My friend is about to die of secondary breast cancer. Does anyone have any experience? Can you talk me through...

[IHateStampysVoice]

...what happens at the end? They will call me when she is near the end but she is adamant that she doesn't want company before this as she just wants to sleep. She is very much in denial, and thinks the meds are making her this unwell.

Currently, she has triple negative breast cancer that's is now massive in her liver.

She just wants to sleep all the time, can barely stand for more than a few seconds. Can't eat because she feels 'full', is white as a sheet and gaunt. She has trouble focusing on what people are saying.

I just wondered if anyone had a friend or relative had been through this who wouldn't mind sharing with me their experience. Especially from this point onwards.

I drove her to the hospice this morning, it took me days to persuade her mum to visit - she thought she had months to live. I feel as though she'lol have days. It's been confirmed that she definitely doesn't have months..

I realise every person is different, and no one can give me a time frame - I don't expect it. But if anyone could give me their experiences I would be very very grateful. I just want to prepare myself as much as possible.

As I said above, I have absolutely no intention of letting her think she is about to die, I would never be so cruel.

I had to tell her. Other because she wasn't going to see her daughter before she died otherwise.

*her mother

Stinkers, my lovely friend died from a grade 4 glioblastoma four and a half years after diagnosis. This was considered long though, for most it is within two years.

She did a trial at the Marsden, but tbh, those trials are pie in the sky. I am not sure anyone expects them to help the patients, just to help provide more information about the illnesses to help develop treatments for future patients.

My friend was taken off her trial after just two or three doses as nothing was happening.

OP at the end, my friend was mostly comatose because it was a brain tumour, but she had a morphine pump and had to be turned every two hours to avoid sores developing. At this stage the body shuts down and really does not need food or even water anymore. She was a little responsive right up to the end though, but could not move at all and her head obviously hurt a lot.

So sorry for your friend and for you. It is a terrible time for everyone.

I would call MacMillan, I work with them they are experts here. Its so hard these poor people all nice ordinary people and this awful thing happens to them.

dollius yeah, that's what we're thinking, maybe another year or so. But who knows? My uncle signed up for the trials with the 'if I'm going to die, in for a penny' attitude. They might not work but you never know. Thanks both for responding. X

I am so sorry about your friend.

We have had fast and slow. Slow was my Mum 5 years ago, told nothing more they could do, 4 days later she was on a morphine driver and was completely unconscious for 2 more days with harrowing breathing. She had lung cancer.

Then my MIL, very sleepy, 2 days later she was dead. We did not see that one coming and my devastated FIL had stepped out of the room for 2 minutes whilst the staff spoke to him. She was alone. She had gone from awake and chatty, next day asleep for most of it, next day she died. That was leukaemia.

But I do think people do choose to wait for someone or not. My Mum was surrounded by me and my siblings, my MIL was alone.

It is like torture for family and friends. We wouldn't treat animals this way, and yet we rob people of their dignity. It is too cruel.

If you are feeling up to it search for my account on my mums death in February. I shared a detailed account on the elderly parents forum because I though it would help other mumsnetters.

Mum died peacefully at home 3 days after coming home to die. She had a driver for about 24hrs and she was awake on and off girl the 1st 6 hrs or so thrn mostly sleeping.

I'm assuming your friends preferred place of care is the hospice? My experience is that last admissions are usually days in length. Be reassured that she will have the very best of care. Hospices are amazing.

I've remembered something else - the (brilliantly compassionate) district nurses from our local hospice said that another hint that life is coming to an end is that the body stops producing waste. So if she no longer needs the loo, or you see there has been no change in the contents of her catheter bag for a few hours then she will only have a few hours left.

I sincerely hope she has a peaceful passing, and that she holds on to hope until the end. My mum was so sad she'd never get to meet her first grandson but it made her incredibly happy he kicked her hand off my belly on her last day with us. Hope and happiness make a huge difference.

Oh that is bittersweet karin.

Thank you all for sharing, I find it useful and comforting in a way. It's appreciated.

How's your friend doing stampys? Was thinking of you today as we're just entering palliative care for my lovely FIL, who has renal failure and has decided to stop dialysis/further treatment

My mum died from secondary breast cancer. At the end she was unconscious because of the pain medication. I just sat with her pretty much for 3 days and typically she passed away when I went home to see ds

It wasn't awful. She was just asleep.

My housekeeper, aged 40, secondary Breast Cancer, its in her bones, lungs, throat, skull, and as of last week - her brain. Its very aggressive. Its not even 2 months since we were told its back and its changing every few days.

We have now been told if she wants to go home to her home country it has to be 'now' and is just awful. She wont get the care we are providing for her here because its simply not available there - even at a price.

We knew it was very bad but it now being in her brain so soon has well and truly knocked us for 6.

Our plan for her has to change - but to what?

