Blood test nurse with NO appointment got firemen to damage door.Who pays?

[logiccalls]

Someone who goes decades without any G.P. contact (being allergic to chemicals, and therefore never wanting to get pills) decided to get a private health MOT: The results were excellent, except for one which indicated it might be advisable to take a further blood test via the N.H.S.

The person was permanently disabled by a violent and stalking ex, therefore finds it difficult to get to a surgery, and asked them to send a home visiting nurse to do a blood test. This is a person made resilient by adversity, and keeping as healthy as possible, so with no history of mental problems or heart problems or anything else. (And even the requested blood test was resulting from a private MOT, which the NHS knew nothing about)

The GP has never been spoken to, just the receptionist, who promised to pass on the request for the blood test .

There was no further contact: NO appointment: No response: No email: No phone contact: No letter: No text.

Many weeks later, suddenly, a stranger had got into the block of flats, without using the intercom, and was agressively hammering on the flat door and trying to force the door handle to turn.

There was still no phone call, email or text. It could have been any intruder, inebriated, deranged or drugged. The occupant stayed silent.

The mobile phone rang, but with a witheld number, (which someone who has previously been stalked would of course never respond to.) Eventually, the stranger at the door went away. (There had been a parcel outside the door, before the stranger arrived, and as soon as she left, the occupant could at last open the door to retrieve it, and did so.)

An hour (?) later, a man was beating on the door as if to smash it in, and shouting. The occupant is deaf, but was obviously not going to open the door, to violent strangers, so again stayed silent. (But, because the parcel had been taken in, was clearly not lying unconscious on the floor for lack of a routine blood test, for which there had been NO appointment.)

The hammering on the door continued for hours, (?) and although the phone was constantly being rung, it was never used to send a text explaining there was any legitimate reason to attempt entry.

Later, it turned out the nurse had called the fire brigade, and it was their men taking over from her in battering the door. They then began to drill holes in the door.

The occupant had been unable to use the phone to try to get a lawyer, or to ring for any possible help from neighbours or the building caretaker. The 'number -witheld' calls were coming constantly.

With the flat's front door being destroyed, there was at last no choice for the occupant except to go to the door and call out "Who are you and what are you doing?"

A fireman explained who he was, and that there was a blood test nurse who had claimed that the occupant had "failed to attend an appointment for a blood test", which apparently he believed was justification for smashing the door. (?!)

a)There was NO such 'appointment'. b)The occupant had no idea who the nurse was, or the fireman was. c)Nobody texted.

But could it ever be reasonable to smash the door of someone for such a minor reason, for someone with no medical or mental illness history, and with evidence the person has taken in a parcel, so is obviously fit and well?

This is bullying and abuse of power, instigated by that extremely aggressive nurse, and enabled too readily by a fire brigade who were colluding in the constant phoning, yet never requesting a text should be sent, to a deaf occupant, to identify themselves or the blood test nurse, or to give information about the alleged "appointment".

(The medical records will not show much contact with the NHS, for decades, but there would be a note about deafness, so the fireman's statement that he had called out the word 'fireman' would not be justification to destroy a door.)

There is no house insurance. The front door is a security door and a fire door, so will be expensive to replace. Large holes have been drilled through it. Is it true, as the fireman suggested, that the NHS surgery will be liable to replace the front door?

You can be allergic to certain chemicals, sure. But saying you are "allergic to chemicals" is like saying you're allergic to food and drink.

Someone being annoyed about their door being cut open aren't being "daft".

How was OP to know that they don't give appointments when she's never had a home visit before? I didn't know that either.

The nurse did not have lawful reason to get the door cut open, end of.

ETA If you'd bothered to read the OP's comments you'd see she doesn't have home insurance. But legally, the emergency services would be responsible to pay for the door, as it was unlawfully opened.

I'm wondering if OP has had previous negative experiences with police/medical professionals as this may be why seemingly obvious courses of action like ringing the police were averted?

The police will be a hell of a lot more useful than the lawyer OP says she would have contacted.

I’m not sure this is a question for Mumsnet.

I don't think OP said they were allergic to all chemicals did they?

From the nurse's point of view, she was going to see a vulnerable housebound person. That person wasn't responding to knocks, calling through the door, or phone calls. She was entirely justified in being concerned for OP's welfare. If, say, OP had collapsed and the nurse walked away, OP could have died.

I am physically disabled and have had home visits.

my gp surgery, as many do, has a number withheld.
they do not text me except as part of mass texts to tell me to book my flu jab.
if they do a home visit then yes they do knock loudly.

op, you have no chance of changing the way a gp surgery does things. If you want to interact with nhs services you do it their way or no way.

they are pretty frustrating at times because they are so inflexible but they won’t deviate from procedure.

