Probate advice needed

[SickWithWorry123]

I posted on here last year about a Probate/Inheritance issue with my Sister and received very good advice, if I can ask a few more questions please.

I am holding funds from my Grandmothers estate that were due to be paid my Father, he passed away before her estate was finalised and I was the remaining executor.

My Father died without a will. I have no relationship with my Sister who has apparently now applied for probate and she has been made ab executor of my Dads estate. I do not have any proof of this.

She has sent me a letter saying I have 7days to transfer the funds I am holding as executor and trustee of my grandmothers estate to her bank account as part of my Dads estate.

My Dad was not married and there are 3 sisters who will inherit equally. For many reasons I know she will not transfer my third of the money, one of the reasons is that she verbally told me I would get nothing.

I have 2 questions

1. should I transfer the money to her without proof that she is executor? 2} can I transfer 2 thirds of the money to her keeping the remaining third that I am legally entitled to as one of his 3 children?

If there are any legal experts that can advise I would be very grateful as there was some amazing advice last time.

It's not that I won't transfer the money to whoever has the legal right to it, it's that I have no proof that she has the legal right to it. The other concern is that she has already told me that she will not distribute it according to the laws of intestacy. She told me "you will not see a penny "

Did she tell you this in writing? Blimey she's a piece of work.

You absolutely have to wait to see any legal proof that she has been granted probate and then, as I've said, I'd personally be waiting to see the division of the assets before doing any transfer or deducting your estimated portion before transferring. Despite that not being legal. If she took you to court and got a solicitor involved them she'd have to divide the assets fairly and according to intestate rules so it would backfire on her anyway

I’d write to her saying what you’ve said here- that as she’s told you she won’t be distributing your DF’s estate as per the rules of intestacy, and you quote ‘won’t see a penny’, that you cannot take it on trust that probate has been granted and till you have that, you won’t be transferring the money. And that you would like it in writing that she will of course be administering your DF’s estate as per the law.

because if she refuses to say so, or she puts it in writing that she’s not going to give you the money, then she’s shown her hand which will only give you more ammunition if you have to take her to court surely?

If she does not follow the laws of intestacy, she will be personally liable. If you sue her, she will have to pay your inheritance and your costs. She thinks that, by not paying you, she will be able to keep 50% of your father's estate for herself. Your inheritance and legal costs will have to come out of that. She could be left with nothing, or even out of pocket.

@prh47bridge I understand this, however, once the money is gone if I was to sue her it wouldn't result in anything but costs for me.....she has nothing, she doesn't own her own home, there would be nothing to gain from suing her

Plus you would have to front the ever increasing legal costs with no guarantee of ever getting anything back.
Send her 2/3 of the money.
If all she wants is money, she’s hardly likely to want to pay out in legal fees to chase you for cash that is yours by right.
There may well be intestacy laws but there seems to be no oversight and nobody will be knocking on her door to check she’s acting correctly, that’s how people get away with fraud.
MSE has a death/probate board and the stories on there are horrifying.

Have you checked the Probate register yet?

Presumably she has/had control of his bank account? Did she use it for the funeral etc. ?
You could also send her a letter saying if there are outstanding costs from his estate, you are willing to pay your share when she sends you proof of the debt.
The only way I’d send the lot would be the threat of court / having to pay for a Solicitor, then, and only then would I send my share.

It’s vanishingly unlikely to come to that imho, I doubt she’d qualify for legal aid.
Tell her the only way you’ll send the lot is if she appoints a probate Solicitor to handle the estate. You will look eminently reasonable, she will look vindictive if she refuses.

Small update, she is ramping up her efforts to coerce me into releasing the funds to her citing that she will report me to the Police and instruct solicitors which I will be responsible for the costs of.

She has sent me a screenshot from the Probate register to confirm that the probate application has been granted and they will send out letters of administration within 5 days. Does this mean that she is the executor? Or that the application for her to become executor has been accepted?

She is still holding me to the 7 day timescale (from when she posted the letter) and not the date I received the letter and claims I am now in breach because I haven't transferred the funds to her personal account.

I have logged the phone calls, emails and visits to my address with the Police as part of the ongoing harassment and threats I have received. I have an appointment with them on Sunday to make this formal.

Oh and I suggested that we instruct a solicitor to deal with the estate, one that we all agree on and she has refused this. She has no intention of dividing the estate correctly and according to the law!

Don’t take her word for anything, check the probate register yourself. I did a relatives probate and as far as I recall the register just showed it was granted, nothing about dates of letters being sent out so I am suspicious that she has faked that screen grab.

