Ex is asking for child maintenance, where do I stand?

[MrRyan88]

My ex and I have been separated for over 5 years and I have had my daughter age 6 religiously from Thursday to Saturday night every week for the past 5 years. I also take her on holidays and weekend trips every couple of months so have her for longer periods of time occasionally.

I used to send my ex money every week via bank transfer, then I stopped. Not because I am a bad dad, instead I offered to pay for school trips, after school clubs and out of school activities.. split between us.
I stopped sending her money because all I see day in day out is pictures of my daughter at the pub with her mum, pictures of her mum drunk whilst my daughter is in her care, I did warn my ex that this would happen.

I buy everything my daughter needs, she has a separate school uniform for when she's with me, I put a car on the road so my mum could take my daughter to school the car isn't used for anything else because I have a company van.

I have never asked for her mother to send anything to mine with my daughter as I provide everything she need's for every day she is with me and for any trips away abroad or in the UK.

Now my ex is asking for contributions to her winter wardrobe at home and I don't feel this is right as she gets child tax credit and child benefit for my daughter and doesn't provide anything for the 3 days my daughter is with me. She doesn't work, is on benefits and has another child whose father isn't around.

Just wanted to see what other people's view on this was as I believe I contribute in any way I can and have made it as fair as I can in the way of splitting child costs.

[TheGruffaloMother]

Not quite I don't think apple. He says Thursday night to Saturday night which in CMS terms is 2 nights a week as he doesn't keep her until the Sunday morning. If he's confident that he could manage having residency though, taking that extra night on the Saturday would be a good idea. It makes little difference to the DC as it's just where they sleep but could quell a bit of the resentment by bringing the CMS award down.

[sophie1985]

I suspect a lot of these bitter replies are born out of angry resentment and experience of men you might remind them of. Borderline irrational contempt for the OP who has simply asked for advice.

Mumsnet living up to it's as-seen-by-men reputation. Shame.

[Babasaclover]

You lot are savage. Give the guy a break! The mother should get a job then the Chad would have a better life all round and real role models.

If she was that hard up she wouldn't be in the pub and having nails done etc. These are luxuries not essentials that he should be paying for. I certainly can't afford them even with both full time wages in the house

Big would hate to be a dad on here!

[Shockedbyfolk]

Jesus.... reverse the roles here.... please use your imagination....

Child Maintenance is not the only money the resident parent has to rely on... they get CB, WTC, CTC on top... so here is my question to most of the 'mothers' who have been nasty...

imagine your children living with their father, who gets CB, WTC and CTC as well as any additional income they have earned (or benefits) and then think of the money you earn (or could earn if you got a part-time/full-time job) then deduct your rent, bills (current rent and bills), food, transport to/from work and the items you need for your child when they are with you.... how much would that leave you with to live on??.... then consider the child maintenance you would be expected to pay (obviously you would need to use the CMS calculator for this)....

how would you survive with NO help from anyone, only the wages you earn (or the benefits you get).

My ex and I came to an agreement (that was much less than the CSA specified) because he really couldn't afford it... our daughter has never gone without anything and he is an amazing Dad...

[TimetohittheroadJack]

My ex would probably tell a similar story. I too go to the pub when my kids are with him. I might even post photos of myself on Facebook (shock horror) enjoying myself. I even have the audacity to occasionally get my hair and nails done, and even buy myself new clothes. And to top it all off, I have been on holiday without my children. And because of all this extravagant spending I enjoy, my ex thinks it's ok to not pay anything.

[TimetohittheroadJack]

In answer to shockedbyfolk If you are the NRP and can't afford your rent /bills and maintainence maybe you should be looking for another job/training to get a better paid job. O

[Shockedbyfolk]

If it's as easy as that TimetohittheroadJack ... then what about the mother getting a job??... I'm sure that would give her daughter a better standard of living and a lot less hassle, it was allow encourage her daughter to grow up believing that both parents work for a living instead of Mum living on benefits... much better role model.... oh wait... it's the father that's the good role model here...... hmmm next deadbeat dad bashing comment?!?!

honestly some mothers make me ashamed to be a female...

[AyeAmarok]

I don't get how people "can't afford maintenance", when it's, what, 15% of your earnings? Which is tiny.

