Landlord advice needed for DD

[FeatheryFlorence]

DD is renting a flat with two friends. It’s a basement flat, and when they viewed it and agreed to take it on, the blinds/curtains were drawn.

The flat has three rooms that look out onto a light well, and when they arrived at the flat and opened the blinds, they noticed that the ground floor of the light well was full of nesting pigeons and piles of pigeon shit. If they opened the windows it stank.

They complained to the agent and landlord, and they sent someone to clear with pigeon shit. He came twice and has not been back, despite the promise that he would come weekly until they could organise netting.

They have complained repeatedly to the landlord and the agency, and neither are responding to phone calls or emails - they’ve had no response for months now, and the pigeon shit has built up again.

They have been to Environmental Health, who told them to contact CAB. CAB told them to contact Environmental Health. They are now in a circle of no response from the agent or landlord and getting nowhere with Citizens Advice or Environmental Health.

Where can they go from here?

Contact their MP and cc Environmental Health on the letter including all attempts at previous communications.

Brilliant. Thank you!

Strange that they didn’t open the blinds when they viewed the flat.

If possible, and they can’t live with it, I’d start looking for another flat and give notice. This will end up long-winded, stressful and time-consuming. especially as no-one is very interested in solving the problem. It’s also possible that once your dd gives notice, the landlord will act.

If I was in your situation, I would be more inclined to be looking to move out. No one seems to be taking ownership of the situation and your DD and her friends are paying good money to rent this property.

Boils my piss when you get landlords like this! I’m a landlord myself and i’d never dream of neglecting a property like this, let alone place my tenants in a situation that puts them into a harmful situation also.

Find another rental and give notice as soon as the tenancy allows- I.e if a 6month rental give notice at the first day of the 5th month.

Stop paying rent until it is sorted, and inform the landlord.

don't do this, it could have serious repercussions for them further down the line

Do not do this, it is terrible advice.

Don't do this it will affect their credit rating.

She won’t stop paying rent. She’s finding it depressing and would like to move out but her flatmates don’t want to move.

Yes - you would have thought that they would have opened the blinds! But they didn’t. The flat is lovely apart from the pigeon issue.

Have they looked into getting some netting / spikes fitted themselves? Might be far less expensive and quicker than trying to do anything about it/ against the landlord etc

The netting needs to be higher up on the building. I don’t think they could do it themselves. The idea was that the netting go at the top of the building as others have also had pigeons nesting on their window ledges - some people have put in plastic spikes, others have just pushed the nests to the ground.

I was imagining netting over the basement light well to prevent birds getting in there. No stopping poo falling from above though! If it’s a whole building issue this is for the Freeholder not individual flat owners (assuming they are leasehold flats). Not much a sub tenant can do in those circumstances- if it’s really impacting their lives, time to move on I think

This is terrible advice and could lead to eviction of she’s not careful.

Apparently the owners of the flats all own a share of the freehold. I’m not sure how much this changes things.

How bad is it really? How it is affecting them? Is it really smelling so bad that they can't keep any windows even a cracked opened? Can they clean it themselves?

is it really the only reason why she wants to move out?

It is really bad. It stinks to high heaven, and there are several inches of pigeon shit there, as well as lots of pigeons, eggs and baby pigeons. The problem with cleaning it themselves - and they have tried - is that it is only temporary, and it makes the bins stink.

Check on HM Land Registry to see who owns the freehold. You should also be able to obtain a copy of the leaseholder agreement there. That’ll tell you whether it is the responsibility of the leaseholder landlord or the freeholder to maintain the outside of the building. Either way, I’d be writing to the freeholder putting them on notice of the problem and asking them to resolve it, either themselves or by enforcing the leasehold covenants.

Problem is that the residents are sub tenants so no legal relationship with the Freeholder. It’s the Leaseholder ie OP’s daughter’s) landlord that has to enforce this. If they cba to do that then there’s very little they can do except pursue the Environmental Health avenue and hope the Council takes some kind of enforcement action.

The freeholder (or in this case all the leaseholders who own a share of the freehold) need to deal with this by getting advice from pest control (if they haven’t already done so) but if there are eggs and babies, they won’t be able to do anything until they’re old enough to leave the nest(s).

@FeatheryFlorence Pigeons are actually a protected species. Per the RSPB in England and Wales all wild birds, their young, nests and eggs are protected under the Wildlife & Countryside Act 1981 so it's an offence to:

• To damage or destroy the nest of any bird in use or being built.
• To destroy or remove any egg of wild bird.
• To take, kill or injure any bird or their young.

Sounds like some of the neighbours have already broken the law. If they’re aware, this may be while no-one wants to draw attention to it / deal with it but this certainly makes it a bigger issue.

Easiest option is to give notice and move out. Alternatively, if there’s no sign of action by the landlord/freeholder, your DD can speak to the RSPCA and report it to them.

I’m pretty sure The Environmental health dept are required to deal with this as I think it would constitute a statutory nuisance ( it’s either going to be prejudicial to health or a nuisance). If it is then the council are REQUIRED to deal with it by serving an abatement notice on the landlord.

Get your daughter to Take loads of photos and get her to keep a log of how it affects her - smell, flies etc, noise from the pidgeons?

Then keep complaining to the council and if they won’t do anything try and get it in writing why they won’t. Then threaten to complain ti the local government ombudsman.

Id also get your daughter to contact her local MP. She should make sure all of her flatmates complain as well.

good luck

Pigeon shite is actually toxic.

https://www.hse.gov.uk/construction/healthrisks/hazardous-substances/harmful-micro-organisms/other-diseases.htm

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-46964702.amp

@HundredMilesAnHourunfortunately pigeons lay eggs all year round, so there is never a time when they aren’t there with their eggs and babies, which is one of the things that is making this so difficult.

Most leaseholds require the leaseholder to maintain the parts of the building that they are responsible for. I’d bet there will be covenants which, broadly speaking, state that the leaseholder shouldn’t allow pigeon shit to build up..!

Although OP’s daughter has no legal relationship with the freeholder, she can make them aware that the leaseholder is in breach of his covenants. I doubt the freeholder would take no action and stand idly by whilst their property is being damaged by the leaseholder’s breach.

It’s been a while since I worked in property litigation but, in a dispute like this, I’d always start by obtaining the documents from HMLR.