Once she has the letters of administration, she is entitled to administer your father's estate. Technically she is an administrator rather than an executor as there is no will, but there is no practical difference.

If you have evidence that she does not intend to follow the rules of intestacy, you could apply to have her removed and do the job yourself. The first step in that process would be to write to her asking her to explain why she intends to ignore the law and deprive you of your share of your father's estate.

@prh47bridge the only proof I have is that she made these threats in front of my partner. I reported this to the Police in July of last year along with the death threats and threats to poison my dog. I'm not sure if this constitutes proof?

I will send her a letter tomorrow asking her why she intends to ignore the law. I have referred to this by email which she has completely ignored.

She is so convinced that she is right and I am wrong even though it was proven last year that her claims that I had "stolen" the money were proven to be incorrect and I was holding the money, legally, as a Trustee.

I think that the application for letters of administration requires you to list all who may be eligible to inherit, and even require their signatures - it asks about all the relatives of the deceased. By the sounds of it, it is unlikely your sister has declared your interest, as it where. This means that what the probate office grants will be incorrect (fraudulent?) and therefore not legit - does anyone know if there's a way to contact the probate office and query/put a stay on/require a copy, or something?

What does one do if one suspects the form has been incorrectly completed?

No, it does not ask you to list those who may be eligible to inherit, nor does it require their signatures. It asks how many people there are in various categories (surviving children, surviving parents, etc.) but does not ask for any further details. Provided OP's sister has correctly stated the number of children OP's father had, she has obtained the letters of administration correctly.

Ah, right, fair enough then (providing she's stated the correct number of children/siblings). I suppose it there does end up being a dispute, this could be checked too, just in case.

I would honestly keep your 1/3 and send her the rest.

What benefit is there to her suing you? She would have to spend estate (hers eventually) money to pay for that and have to declare that she would be paying you 1/3 in the end anyway.

She can mark it all down as

Dads estate £100
Split 1/3
Debt owed by sister (£33) taken into account when make payments

Plenty of estates have loans to kids that are repaid out of inheritance? The cash doesn't have to physically pass first.

(Maybe if you know he had a few debts acknowledge you may need to transfer a bit more to cover those though value if car etc should be also included in probate)

I can only get a face to face appointment with my solicitor on 27th Feb. I've spoken to her over the phone and she just reiterates not to send her any money at the money and that the timescales she is quoting to me have no basis in law.

It's escalating daily, she went into the bank where my accounts are held and pretended to be me. Not sure whether the person in the bank was suspicious or not but they sent a feedback text to my mobile. I've been down there today and spoken to the manager who said that she must have got formal Id for me to access my details! She has frozen the account so no-one can transfer the money and advised to report to the Police so they can request CCTV. I've got an appointment tomorrow at the Police station anyway.

This is exhausting!

Bloody hell! What a piece of work she is! That's seriously backfired on her now hasnt it?
Just can't give her a bean if the accounts frozen.

You might be able to remove her as administrator now too.
See what your solicitor says.

she went into the bank where my accounts are held and pretended to be me

That sounds like attempted fraud. Agree with your bank that this needs to be reported to the police.

@GinandGingerBeer that's exactly what I thought! No-one can do anything with the funds now so her 7 day and 5 days timescales are irrelevant.

@prh47bridge
There is a further issue that I'm a bit wary of sharing on here but the ID provided could only have come from somewhere that she should not have been accessing! So I need to speak to someone and raise a Subject Access Request I think, not 100% sure on this but she has accessed my records through her work which is a massive breach.

NHS?

This is awful. That sister sounds bloody unhinged to me.

I'm reading with interest but I am not from UK, so it wouldn't be appropriate for me to comment on your laws, but they are very similar to my country of origin (Ireland).

Could I ask - when you said above that "SHE" froze the bank account, was that your sister or the bank manager?

I would not let this go. The sister is a criminal and a fraudster. Hopefully the police will help. If you know that she accessed your personal information through her work, she could be suspended or lose her job.

@CliffsofMohair not NHS no but a large organisation where she would have access to formal documentation

@Quizine sorry, when I re read what I wrote it did seem like it was my Sister that froze the account, it was the Bank Manager as it was the only way that we could secure the account. It's very likely that if she were to go into a different branch and made a good enough case and uses the ID that she has fraudulently obtained she could possibly transfer the funds.

We don't know what exactly happened when she went into my branch as the person she spoke to was off today.

If the Police don't take this seriously then I don't know what more I can do. I will just have to wait until 27th but I would really like to get her removed as administrator as she is unfit!