God, I feel like shit...have just completely lost it with XP and DD [sad]

[TequilaMockinBird]

I'm not really looking for any responses to this, just need to get it down I think.

For those who have read my previous posts, I split with XP because of his controlling behaviour and abuse. I still see him and am civil to him because of DD (10).

Anyway, XP has DD usually one night a week. As he works shifts, he can't have her until he finishes at 9pm and even then will only have her if I drive all the way into town with her, pick him up and drop them both at his. I then have to go back at 8.15 the next morning to pick her up and drop her at CM's.

I really object to doing this but if I didnt do it then he wouldnt see DD at all and she would be heartbroken. He does get 2 full days off a week but won't have her on these days because he has 'other things to do' .

So tonight DD was getting ready to go and she came from the kitchen with a carrier bag full of food. I asked what was in the bag and she showed me - orange juice, crisps, bread, butter and a tin of chicken soup. Now, she usually has to take snacks with her when she goes to XP's because he 'cant afford' to buy her any . Again, I object to her taking this but if she didnt then she wouldnt get fed so I just turn a blind eye.

I'd had a really bad day today at work anyway and was really tired after being up most of the night with toothache. I asked her why she needed to take all those things to dads and she replied saying that he had asked her to take something that he could have for his supper as he couldn't afford any food because he'd had to give me all of his money

Now he pays me 12 measly quid a week in maintenance, he lives in shared accommodation and pays a total of £50 a week to live there (which includes all of his bills, council tax etc.). He also works full time - 5 days out of 7 - and can afford to go out 3 or 4 nights a week after work and also to the casino gambling on a weekend.

Anyway, we drove to pick him up and when he got in the car he asked what DD had brought him to eat. I managed to bite my tongue whilst she reeled off the contents of the carrier bag and he responded with 'fuckin chicken soup? I've had nothing to eat all day, what the fuck is chicken soup going to do'

After that reaction I had to say something and so told him (calmly) that it wasnt mine nor DD's responsibility to ensure that he was fed and that he should maybe budget his money a bit better to ensure he has enough for food.

This obviously didnt go down very well and again he said that it's because he has to pay all the spare money he has to me. DD then started saying 'yeah mum if you didnt take all dads money off him then he could afford to eat and wouldnt be making himself ill' . I ignored this, mainly because I couldnt think of anything nice to reply with and also because I was so upset that DD had 'taken his side' so to speak, again.

I never say anything bad about him infront of DD because I know that one day she'll realise what he's like anyway but it really upsets me that she thinks the sun shines out of his arse and that I'm always the bad bugger .

He never pays for anything for her other than the £12 maintenance I get a week. I pay for everything. He won't even pay half for school trips because that's my responsibility apparently. During the summer holidays, DD was with CM full time. I took 2 weeks holiday so that I could spend some time with her as I felt guilty about her being with CM the whole time, and he had her for one day. Now bearing in mind he gets 2 days off a week and also has paid holiday which he could've taken, I think he could've made more of an effort!

Anyway, going back to the car conversation, the pair of them carried on chatting while I was driving with tears in my eyes. The conversation changed to DD's birthday and she was talking about the dolls house she wants. I'd already told her that she wouldn't be able to have it because it's far too expensive (£300!) so I mentioned this again to her and told her not to get her hopes up as it was a lot of money etc. He responded with 'you see how nasty your mum is, she wont even buy you what you want for your birthday even though i've given her more than enough money to pay for it'. DD then started saying 'is that true mum, if dad's paid for it then i should get it' etc. etc. and I'm ashamed to say that I just completely lost it

I pulled up outside his house, told him that he needed to get a proper house, she could move in with him and he could then see what it's like to be a single parent . I now feel like shit, DD heard what I said and I know it's not her fault that he can manipulate her and that she thinks he's wonderful. She now must think that I don't want her and that I want her to go and live with him (which I really don't)

Thanks if you've got this far, like I said I'm not looking for any replies really just needed to get it down. This has now been going on for months and I'm just really fed up with it. I guess he's still controlling me now but I don't know how to stop it without it affecting DD seeing him.

please get some legal advice if you think you are at risk from him tmb...

controlfreakinfreaky - tbh I dont think he would actually do anything to me now because he knows that I would go straight to the police. But that doesn't stop the fear on my part. I realise that probably sounds stupid but I cant really explain it

Please Please please. Start telling Your daughter the truth about her father. My mum did the same thing as she would never bad mouth any one i thought the sun shined out of my dads a... I then started to see things in my teans and then in my twenties i woke up and saw really what my dad was like. Now i am in my thirties i am a really screwed up person. My dad was also controlling. And guess what i have stupidly had 2 children with a controling man. COntrtolling and verbal abuse f...s you up, especially in the future.

Sorry i did not have time to read any of the comments to you initial message. But i hope you think about what she is experiencing now will effect her in 20 or 30 years time.

I am also a lot angreer with things as i get older too.

i dont think that's stupid at all.... but i do think you need to model strong and sensible behaviour for your dd.... easy for me to say i know.... wishing you strength!

