Protecting property if parents go into care

[Abwettar]

Hi, I'm wondering if anyone can give me some insight regarding protecting my parent's home from care home fees?

The current situation is that I am an only child, there is no other family. Aside from the house, there are no other assets. My parents have joint ownership of their house, worth around 100k, and are both currently living there. They are both in poor health, my dad has been diagnosed with terminal cancer and my mam has been diagnosed with dementia - however they both have capacity to understand the situation at the moment. They have always been adamant on me getting the house after they pass.

There are no plans for either of them to go into a care home, I would like for them to stay in the house as long as it's safe to do so, with care from myself and carers going in throughout the day.

I was looking into putting the home into a trust, but I have read some conflicting information on if this would be considered deprivation of assets due to their poor health.

My question is, if both my parents were to make a will and each leave their 50% share of the house to me, would this protect at least part of the house? For instance, if one of my parents passed away, would their half of the house be protected from care home fees, even in the situation that the other parent had to go into a care home?

Any advice on this situation would be greatly appreciated

Thank you

The state pays for lots of things. Military. Roads. NHS. Schools. There's a limit. If we paid for care for the elderly, we'd have to make cuts or raise taxes.

Why are you picking on benefits claimants as the source of your anger? 38% of universal credit goes to people in work. We pay almost twice as much in state pension payments, sometimes to wealthy older people who don't depend on it.

You could be angry with, say, tax exemptions for businesses or tax dodging corporations or people who don't care for their health and therefore cost the NHS more or people who drive 4x4s and fly all the time and cost the state through air quality.

You might think it's wrong that your parents' house could go to care fees, but I don't see why that equates to benefits 'scroungers' being responsible.

Here's a stat for you - less than 3% of overpayments in benefits are due to fraud. hansard.parliament.uk/Commons/2024-05-16/debates/24051631000022/FraudAndErrorInTheBenefitSystem.

Politicians don't want to touch the care system, Theresa May tanked in an election because she suggested a sensible change that was called a 'death tax'.

And also - paying in all your life doesn't make you entitled to the same thing.

I pay taxes that pay pensions for people who retired at 60. I won't be able to draw a state pension until I'm at least 67.

The current generation pays for today's needs. Future generations pay for our needs when we're older. Otherwise you'd never be able to introduce pensions!

Older generations had more job security and houses were cheaper, yes plenty of other downsides but you're asking people who can't afford to buy a property to pay care fees so your parents can pass a property on to you.

This. My parents would also rather give me their money and the taxpayer pay their care but they've taken out equity of their flat to pay for it. Anything left over will go to me.

Why should it be different for you op?

I'm in a similar situation to you but I want my Mum to be as comfortable as possible. She’s been in a care home for four years now which costs over £8000 a month. My Dad left half of their house to me which I’ve invested but honestly I don’t feel I have any right to spend. My mum has just over £100,000 left I just want her to be comfortable. My Dad would have been sad to see his life savings go in care home fees but that’s the way it is. My Mum being comfortable and safe is the most important thing to me. I wouldn’t have been able to care for her myself and we were spending £6000 a month on carers when she was living at home.
I need to start planning for when the money runs out, and it won’t take long.

Abwettar

"As someone who works in the care sector I know this better than anyone. And I've seen the awful effects the system has on older people who have desperately save their whole lives just to leave something to their kids, then have it taken away. It's an absolute disgrace."

But it wouldn't be taken away, it would be used to fund THEIR OWN CARE.

I'm mentioning as it's Holocaust Remembrance Day that my grandparents had their homes seized by the nazis. They were given no time at all to leave their homes, never mind future care. THAT is having your home taken away.

It does seem likely that your father will die first. If they were tenants in common and his share of the house went to you, your mum would still be able to live in the house. If she later needs a care home then the house would be sold and her share used for the fees.
Your mum is then using her own assets to pay for her care.

Surely this is the same poster from before? Didn't the hundreds of people make it clear enough the last time?

Do you not understand how totally different your situation is to that of the OP?

"My mum has just over £100,000 left..."

The OP's parent's have an estate that is worth around £100k between them. The difference between having £50k to spend on care home fees or £100k (or rather it's likely to be £36k or £84k) is not going to make any meaningful difference at all.

In the case of the care home you are talking about the OP's mum would be able to stay there for either 4 months or 10 months.

They are absolutely all over the place. i work in benefits for older people and we frequently get asked how to avoid parents having to pay care home fees. No-one ever like the answer ! No one ever wants their inheritance to be swallowed up in care home fees, who would ? Also see loads who think they've found a way around it only to be disappointed when the Local authority comes after them for deprivation of assets.

My parents did this.

Mum died in 2022 and her half a house went into a trust. That half is safe from care home fees but the trust has cost a few more bob in insurance and professional fees.

