Is this normal behaviour for a law firm / solicitor?

[merr1goround]

Please bear with me on this.

I want to know how bad / totally normal, I might look to others!

A few years ago I retained a solicitor to help with a neighbour dispute. He was very verbose, really not concise, gave advice that I found tricky to follow and make a decision with, but I felt he was very knowledgeable (at least more than I!) After about a year of me feeling that he was being very balanced and the other side being quite aggressive I began to feel frustrated. He then wanted to take two actions that I disagreed with. The first I told him not to - he then did it after telling me he wouldn't (and this led to the other side making more requests that he had to deal with that I didn't want - like what came next), and the second I told him I didn't agree to part of the other side's request, he argued with me about this for a few days over email and then eventually told them I agree to their request, when I insisted repeatedly that I did not.

I then told him I no longer wanted him to represent me and I went on alone (to good outcome).

So, he then gave me a bill of £10k. When I took him on he said it would be about £3k if we didn't go to court. I should say that on three occasions I emailed him to ask for an update on fees and he never did - only once he responded and then he fudged his response, and was very vague. When I received the £10k bill, I asked him for his time log and he sent it saying it was estimated because he didn't keep logs.

I said I'm not paying it. His firm then took me to court. Of course, lots of what he charged me for was the work I specifically asked him not to do and the fall out from it.

I then made a complaint to his firm. His Managing Partner came back and said he had done nothing wrong as a solicitor has a duty to act in their client's best interests. I've looked at the SRA website and I can see that there are issues here with his honestly, integrity, the bill being a surprise to me etc.

Additionally, he personally came to my house to deliver the bundle to me (this is a city of London firm with more than 100 partners, by the way! and I live around 20 miles away from both his office and his home). I answered the door disheveled as I'd just taken my baby off my breasts from feeding to answer the door. It was very intimidating and aggressive. The solicitor then emailed me to follow up and in the email he wrote that my house disappointed him!

The law firm sent another partner to meet me. I met with them. They proposed a settlement - not me - that I drop my complaints and the firm will drop the claim against me. The partner said the solicitor had found it challenging with those complaints hanging over his head. I agreed, I just wanted this solicitor to be out of my life. Yuk, just yuk, all of this. The partner emailed the same day saying the solicitor agreed and I'd soon receive a draft settlement agreement. One month later that same partner who met me emails saying 'sorry, the solicitor doesn't agree and he'll se you in court unless you pay us'. I am not kidding or fibbing with any of this.

I complained to the SRA and Legal Ombudsman. It felt like something very strange and wrong and weird was going on.

Once again I also complained to his firm that this was intimidating, strange, aggressive and harassing behaviour. The MP said he'd investigate and come back to me. Three months after I heard nothing. All this time Im worried this solicitor is just going to turn up in my neck of the woods again. I emailed the MP twice for an update after 3 months - nothing. I emailed the other Managing Partner - nothing. I eventually put a comment on google saying I'd heard nothing. The MP I originally complained to came back to me and said they dealt with my first complaint and would not entertain another. In addition, they told me I had been harassing them (!) and they would take this forward if I post any more google reviews.

I have complained to the SRA and Legal Ombudsman and I am defending myself in court next year over the fees.

Im wondering whether I'm going to go to court and the judge will just say 'meh, pay the money and shut up'. I'ma professional person, I would never behave that way in my job (or anywhere, but you know, certainly not in my job!). NO way would I mention a ball park fee to a client, go over that by 2 or 3 times, not respond to them when they ask what the current fees are, and then say I'd estimated the fees and I'm taking them to court now. I wouldn't visit their house, I wouldn't then send an email commenting on this house negatively, I wouldn't propose a settlement then withdraw from it, I wouldn't repeatedly do exactly what they asked me to do and then charge them for it! Can a lawyer please just tell me is this normal behaviour for a law firm?

I swear completely this is truly my experience with a supposedly decent-ish city law firm, like I say, with more than 100 partners.

@merr1goround Maybe I misunderstood what you're trying to achieve here. Are you just looking for people to say this is weird / unusual? Well yes, you have that affirmation from plenty of posters on here. Or are you looking for what you can and can't prove legally? That was the angle my questions were coming from. Perhaps I spend too much time with lawyers but I would be focussing on what the law says is and isn't allowable and what you can prove in court.

I wanted to know if it was normal.

All of it. Ignoring instructions and the fees stuff. The other bits about his character, too. Mostly because I wondered what the judge would think.

The update, which you responded to was not to ask anything it was just to update and share my experience in case it helped others. I often like to see an update on MN.

I've taken it all to the SRA and the LO, always emphasising the instructions part and the fees. The rest I just mention just in case they look at the whole picture and also because I thought the SRA cared about conduct. Also in case he treats other (females) in a similar way it begins to build up a picture.