Nothing of any use to add, just wanted to say that I think you are doing a great job of holding it together in very difficult circumstances.

You are not unreasonable, and although with hindsight you would have dealt with the situation differently(ie blowing up in earshot of your dd), I bet I would have reacted the same way.

Agree with other posters that a bit of honesty with your dd is called for, she is old enough to be told the truth about this situation.

He sounds like an absolute wanker.

I am going to start being more truthful with her, I guess before I started this thread, I still thought she was too young to understand.

Reading all your posts however, has made me realise that she's not and although she doesn't need to know everything, there are some things that I will tell her. Hopefully, from these she will then realise herself what he is like without me actually telling her IYSWIM.

What others have said. No more lifts. No more food. He can collect her from yours at a reasonable venue and time, which means on his days off - 9/10pm is not okay for a 10 year old, or any child on a school night, IMVHO.

I do nothing for my exh anymore.

He pays £17 a week, based on his lies and deceit.
DD1 and DD2 both seen the CSA letters and bank stats

And taking food?

How easy is this mans life? He needs seriously kicking to the curb. Show your daughter the truth. My DDs both know now, how much exh is ripping me off with his exotic holidays and fast cars, sushi and nice wines.
Hasn't affected contact in the least, but it has changed their opinion ever so slightly
Oh, and he's picking her up too late too. Especially on a school night. The one thing I am vehemently strict on is school nights.

Sorry to barge in but I have a question: is it actually legal, I mean is there nothing you can do about him seeing her under the conditions he's living:

• no proper house, just a bedsit shared with other people who may or may not behave appropritately with a 10 yr old girl around

• not enough food that's why your DD brings some so she won't go hungry while there

• you facilitate all contact (petrol, car, etc), he doesn't ever pick her up

• he's a 'programmer' and has in good parental alienation style started to brainwash your DD (causing her psychological harm)

I'm truly sorry you are in this situation.

Oh, wanted to say I don't think it's fair to involve your 10 yr old DD in 'adult' disputes and worry her about money but I agree that the 'programming' has to stop.

I havenothing useful to add, so I'll leave that to these wise and experienced ladies, but don't beat yourself up. The way you're being treated is disgusting. You're doing the best you can for your DD, and getting nothing but shit back
Praying that you find the strength to deal with this and get through! (He sounds a total arse btw)

You sound like a saint!
I agree you have to be more honest with your dd, but still in a gentle, protective way...just no more lies. I mean she'll be a teen soon enough and more aware of what a dad should be doing...better that she slowly realise in a protected and supported way what a * her dad is, than have to go through multiple shocking disappointmenets and let downs in a couple of years by a dad who she's been programmed to idolise...you know your daughter best and you know what she can cope with and understand now...good luck.

Oh and meant to say...please stop the limo service...maybe you can come up with some reason why you can't drop her off (something out of your control)...that way you cant be blamed for refusing to let her see dad, you're happy for her to go, you've just got a prob that stops you dropping her off...let him do it himself, or explain why he can't.
Oh and if the poor man is just too tired (hungry, drained!) to do it after work (i have a violin here somewhere)...kindly offer to rearrange your schedule so HE can pick her up during his days off...that way they'll get more time together...seems like a very reasonable suggestion on your part, let him explain why its not so reasonable to him.

This thread has really made me think!

When I was growing up my mum had a shite life. She went without food so my dad, me and my brother had enough. She never, ever had new clothes - always hand me downs. She also used to shield me and my brother from any harsh truths - her favourite saying was 'you will have worries soon enough, I want you to enjoy your childhood.' My parents were wonderful and still are BUT my mum kept stuff from us.

Now (I am almost 52) I go without food if money is tight, I hate buying myself clothes, shoes, make up etc. I put myself last in the pecking order and do everything for my family. IT IS NOT A GOOD THING.

Your DD is not much younger than my DS and she can understand. Show her exactly how much you have coming in and going out - I did this with my DS and he was gobsmacked. Now, as a family, our theory is 'If we have money we share it out and if we dont have money it is up to all of us to try and do something about it.'

I know this is easy for me to say but dont be frightened of him - good luck - you have come this far.

I can't believe that you are facilitating all this. As soon as he got in the car and started swearing, he'd have been out, in my book.

You say you don't want to affect your dd's relationship with her dad, but you are facilitating his destruction of her relationship with you. Just stop it.

Work out how much the petrol costs to pick him up and take them home. Add up the cost of the food she takes with her. I bet it comes to more than £12. Do all the sums re outgoings, etc.

Sit her down and show her exactly where the money goes and where it comes from. Tell exp that, in future, he has to have dd on one of his days off (how much quality time can he spend with her if they don't even get home until gone 9pm) and tell dd that he gets two days off per week and is quite capable of seeing her on one of those days when he will be able to spend more quality time with her. If dd thinks you are being unreasonable to stop the current arrangment - which he will tell her you are - just point out that petrol has gone up massively recently, along with the cost of lots of other things, and you just can't afford it.