You then have to cut your cloth accordingly after maintenence is paid. So where you can afford to rent, your bills, what car(s) you can afford, what food you eat, what fun things you do with your new girlfriend like weekends away and going out for dinner or takeaways, all needs to be considered relative to what you earn AFTER your contribution is made to the child.

[Shockedbyfolk]

AyeAmorak.... my ex and I sat down and discussed what he could reasonably afford and while I agree 15% of anyone salary doesn't seem much to look after a child, when we looked at his income and deducted his rent, council tax, gas and electricity bills, petrol to and from work and then food.... he was left with around £300 per month... his private rent is a lot and it's because he chose an area where our daughter could play with her school friends, that was not too far from where we live. According to the CSA calculator, I should be getting £360 per month..... this is reality and fact.... yes he could move to a cheaper house but my daughter wouldn't be as happy... so for me it's got to be a compromise in the childs best interest... my daughters happiness is much more important than what the CSA say I'm 'entitled' to.....

[TimetohittheroadJack]

shocked of course the mother should get a job. However if you are the NRP you have far less day to day responsibilities and it's much, much easier to get either a second job, or train to get a better paid job.

[TimetohittheroadJack]

If 360 is 15% of you exactly monthly salary he must be getting ~2400 a month, which is roughly 38k a year. And he can't 'afford' to pay for his child???

[TimetohittheroadJack]

Sorry ^ not sure where the extra words can from should read if 360 is 15% his monthly salary must be...^

[stripesstpots]

I never get this 'i'm not giving child support because that bitch will spend it on her nails crap'

Because yes they might spend that £30 or whatever on nails but surely for the other five days a week she has spent double that on food, heating, shelter, clothes, non uniform days, costume days etc. That isn't the states responsibility. Its the parents.

If she doesn't and the child is going without due to neglect then go for custody. But I doubt you will.

The only person being punished in this is your daughter. If you genuinely don't think she will get the money then spend the money you would have spent then at least spend the money by buying physical things for her. A coat, shoes, clothes and vouchers.

You can't let your child miss out or shirk your responsibility to your child because the state will pay.

Believe me when they are teens like mine savings won't matter if they have missed out.

[stripesstpots]

But shocked if the nrp can prove they cannot afford to pay the required amount or any amount at all then they don't pay. I know people who don't get a fiver a week because the nrp has said they cannot afford.

I just think it is too easy for SOME nrp to have a child , throw a strop and leave the state to pay.

According to Gingerbread the majority of single parents don’t receive child maintenance payments at all. That's a whole lot of kids who the nrp has let down.

[Shockedbyfolk]

As I said, it's about compromise... £2,400 may sound a lot but his outgoings are a lot too and he is spending very little on himself (which I don't grudge anyway as I do the same!). The point I'm making is that we both want the best for our daughter and it's not about the money we give her or what either thinks we are entitled to based on the CSA... as long as the child has everything she needs and the love of both parents, isn't that the most important thing??? The OP is doing all that his daughter need him to do.... it's the mother that needs to get a reality check....

[Atenco]

If she was that hard up she wouldn't be in the pub and having nails done etc. These are luxuries not essentials that he should be paying for

This is why we are giving you a hard time for OP.
So many of us on here have had the father of our child/ren think that we should give receipts to show that every last penny is being directly spent on the child/ren.

First of all, she doesn't have to be hard up to expect the father of the child to contribute.

Everyone has some luxuries in their lives. (According to George Orwell, in the thirties people thought that the miners were mismanaging their money by buying tea, as it is, let's face it, a luxury).

I thoroughly disagree with the logic that fathers shouldn't have to contribute unless the mother and their children are on the absolute breadline.

[imwithspud]

I thoroughly disagree with the logic that fathers shouldn't have to contribute unless the mother and their children are on the absolute breadline.

This times a thousand. NRP's should pay for their kids, end of. Whether the other parent has 'luxuries' is completely irrelevant and it is likely that the mother in this instance would still get her nails done regardless of whether he paid or not. People are forgetting that the only one missing out through him not paying maintenance would be the child.

[Marmalade85]

OP you work 70 hours per week and earn £13k per year?