I have no idea what he'll argue in court, some insight there would help now. Probably that he ignored my instructions because it's his duty to represent me to the best of his ability, and in this case it means overriding my instructions on both occasions, and on one of those telling me he would not do what I asked him not to do, only to do it the very next day. I argued this was dishonest, lacking in integrity, and not following instructions - all detailed as breaches of the SRA guidelines of conduct, and principles governing the profession. SRA did not think it was in the public interest to investigate this. The fees - there is a particular section of the principles which says solicitors should ensure fees do not come as a surprise to clients ("surprise to clients" is verbatim). Of course the contract I signed (letter of engagement) also stated he would update me - he did not. So I argued he wanted me to keep to a contract he had written but had also ignored. I also went for the dishonesty, lack of integrity, not working in my interests, and every other principle I could argue he breached. SRA still didn't take it further.

So the idea I keep nattering on about him coming to my home to the ignorance of the issues that matter is not accurate, as scary as that is for me, and many women who experience intimidatory behaviours from men, those concerns were not what I focused on at all.

I even sent them information on a solicitor they had sanctioned for similar behaviours (that this problematic solicitor had worked under while the sanctioned solicitor was doing it), and they did not bite. In that case it wasn't £10k at stake, but in the £100k. I do think that is the difference. I'm just small fry. The money means a lot to me, though.

Thanks for writing.

Why didn’t you just settle with them? Why choose a firm with 100 partners for a neighbour dispute? Any little firm would do. The whole scenario is odd snd I guess you like an argument or two.

@TizerorFizz

Thank you!

When the dispute began the solicitor worked in a small collective of lawyers.

I didn't 'settle' because they withdrew the offer - all quite clearly stated above.

Good night!

(I won't waste my time on any more of these little digs though they're quite funny, really.)

No, it's not normal.

You seem to waste your time on a lot of things op. Luckily for me, I don’t.

I don't know why you're getting a hard time from some posters. You instructed your solicitor to do something, he literally ignored you. Twice. Of course he's unprofessional.

As far as the thing about working in your best interests is concerned, that is partly true but not if it goes against you explicit instructions. I went against the advice of my solicitor on a certain matter, and she got me to sign a document stating that I was proceeding against her advice. She then did what I instructed her to do, because that is her job.

Hope it goes well for you OP.

Blimey OP, what a nightmare for you

It sounds as though you have stumbled upon some particularly grimy old boy's network with institutionalised misogyny and a bullying culture, in which it is easy for them (and apparently the SRA! 😨) to dismiss you as a silly squawking little woman.

Unfortunately I think you have to play them at their own game, which means leaving out the emotional stuff that offers them a red herring. I wonder if the SRA deliberately ignored the valid complaints you had (not that they're not all valid; just that some carry more "legal" weight) and focused on the things they found easier to sneer at.

Can you write to them again?

Keep things very simple, direct and clear, and eliminate anything that gives them ammunition to treat you like someone who is anxious and overreacting.

Ugh, horrible situation. Good luck!

Thank you!

I think I know why some posters have given me a hard time. I see that kind of behaviour all over MN. Another behaviour I don't understand....(!)

I have written back to SRA just asking why they did not address the concern I had about the solicitor not following my instruction on two separate occasions - that's the big one for me, along with asking about fees and receiving no response.

The solicitor did other things I haven't even mentioned here.

Let's see! But knowledge is power. I've come to MN several times in the past not to post but to learn from others' experiences, so I contributed too.

Thanks all!

OP I'm a solicitor and you have them bang to rights over the fees. You should not have to pay for time spent on tasks that were not in line with your instructions. That's the main crux of your case.

I would recommend you stop with the google reviews. I understand you're doing this out of frustration but it's damaging your argument and helping them paint you out as a nuisance and a trouble maker.

The rude comments from him about your house are out of line but it's not actionable by you. Also dropping the bundle at your house is not that unusual. I've done this before myself when it's been quicker to get documents to a client (appreciate that may not have been the case here) but the SRA wouldn't be interested in that.

The SRA/ Law Society is your best route, I wouldn't bother with the MP. Just stick to the facts - you agreed 3k, he didn't follow your instructions, he did work you specifically asked him not to do, didn't provide few updates etc. That should be all you need in court to get this sorted.

Good luck!

Thank you!

I'm really glad to hear it's not so unusual that he came to my house. That did perturb me. When he followed up with email comment, I found that incredibly strange, a bit much, too personal.

I really appreciate your post. Thank you

(I did one google review. The next time I posted was to ask if the MP I complained to still worked there because his response to my complaint was very overdue. I had to first complain to go to SRA / LO. I agree they'll try to make it seem like I have a vendetta. I wish we just could have settled and moved on.)

You need to instruct a costs lawyer to deal with this for you. It sounds to me, as a former costs lawyer, as though you have a good case to just pay the 3k

He sounds a piece of work.
Can i check though have you paid the agreed amount and settled his bill I full and final settlement. Otherwise won't it drag on

@QueenMegan By agreed amount, do you mean the amount the solicitor has decided to charge me after not keeping any records of his time, and charging for me activities I expressly instructed him not to do, as well as charging me for activities created as a result of the activities I instructed him not to do? If so, no I haven't paid that. I have paid what we discussed at the beginning.