Dad has dementia and lives with us now and we will have to look into options for the future. We have to be realistic in knowing his half of the house and my parents savings will go in care home fees when he deteriorates and we cannot cope and keep him safe at our home. A care home stay starts tomorrow with a respite stay to give us a break after a year and the cost, paid from his income and savings, is eye watering.

However, it also buys choice as to where Dad goes. Having been to a few, believe me, I'm delighted he can afford to have a choice.

This only applies if they are already tenants in common - if he makes that change now then it would be deprivation of assets.

The whole system is very complicated.

When my DH had to have 24 hour care at home and then went into a nursing home we were initially in the position where he had to pay the full costs himself because of his level of savings.

As the savings dwindled we fell into LA support (as his share fell below the ceiling). Since I chose a good home for him the fees were way above anything the LA would pay and I finished up having to "top up" from our savings, and as they dwindled I had to downsize to continue this - in fact "top up" is a bit of a joke as I was paying about 80% of the fee.

In fact I managed to get all the money back after he died as my appeal against refusal of NHS Continuing Health Care Funding was successful. By then I had sold the house!

I was also wondering whether shifting to tenants in common would count as deprivation of assets? Surely it is the asset of the deceased that is changing ownership though, not the surviving parent’s?

You may be right as care costs are on the horizon.
Ours was done many years ago when we were much younger and in good health (and still are).

Actually the vast majority of people never need residential care. We have planned to pay for it but hope I die quickly it won't be necessary

OP - if your mum has a dementia diagnosis it’s too late to do anything about her share of the house if she needs care. Your dad is the one less likely to need care that will take the full value of his share of the house and he’s of sound mind, so he could leave his share of the house to you. If your mum then later needs care, only her share of the house could be used to pay for it, a charge would be put on the value, your dad wouldn’t have to move out to release the value for your mums care.

My mum has dementia as well and is now in a care home, thankfully we are lucky that her savings and pension are covering it for now. Like your dad, mine has changed his will from leaving everything to my mum if he dies first, to me and my brother, his view that of course mums money will have to go on her care but his shouldn’t have to go too.

You are quite right. One person can initiate the change from joint tenants to tenants in common. It does not require both people to agree.

In the OPs case, if her father decides to change to tenants in common then he can do that without any need for her mother to agree.

There are a lot of people talking about things without (I suspect) having any experience.

I would very much disagree with you on this point.

So have thousands of other people , if you want the inheritance keep them at home by caring for them yourself or getting carers in .

Do you own a home yourself?
If not then consider moving in with them. Get your name put on the property along side them. If you are living in the home it cannot be sold to fund their care as far as I'm aware.
Alternatively if you do own a home.. you could move them in with you, sell their home now and take the money as a gift.. or all sell and buy somewhere new which is solely in your name.

I think people are being extremely harsh. I'm left wing as they come.. but working class people trying to protect their 100k family home for their kids is pretty legitimate. I don't get how anyone thinks that is entitled.

I have been caring them since the start of covid, whilst also working full time. Since theres no other family its only me and my partner who can help them. They have carers in, who do very little.

They would not move out of their home without being forced. There is no sensible way I could move in with them to do their full time care without losing my job.

The situation sucks, and all I'm trying to do is protect something they worked so hard for being taken away from them, because it will break their hearts.

already doing both, but since there is only me its an extreme strain alongside working full time. I can't afford to give up my job and lose my workplace benefits that i've spent 10 years accumulating. and carers allowance wouldn't be enough to pay me a living wage.

Nothing is being "taken away from them" that's just a ridiculous way to look at it.

They are using their own money to fund their own care. Not sure what's so heartbreaking about that tbh.

I understand this breaking your parents hearts but unless you leave work and care for them full time, they will have to fund residential care.

It is far too late to do anything about this. Local authorities have departments who investigate potential deprivation of assets and they will look (forensically) through all aspects of someone’s financial affairs. And their medical records.

I think the only thing you can do to avoid selling the house is to pay for another carer or better carers, or have your parents move in with you and have the house rented out.

it would fund care that they don't want, in a place they don't want to live, to be given sub standard care anyway because the industry is on its knees.

they are currently paying for carers in the home, who i have to pick up after 90% of the time. the care industry is appalling, I know because I work in it.

there's only so much you can do to make it better for them. even with the house they couldn't afford the highest quality care home. the care providers for at home care in our area are all as garbage as each other.

it sucks that they have to give up what they worked so hard for to get such poor quality service anyway. it sucks that me and my partner are spending all of our free time picking up their care needs because their actual paid carers are so poor. its upsetting them that despite all of this the one thing they wanted to do for me was leave me some property to help me in my life, and they can't do it.

and it sucks that so many people are so far in their own arses that a simple question from a genuine person gets them being accused of being entitled.