They weren’t bullying you they were trying to check you were ok

A lot of people with (C)PTSD are afraid of police and similar. Even tangentially related traumatic experiences can foster a lot of (understandable) distrust towards authority/enforcement figures. I haven't personally had much, if any, direct contact with police, but I know given my own trauma background I would really struggle to phone the police for help. I didn't even phone the police when someone was smashing my door down - I phoned a relative living nearby.

I would be very concerned if someone did NOT use my intercom. It is there for my protection . Any professional visiting me knows to use it. I would be very alarmed if someone suddenly banged on my door. I would shout out who is it, but I may not be able to hear their reply. I certainly would not open my door.

Anecdotally, the police will only intervene in cases of stalking once a surprisingly high threshold of likely imminent harm has been crossed. I was really surprised by how far things have to go before the police will even look at a stalking case. I'm wondering if the OP has experienced enough instances of police non-action that she does not trust them to come to her aid at all.

This is crazy. Of course you'd phone the police. Any other action makes no rational sense.

The nurse doesn't know any of this stuff though, does she?

Also, I very much doubt her first action was to bang aggressively and try the handle. By the time she got to that she had probably been knocking politely but with increasing vigour for several minutes.

The NHS can't help that most of their numbers are withheld. My GP and local hospital actually aren't withheld. But the district nurses who attended my mum had withheld numbers - ironically probably for their own safety.

I'm another who is surprised about the GP just sending someone to do a blood test on your say-so. I've had private test results before and the NHS won't just prescribe or order a test because I say so - they have to actually have a proper consultation with you. Because they are responsible for what they prescribe or order.

So, you'd call a lawyer?

Then there are procedures for that nurse to follow, such as noting that the patient didn't answer, report that she was "unable to gain access", and that the surgery would then contact the patient to rebook (or in this case actually book, as the surgery had never sent out an appointment). Jumping straight to having someone's door broken down is overkill, there was no evidence that OP's life was at risk. Despite being disabled, OP (if she is the person the thread is about), is in good health.

Why would they think that?

You don't realise that both water and oxygen are chemicals right?

Said person would surely have at the very least a spy hole to see who’s at the door if not a ring camera. With all their stalking and hearing woes, it’s unfathomable that their solution to not knowing who’s at the door is to let the caller hammer on it for hours and wait for them to break in before asking who it is. They could’ve asked at any time through the door.

If you're in a block of flats, there should be a block insurance policy held by the freeholder / management company which you can claim from.

No-one doesn't think allergies aren't real. They think claiming to be allergic to 'chemicals' is ridiculous as pretty much everything is a chemical, or made up of chemicals, from the air you breathe to the clothes you wear to the food you eat. I am allergic/sensitive to lots of things, but they are specific things/groups of things, not something so vague and all encompassing as 'chemicals'. It's as nonsensical as saying you're allergic to liquids.

Thank you for the response, which is illuminating in the attitude: Someone who can, albeit with difficulty, make it to their door, and to the lift of their flats, will be able to go out anywhere, but only with a lot of expense and planning, and with a friend or paid helper available to accompany them and drive them, or else with a taxi waiting at the entrance door, with a driver to assist them in and out.

That way, they can go to the private dentist each year and also, if they are willing to pay, get an annual or occasionalprivate health MOT, (NHS doesn't do them, or if they do, not comprehensive ones) If they live in flats, and if they can get to the lift, they can go to the entrance hall to collect their mail.

They can get their annual flu and covid jabs, privately. That way, they have an appointment, and in a place they can be sure has a place for the driver to drop them right by the entrance, and a friend or helper to assist them into the door. The nhs is apparently supposed to arrange home visits for jabs for those who find getting to the surgery impossible or impossibly difficult. They also, in theory, do some kind of MOT or routine health checks, but most people never hear about them.

Getting friends or paid helpers plus taxis, to go into a crowded NHS g.p. waiting room, or crammed NHS hospital, to get a blood test, even once in decades, is unwise activity for anyone who would not manage an infection easily, living alone and unable to walk more than a few steps unaided. Being largely housebound is not the same as being completely confined to a bed, or a prison cell, you know.

The fire brigade don’t take hours to get in, the person is deaf but called out who is it and heard the response? Not a lot of this makes sense?

I think there’s a whole chunk of context missing here…..

But we only have the OPs version of what happened, not everyone's take on a situation is always accurate