married (with one woman and have 6 children) and not known anything about the twisted ways that family courts operate.

The last 8 years have been a steep learning curve for me and I am very unlikely to make the same mistake again. If I did make another mistake, I would deal with things very differently.

[doggiesayswoof]

Didn't see that thread. Sounds like a daft idea - surely just an invitation to wind people up?

I'm sorry this has made OP and others feel the need to justify themselves like this

[ginnny]

I don't see why anyone should have to justify themselves to a group of strangers on an internet forum like this. I'm a single parent (have a dp but don't live together and he's not my dc's father) and am proud to be one. OK it wasn't my choice as xp had affair and left us but I could never have predicted that or I wouldn't have had dc with him.
I think that thread was started off as a light hearted tongue-in-cheek thing, but it turned bitchy.
I can see why it got your back up Herbeatitude but remember the people that matter are the ones who understand what you have been through and nobody has the perfect relationship, no matter how smug they are they all have their own problems so its very unfair of them to judge others.

[solidgoldsoddingjanuaryagain]

Well, he wasn't my Partner at the time, just a drinking mate. And we were not careful with contraception (mainly because I thought I was in the non-fertile week and, at 39 with a history of minor gyno problems anyway, that it wasn't likely to happen).
Now we have a DS and a happy, functional, co-parent relationship. But there are as many reasons as there are people, for how differnt lives turned out, and people who reckon that everyone should be Just Like Them are utter mundanes and to be laughed at, not wounded by.

[N1]

I didn't feel the need to justify myself. I felt I was contributing to a topic.

Is there another topic that I should be reading?

[VinegarTits]

Similar to SBG here, he wasnt my partner at the time he was a friend who i got a little more than friendly with and we were not as careful as we should have been.

I dont go around moaning about how hard done by i was either, your life is what you make it, you cant blame others for your unhappiness and i ignore the fools who think there way is the right way

[12StoneNeedsToBe10]

I had DS with ex-P after a few years of a shit relationship, leaving him, then getting back together. Everything was bloody wonderful u pto when DS was about 2, then ex-P reverted to his old dominant ways (he wasn't physically abusive but would try and tell me how to be IYSWIM all the time).
I left and was a lone parent for nearly 2 years. I'm not any more and have a fabulous DP now and couldn't be happier.
So the reason I had DS with ex-P was simply that I thought the bad times were over and we could be happier. How wrong was I

[GettingaGrip]

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/_chat/693977-What-stuff-are-you-too-polite-to-say-on-mumsnet

[HerBeatitudeLittleBella]

Oh it's not a justification. It's just an attempt at a genuine explanation for those who are so intellectually/ emotionally limited, that they can't imagine why anyone would have had children with someone they don't live with, or that they might complain about occasionally.

And as I said in the first post, nobody says to someone who is posting about how annoying their DH is being "well why did you have children with him then?" On one level, it's just as unreasonable to ask the question of LP's, but otoh it is a question which seems to come up with such boring regularity, that I decided to answer it for once!

[N1]

Gosh. I read the last few entries of the link that Gettingagrip posted, thanks for that. Sounds like a personal snipe at various people.

Hopefully my reply was considered as "genuine explanation".

[TheFirstLiffey]

N1, are you still bleating? Get help love.

Your x didn't leave 'under false pretences'. She wasn't your 'chattel'. She was entitled to leave you.

[N1]

RealityIsMyOnlyDelusion. It's probably not the done thing. I don't hate all women. I don't think I am a control freak and I am unlikely to get help for something I don't think I need.

Would you not be better off agreeing to disagree on the one confrontational issue?