[meandthreehappyascanbe]

It sounds like you picked a bad choice in partner and now have to pay the price. Unfortunately you don't get to make sure money goes on your child, you just should tick the boxes that said you tried including paying cm.
You sound like a father who cares but doesn't know how to go about improving the situation. Go and see the citizens advice, get some support, ensure your daughter has what she needs.

I wish you and your daughter and the mother manage to resolve and come to an agreement works with DD best interests.

I'm sorry you're getting a bashing but there are plenty of reasonable people on here but also a lot who may be on the other end of single parenting who don't have a good ex partner and they too are paying for it, so they may be a little more trigger happy to point the finger.

[1DAD2KIDS]

You have stepped into a hostile environment here. (I will probably get slated for this) but men automatically viewed more critically. We are of course the source of many people's woes on here. The trouble is no one know your full situation, your ex's full situation or of course to what extent you are telling objective truth. Some people have already found a few different spins on what's going on. Such as a not willing pay a fair share or controlling behaviour etc (none of us know you).

Personally I like to give people the benefit of the doubt. So my spin on things is to take you fairly face value but possibly looking for a better way to do things.

First of all is she a safe suitable mother or not? I don't mean will she will mother of the year, but does meet the basic standard. Bear in mind none of use are perfect parents and we all have different styles of parenting and parenting standards. After all we need to be able to have a drink and let lose now and then. You may not approve of her parenting but is the child loved and looked after with an acceptable level of care? If yes, then when she is with your ex let your ex do things her way. If not then the chid shouldn't be in your ex's care.

As for money it should be a case (in an ideal world) of pooling together each of others finances and providing the same standard of living in both households. That means that your daughter is funded to the same amount per day in what ever household she is staying. If one parent is better of than the other then of course the wealthier one should subsidise the other (even in a 50/50 no maintenance spit IMO). So you need to ask honestly is this is the case with the money you give the mom. We cant control what the other parent spends that money on. All we can hope is they spend it in the child's best interests. So of course this could be a genuine concern.

The CSA has a pay scale that reflects the time you have the kids. Bear in mind you have then about 43% of the time so the CSA will be vastly reduced to reflect that you have her nearly 50% of the time. I would pay that. Then at least you will be paying what the state says is a fair amount based on your income and the 3 days a week you have them. Sounds the best solution to me and its what its there for. Then you are contributing to her time with her mums and of course for school trips etc the mum should contribute 57% of the costs. If you can afford to put saving away after CSA then of course do. Then no one can accuse you of neglecting your child.

Personally I think your heart is probably in the right place (like I said none of us know you and the others could be right) but some could say you want to be the one seen to give her all the expensive and fun stuff while neglecting to her help her mum so her mum looks rubbish in comparison. If you pay the CSA rate and she is still neglected in her mums house at least you can say and prove that helped her mum with an approved fair amount but her mum spent it on other stuff.

Personally its a shame you don't get on well enough to pool your resources instead of having separate everything. This way just means more costs for both you and your ex as your child is almost costing double.

[Atenco]

I think that is a lovely post, 1DAD2KIDS.

I am definitely not anti-man but we all answer from our own experiences, so it logical that women will just see so many triggers in a post by a man who doesn't want to pay maintenance and accuses the mother of being unfit. Too many of us have been there.

[Molly333]

Nice bit of control going on here , I bet loads of women in here have met this , I pity the mum and the little one here !

[Marilynsbigsister]

I feel sorry for the child. I certainly don't feel sorry for the mum if she is drunk in charge of the child. I also have no sympathy for a man who knowing what the mother is like, has left her in an unfit parents charge for all this time. If that were my child, I would be in court within a month.

[1DAD2KIDS]

Well you say the NRP but if my understanding of the situation is right they the ex is only just the NRP, it's almost a 50/50 split. I think that is a guideline as i advocate a working out of combined finances and spliting according. They only have so much money between. Unfortunately a kid living in two households can significantly increase the cost of raising that child. Especially when parents don't get along and will not pool resources. We don't no the ins and outs of the OPs finances but from the sounds of it I am not sure how much they can actually afford over the CSA amount and maintain a household for the 47% of the time the kids lives with them.