Solicitors: how much do you charge to open a file?

[RosieMilkJug]

I’ve been quoted £1.500 to start things off. I was hoping the first payment would be around £800.

Is £1,500 the norm just to open the file and read some papers? The hourly rate would then be billed on top.

Nothing to open the file. How much depends on their hourly rate and it is unlikely to be simply for opening the file. I'll always get money on account of costs generally (ie) to cover more than the initial work the client thinks they may need as invariably can snowball. Any surplus is returned. Note: it is totally normal for solicitors to request monies on account generally. Have you been given an estimate of costs as you should have been given one.

With probate work try to get a fixed price you will need to be clear what you are asking different firms can quote taking percentage of estate, some just quote for say asking them to fill out certain forms

Also as there are lots of cowboy firms who offer probate services not necessarily legally qualified Google/ trust pilot reviews and get individual quotes don’t be rushed into decisions assuming you may have just lost loved ones your decision making can be impaired so discuss with anyone who you trust prior to making any big decisions.

If it's so simple then just google it...

It's probably not that simple if you need to pay someone to analyse it.

Because I’m not looking for a recipe for sourdough.

Quite. So it probably isn't as simple as you think it is.

Anyway, I gave you the solution which is to approach a few firms for quotes so you have some comparables.

Quite. So it probably isn't as simple as you think it is.

Anyway, I gave you the solution which is to approach a few firms for quotes so you have some comparables.

It isn't a probate estate. It is a contentious issue relating to probate.

@RosieMilkJug Have you asked what level the solicitor is you are seeing and their hourly rate? This can vary by size of firm and where they are based as well as type of work. It isn't unusual for a partner to be between £400/500 per hour plus VAT.

Sometimes it may be cheaper to see a more junior lawyer nut not always as often then they do need to do more research to get to answers and read through papers they may be unfamiliar with.

I was charged the same.

If it’s contentious probate you are likley to be facing more than 2 hours of advice. Even if you give the solicitor papers to look over. Costs can quickly add up and if you are unsuccessful you may have to bare the brunt of it also it can destroy relationships with the opposing party. It’s a specialised area of the law I would be seek differing quotes. Don’t envy you if you are perusing such a action.

https://www.law.ac.uk/resources/blog/everything-you-need-to-know-about-contentious-probate/

It will take a couple of hours to do the background work of “know your client” questionnaire, due diligence, identity and address proof, writing up the engagement letter, etc. They can’t say yes or no to your question without going through all the requirements of their professional body and money laundering laws.

Lawyers are highly educated, skilled professionals. You are paying them for their time, but also the fact that they know things you don't. There is much more to acting for a client than reading a few papers and saying yes or no.

As PP said, either get some more quotes or pay the £1,500. Simple choice.

This is such a ridiculous thread. I'm a solicitor. You, the client, do not KNOW that all you need is "a couple of hour's advice". The cost of the advice you will receive includes the time the lawyer actually spends reviewing your papers and considering the issues in order to advise you, as well as the time spent drafting or delivering the advice, and all the exchanges of emails that will then happen when you have follow up questions etc. £600 is super cheap even if it is only a couple of hours. I work at a regional law firm and my hourly rate is £525 + VAT. I opened a matter this week for a client who is a foreign lawyer just wanting a review of a settlement agreement he'd drafted, to check it works under English law. I quoted 1-2 hours for that.

And yes, legal advice is expensive! I couldn't afford to pay for my own advice, if I had to. I got divorced recently and that was crippling and I still have about £15k to pay from the proceeds of sale of our house, when it sells.

Exactly. And in my experience "yes or no" answer type questions are vanishingly rare
And you can't just leave it at "yes or no", usually you are also giving the client advice on their options going forward and the pros and cons of each

My firm doesn’t charge for opening a file per se but we do ask for money on account to cover the estimated fees.

We provide a detailed work specification, setting out exactly what we’ll do and how long we think it will take. Any work outside the specification, for example unexpected issues or further advice, is charged extra.

It infuriates me when people say “Oh it’s a very simple query”. If it’s that simple, go and figure it out yourself!

OP if your matter relates to a contentious probate, the solicitor may need to understand who has died, whether they had a Will, the identity of the executors and beneficiaries, the identity and relationship to the deceased of those challenging the estate, and whether probate was obtained. Then they’ll consider whether the deceased had capacity, whether there was undue influence, whether the executors administered the estate in accordance with the deceased’s wishes, and whether there might be claims under the Inheritance Act. It’s a hell of a lot more then just reading some back statements.

With the greatest respect, there are a lot of imaginary scenarios flying around which have no bearing on the specific and niche question I would like to seek professional advice for. A few of you have been helpful so thank you.

OP if your matter relates to a contentious probate, the solicitor may need to understand who has died, whether they had a Will, the identity of the executors and beneficiaries, the identity and relationship to the deceased of those challenging the estate, and whether probate was obtained. Then they’ll consider whether the deceased had capacity, whether there was undue influence, whether the executors administered the estate in accordance with the deceased’s wishes, and whether there might be claims under the Inheritance Act. It’s a hell of a lot more then just reading some back statements.

It’s absolutely none of this.

Appreciate this but without you giving more details it is hard to be helpful!

I've seen you suggest financial abuse of elderly. The problem with this is that it's not as simple as X action is ok, Y action is unlawful (which the 10 mins would cover). It's building a picture of the specific situation, considering what a court is likely to find "reasonable" in the specific scenario from all angles, any case law relevant to your specific scenario (eg has there been a recent ruling in a case with similar facts that might set a precedent?). It takes a long time. Lawyers often earn 10% or less of their charge out rate per hour, so although the rates seem steep, they have to cover a LOT.

Just thought I'd explain why what seems simple might be more expensive than you realise. Of course shop around though!

The specific and niche question that you are sure involves a Yes/No answer and will take 10 minutes to answer 🙄.
Solicitors get that a lot from clients, as has already been pointed out, and it's annoying and unhelpful, hence the comments. If you think the fee you have been quoted looks high, ask a couple of other firms for quotes too for comparison.

I’m sorry to say that you are unlikely to get any solicitor agreeing to act for you if you go in with a fixed preconception of how you think they will be doing their job.

Don’t forget that when you obtain legal advice you are asking the lawyer to assume the risk that their advice to you is correct. They have insurance in case you sue them for it being wrong but their insurers require them to provide full and clear advice with all the context, caveats and assumptions explained. They can’t just say yes or no off the top of their heads.

Solicitors very rarely give a "yes" or "no" answer. They can only advise on the facts as presented to them. You need to allow them time to consider and ask about the other information which you have dismissed as irrelevant but which could be highly relevant.
By opening a file, they are immediately opening themselves up to a claim from you for negligence. That risk actually has to be worth it for them.

This is true and solicitors have to consider their fiduciary duties in probate matters.

It’s really very rarely a straightforward yes or no

OK. So suppose they answer the question with 'this person acted unlawfully'. Full stop. And then charge you £400 (or whatever you think it should cost).

Where are you then? Presumably you need to go back to someone (the individual, another solicitor, the police?) and what do you say? If you say 'my solicitor says this person acted unlawfully' I don't think you will be much further forward. Because they (depending on the situation) then say 'why does your solicitor think that?' Or 'thanks for that but I disagree'.

What you actually need is an opinion. That says 'it appears highly likely that this person acted lawfully/unlawfully. This is because the law in this area is x, and the facts in this case are y, and therefore it appears that y contravenes x. And we suggest that you take this course of action.'

And how much all of that costs depends on how clear the law is (statute, case law etc) and how clear the facts are, and what the consequences will be of the courses of action open to you.