It is a bit like going into Sainsbury's, taking a sandwich to the till, being offered the meal deal, turning it down several times and leaving the shop. But then being stopped at the door when the shop assistant shoves a very surprised you a bottle of fizzy drink, crisps and bag of fruit, as well as the the most expensive yours for life bag, which you wouldn't have needed if you just bought the sandwich, shoving it all in your hands and charging you £7 for it, when the cheese sandwich was £2, then taking you to court when you insist you haven't got the extra £5 and you always said you DIDN'T WANT THE MEAL DEAL.

I have paid for the sandwich as that is all I wanted and I asked several times to leave the rest of the meal deal out! Is that something you would be happy paying for?

As an update for anyone who might want one, the Legal Ombudsman has come back to me saying they are ready to investigate. They need me to get a stay in order to proceed as the case is already slated for trial (in a year).

I need the firm to agree to a stay or it will require a hearing just to get a stay (if they agree, it is quite simple a process).

I wrote to the firm asking them to agree to the stay so that the Legal Ombudsman can do their work, and guess what? They have refused! Even though they are signed up to the Legal Ombudsman. I'm a licensed professional and I honestly would never ever do this. It's quite staggering.

They want to use court resources and a judge's time when the Legal Ombudsman is poised to look into the matter instead. It is strange particularly as said solicitor was always telling me that wherever possible I should always choose to stay out of court, judges don't like hearing cases unnecessarily etc.

It was a sad day that I came across this solicitor. It's not nice to be in dispute, but at least he isn't sending me pictures of his children and ex-partner anymore. Every cloud....

I say trial, I mean hearing, it's late ;p ;p

OP I'm late to this thread and I assume you've seen it already but there is a code of conduct for solicitors. I'll paste a few relevant parts below:

3.1 You only act for clientss on instructions from the clientt, or from someone properly authorised to provide instructions on their behalf. If you have reason to suspect that the instructions do not represent your client'ss wishes, you do not act unless you have satisfied yourself that they do. However, in circumstances where you have legal authority to act notwithstanding that it is not possible to obtain or ascertain the instructions of your clientt, then you are subject to the overriding obligation to protect your client'ss_ best interests.

3.4 You consider and take account of your client'ss_ attributes, needs and circumstances.

7.4 You cooperate with the SRAA_, other regulators, ombudsmen, and those bodies with a role overseeing and supervising the delivery of, or investigating concerns in relation to, legal services.

8.7 You ensure that clientss receive the best possible information about how their matter will be priced and, both at the time of engagement and when appropriate as their matter progresses, about the likely overall cost of the matter and any costss incurred.

I think section 8.7 is most relevant to you because the duty to inform clients of costs is ongoing - not something that is done only at the outset. I was always told while doing my legal education & in practise to inform a client of their costs regularly, especially if the costs are nearing the initial cost estimate.

It also goes without saying that your solicitor should act on your instructions only, and not come up with their own.

Thank you - yes, this is why i was disappointed that the SRA thought it was not in the public interest to look into some parts, and in others, just didn't appear to grasp what had happened. they never really touched on the part about him not following instructions. I think they are just too busy with bigger matters after a covid build up. this truly is small fry, I can see that!

Piggybacking this for a good outcome @merr1goround

Hey, late to the thread. Has all been finalised? Got a decent outcome? I was googling about SRA and solicitors conduct (due to my own issues) and came across this feed. What I feel is that the SRA don't hold solicitors accountable (whereas any normal person would see plainly there is a case in which todo so), as if they are on their side. Im currently in the midst of a complaint against a solicitor for their own conduct and they initially thought nothing was wrong. Which came as a massive shock. So, ive challenged and awaiting a new update. I swear, this behaviour is in the public interest - mostly, due to the way SRA handles complaints and allows solicitors to get away with harming individuals. Something is not right with the process.

So funny you ask!

The Legal Ombudsman came back to me about two weeks ago, maybe you are psychic!, and they have made a determination that I should pay about £1000 more than I have already. they have made the maximum award they can make in quite a few areas, which I am grateful for.

The only thing I am concerned about is that no one actually knows what the actual bill is, as the lawyer kept no ledger of billable hours on the case. So he really has just plucked a number from the air and I am being asked to pay a portion of that. I agree I should pay something because some work was done, however it's difficult to know what that is given only the lawyer would have insight to that! So I do think I am paying a portion of a massively inflated bill, but what can be done? I understand that this is equally hard for the LO to determine.

The next step is to agree the recommendations or not. If I do not, or I want it to go on to the next stage, the LO investigator will produce a report of their findings. I will ask for this. I want something in writing so that I am able to speak about my experience without worrying I am going to be sued for defamation which of course the law firm has already threatened.

A very ugly business......

When you received the bill, did you receive notice that you could have it checked by the courts, and did you consider applying for that?

Had no notice of the sort. This is the first I have heard.

The investigator at the LO has pointed out the areas where service was unacceptable: that I was not updated on fees, received no response to my request for an update on fees, no record on hours spent were kept, and that on two occasions the solicitor went against my instruction (thereby incurring more fees).

When a firm keeps coming back saying 'This is normal and acceptable behaviour so we're taking you to court for the money' it can be quite confusing and intimidating for the layperson. So I'm glad for this outcome and grateful to the LO.