He is only controlling the pair of you because you are letting him. Your dd deserves to know the truth because otherwise she will grow up thinking that this is normal - and it isn't.

you carrying the fucking relationship.
I am so annoyed at you not either of them when reading this post.

do you think you have a need to continue to be a martyr? serious question.

if he cant be fucked picking her up - thats his business

running round after him like a fucking mug = quit it right now.

tell dd the truth.

Forgot my main point!!! Unless you tell your DD without verbally ripping her dad apart - she will think this is normal in a relationship and will go for a controlling man as she gets older.

I think you owe it to her to show how strong a woman can be and how hard you work and do your best so she can have a good life.

Good luck x

I agree with the rest who say that she's old enough to understand the basics of money coming in/going out.

My DS1 will be 8 next week and although his maths still isn't that great and he's still struggling with the value of things I told him (straight out) that the amount of money we spent on doing "fun" things on holiday earlier in the holidays was less than what I spent on their school uniforms (I was explaining to him why we wouldn't be having so many "treats" this month)

You do need to take control of the situation.

Tequila stop being a taxi service, if your ex don't see your daughter then she can see that it is because he isn't making an effort, and even if she did stop seeing him would it be a bad thing ? he is emotionally controlling her and you at the same time, and you are paying for it by petrol and food !!

You need to start being honest with your daughter and make her aware of the value of money, maybe you can take her food shopping and spend £12 only, buy nothing but basics and let her only eat that until there is nothing left, when she hasn't had any treats or nice food then she will see that his measly pittance don't go far, you need to start being cruel to be kind if you don't then you daughter will end up being a mirror image of your ex.

How is your daughter, I would say 9 years plus ?

Tequila...
My DP is divorced he has a 5yo DD from that relationship.
DP worships his DD, seriously he would walk over hot coals for her.
He does everything for her. We even rented a very child friendly large house within a mile of his ex so he is near his DD. She has a beautiful bedroom here. Her wardrobe is overflowing with beautiful clothes. He takes her swimming and tennis lessons. He takes her to the hairdressers. He cuts her nails, bathes her, reads for her, cooks for her. He takes time to help with her schooling, shes already year ahead. He worries constantly about her. This morning he told me he was feeling tearful last night because he misses her (he only dropped at school yesterday morning) In short he's a wonderful dad.
Your ex however sounds a right shit. Im really aghast at his terrible behaviour. It is up to him to pick up your DD, it is up to him to provide everything she needs while she is with him. It is emotional abuse of your DD to say bad things about you. Its totally inappropriate to get your DD to scavenge for him. Come to the its inappropriate to have DD going to his so late midweek, really she should with when hes bloody well off for one of those two days. He needs to pull his finger out and he will only start thinking of doing that if you do not act like a doormat.
Yes children absolutely imo need to have a good significant relationship with both parents post separation but how that is arranged needs to be mutually agreed by both parties with the welfare of the child/ren paramount.

I also agree that you have had the patience of a saint to put up with this.

Your DD is definitely old enough to do the maths. Make no comment about whether he should or could be paying more but stick to the numbers on the page.

Just as a matter of interest I would want to ask your DD how much she thinks he is paying first. I think this would give an indication of the level of his maninpulation and lies for you and also it would make her think about her own assumptions.

Don't make any comment other than to say 'well actually it is this amount'.

She will eventually work it out for herself though.

Don't worry about protecting your XP's relationship with your daughter. That is up to him. If he doesn't care enough to see her without you doing all the running around for him then maybe your daughter is better off knowing that in the long run rather than living in a fantasy world where Daddy is the hard done by one and Mummy is the horrible one. You deserve better and so does your DD tbh.

Good luck

Sorry, I've only just got back online after a problem with my laptop.

DD and I went through my bank statement last night. I asked her to highlight all the credits in one colour and all the debits in the other.

She then added all the debits up and I told her that this is how much I pay out every month in order that we can live. I told her what each debit was for and why we needed to pay it - council tax etc.

She was very at how much I have to pay out and I did point out her Dad's contribution without making any other comment on it IYKWIM.

I haven't really mentioned any of this since last night but I know that she will have worked out in her head that Dad could pay more as when she saw the line with my wages on she asked if that was how much Dad gets. I explained that Dad gets a little bit more than I get and I could just about hear the cogs working!

So thank you to those of you who suggested it, I already feel much better for her getting an insight. Although I was also quite at how much I pay out compared to how much I have coming in . I guess I have learned a lesson myself there aswell!

I now need to work on his controlling of me, which I will do. I realise it will take strength and time but I am determined to do it. Even if it means that DD doesn't see him anymore.

If its any consolation I think we all do a certain extent of faffing around to keep the exes seeing the kids.
Glad you got it sorted with dd

I hope it goes well, come back when you need some moral support.

Next your dd to work out how much her lunches costs and realise that's all her dad pays for!

sounds like a good start tm!