My sil died about two months ago of liver cancer, she had not accepted it until the very end. She wanted to be at home and as much as normal until as late as possible. She was in extreme pain which i think is normal for primary liver cancer so was on huge amounts of morphine and sedative. She was sedated and pretty much comatose for the final 6 days of her life. At that point she had stopped eating and drinking, the final stages were pretty rapid. The previous day her hands and feet started to get cold and the final minutes her airways relaxed and she struggled for breath But she knew what was happening and smiling and although couldn't talk she was communicating with us all. The district nurses were our angels, we all stayed at home with her for the final week and was the most painful but one Of the most beautful experiences of my life.

once they go on the syringe driver there's usually no longer than 48 hrs, my dB died at home in march, he'd been sleeping a lot for about 3-4 days he stopped eating on the Tuesday, was talking to people who weren't there on the Thursday night, became very alert and chatting and laughing with us on Friday morning, started getting agitated around lunchtime, (read my post on actively dying) went on to syringe driver about 2 pm, was extremely agitated for the rest of the day, finally became peaceful around 9 pm , panting type breathing, then finally passed away at 2.15 am Saturday.
I hope your friend passes peacefully, but be prepared in case she doesn't. I really hope this hasn't frightened you or is insensitive, we didn't know what to expect and were horrified to see the agitation but apparently its very common and if you know what it is its much less scary. I wish I could offer more, I am so sorry for everyone dealing with this. xx

I'm so sorry Karin it's heartbreaking isn't it?

And thank you for input everyone, I'm finding it incredibly helpful.

There is an update which I'm finding confusing, when I dropped her off the nurse who took over had seen her scan and said she won't have long - but wasn't specific.

Since then the doctors have been round to see her, haven't seen the scan (?!) and talking about getting her pain under control so she can go home .

A syringe driver has been discussed but as far as I know, she hasn't got. She is texting more now as her pain is generally under better control.

She is severely constipated and has been for months but hey are giving her an injection so she immediately evacuates her bowels. I've googled but I've no idea what that is. The constipation is up high (under her ribs) and weeks and weeks or enemas, colonics, suppositories, Movicol and others (all at the same time at one point) haven't done a thing.

Does anyone know what this injection might be?!

Now, I just wait for her to text or her mum. Her mum has mental health issues, she is now with her daughter and has caused me no end of grief and pain since she arrived. It's been a very upsetting few days.

I have done so, so much for my friend and all I've received from her mum is criticism. But I have to bite my tongue and 'take it' because her daughter is dying and I love her daughter and want to see her again.

The chances of me being there at the end now are minimal. This is very very painful considering what I have been through with my friend but it's up to her mum (who hasn't been there whatsoever).

Sorry about the essay or typos, it's all a bit raw.

lessthanbeau I read your thread a few days before I started this one. I was really grateful for having read it as I was totally unaware that this could happen. Thank you for the preparation.

My friend died on Saturday.

I lost the plot. Yesterday I thought I was doing ok again. Her mum asked me to speak at her funeral.

Now it's all coming undone. People are talking, people are aiming their anger and grief in the wrong direction and I seem to be a buffer.

They are all together, none of them have children and they are all off work and uniting in their grief (I say 'all' I mean my friends housemates and her mum) and I got a message from her housemate just now to say "I've got a big task ahead of me to fix the pain I've caused people"

I don't understand.

I've taken her to the hospice, I bought her food when she was too sick to stand and cook herself toast. I collected her prescriptions. I begged for her place in a hospice when it was clear she had days left. I begged her mum to come down so she could be with her daughter because I knew she had such little time.

Since then, I got the news and I've been digesting it, dealing with it and looking after my children who have witnessed there mum in a pain they should never have witnessed.

Now tonight I get messages to say I've caused pain to people and I have 'a big task to make it up to people'

What could I have possibly have done wrong?

If it wasn't for me, my friend would have died alone in her room. No family by her. No pain management. I did all that. I made sure she was in the best place with the best people.

What could I have possibly done wrong? I guess tomorrow I find out.

This is awful. I can't put into words how much this is making the pain worse.

My friend would hate that we are falling out.

From what you have written, I don't see you have anything To make up for. You were a great friend when she was in need. I am sure these text messages are very distressing and I think while your grief is so raw I would not deal with them.

I've closed down Facebook. I can't deal with her housemates. If I never saw them again it would have no effect on me.

I have text her mum though begging to know what Ive done. I said I'd never ever want to hurt the mother of a friend so loved so dearly. What could I have possibly have done?

Now I regret sending them. The last thing she needs is my out pouring begging to hear what I've done.

I'm not getting anything right.

I'm fucking it all up spectacularly.

Hi OP, have you had any sleep? I am so very sorry about your friend, but you did a wonderful thing in looking after her.

The weird behaviour from others is probably just guilt. Please ignore it. It is of no use to you whatsoever so please don't give it any headspace.

If I were you I would aim to get through the funeral as invest I can, and then retire from this group of people with your head high, and with your precious memories of a loved friend. Think of the good times.

'as best'

Thank you. This is what I've just been telling myself. Literally just then. It's good to see it written down from someone else.

I'm going to back away from them all now. Get through yhe funeral and move on.

What an utter shame that it has come to this.

I did sleep but my eldest woke at 2am crying with earache. I sat with him until the pain meds kicked in, that was when I read the message. I was to wound up to sleep after that.

so sorry you are going through this, you have been a rock for your friend, I don't know why people behave in this way, we had the same with my dB, his girlfriend lived away but came and nursed him with me when he became confined to bed, she was brilliant and helped in ways no one could imagine, then at the funeral people including my mother I might add, were saying she wasn't there for him enough,saying she wanted him cremated, our mother wanted burial,but he decided years ago on cremation, just blaming her for all sorts of stuff she had nothing to do with. it was heartbreaking for her and my dB would have been so ashamed of them. hold your head high, you don't need to justify anything. what the hell do they think you have to make up for? its so hard being on the receiving end of something like this.

Grief hits people in all sorts of ways, and throws up all sort of supressed anger and guilt.

You have been a wonderful friend, you supported her, cared for her and loved her.

You need to take a step back, don't engage or get involved with other people's drama. Just make sure you have your own support now.