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Original poster

One parent becoming homeless, can the other get full custody?

52 replies

LionsandLambs · 02/01/2023 11:46

My brother is being evicted from his rental property as his landlord is selling. He has joint custody of his daughter but a low income despite working full time. He is struggling to find anything affordable to rent and being turned down because of income. His ex wife is now settled with her new partner and financially stable. All council properties here have long waiting lists and he would likely have to go into a homeless hostel for more than a year before being allocated something. In that time will he be able to have his daughter with him? His ex wife is very worried about her daughter living in a hostel part time. Will she be able to insist the child lives with her full time? He is a good dad and they are amicable but he is obviously very worried about losing custody. There is also an argument that he will be higher priority with a child.

OP posts:
lollipoprainbow · 02/01/2023 12:47

What a sad story and how disgusting that there aren't more affordable rents for people working on low incomes but that's another thread.

I hope he sorts something.

titchy · 02/01/2023 12:51

If he's in a low income and has the majority of care then he'd be entitled to HB as part of UC so rent cost shouldn't be an issue. Does the council have a scheme where they have a list of UC friendly landlords and can provide deposit or guarantor or something?

Original poster
LionsandLambs · 02/01/2023 12:53

iammarleysmummy · 02/01/2023 12:37

If he's a good dad and they're amicable and the children love him then the mother will simply accommodate him, they won't have been to court because good and amicable parents don't end up there. This is for him to sort with his ex wife. You would think she would be helping him also as the father of her children. She'd be inviting him round to spend time with the daughter there, but I wouldn't let my daughter go to a homeless shelter necessarily either. I'd at least check it out.

If the above isn't the case then sorry but one or more is not a good parent and it certainly isn't amicable.

They’re both good parents and the split was amicable with no other parties involved. Ex wife’s circumstances are more complicated in many ways and less stable for their daughter with partner’s children and their (albeit mild) special needs, but financially she is better off.

OP posts:
IneedanewTV · 02/01/2023 12:59

He needs to ring his local council housing office tomorrow. We pay the deposit for property and will pay the rent in advance just to keep people off the streets.

I think it is very sad that single men are treated like this. If he is on low income is there No UC. I also think it is very sad that people assume it is just fine and dandy for a man not to see his child.

Aixellency · 02/01/2023 12:59

entitled to HB as part of UC so rent cost shouldn't be an issue

You’re joking, surely?! Certainly in the area I live in there’s a huge gap between the amount of HB a person can get and the cost of private rental accommodation. Which means a person using up more of their other income to cover the shortfall.

And the likelihood of getting rental property now if you’re on HB … Just impossible.

The lists of benefit friendly landlords is essentially a list of the most exploitative and unpleasant landlords in the country. The ones who want tenants too scared to complain about damp / mould / poor insulation / non-working household goods …

Janedoe82 · 02/01/2023 13:03

A family hostel isn’t the end of the world. Many of them have activities organised for children. In the area I work families can be in them up to 4 years due to shortage of housing and they really do make them as homely as possible.

titchy · 02/01/2023 13:05

IneedanewTV · 02/01/2023 12:59

He needs to ring his local council housing office tomorrow. We pay the deposit for property and will pay the rent in advance just to keep people off the streets.

I think it is very sad that single men are treated like this. If he is on low income is there No UC. I also think it is very sad that people assume it is just fine and dandy for a man not to see his child.

He's the main carer for the child so that will entitle him to UC if his income is low as OP says.

titchy · 02/01/2023 13:07

Can he and his ex visit the family hostel? While not ideal if it is for families it may well be OK for the time being.

Original poster
LionsandLambs · 02/01/2023 14:17

Even with his top up benefits he can’t get anywhere as the landlords are inundated with renters (lots who’ve sold and moving into rentals with 12 months paid upfront according to EA). So he applies to be told he’s been rejected in favour of people on better incomes/rent paid in advance. Her mother is very against the idea of a hostel, she knows where the local one is.

OP posts:
pharaohrocher · 02/01/2023 14:23

Janedoe82 · 02/01/2023 13:03

A family hostel isn’t the end of the world. Many of them have activities organised for children. In the area I work families can be in them up to 4 years due to shortage of housing and they really do make them as homely as possible.

It might not be the end of the world when there is no other option, but would you honestly want your child living part time in a family hostel when they could be in their own home full time? No parent of either sex would want this if they were putting their child's needs first.

Thoughtful2355 · 02/01/2023 14:50

Just so he knows he can only be housed through Council or HA if he's the child benefit claimant.

Original poster
LionsandLambs · 02/01/2023 15:27

Thoughtful2355 · 02/01/2023 14:50

Just so he knows he can only be housed through Council or HA if he's the child benefit claimant.

He is, they agreed he should as primary (just) carer plus much lower income.

OP posts:
bellac11 · 02/01/2023 15:41

titchy · 02/01/2023 12:51

If he's in a low income and has the majority of care then he'd be entitled to HB as part of UC so rent cost shouldn't be an issue. Does the council have a scheme where they have a list of UC friendly landlords and can provide deposit or guarantor or something?

Rent cost will be an issue if the rental rate of HB/UC is less than the rental rate of the property

So for example, he might live in an area where the cheapest one bed flat he can find is 500 quid. But the applicable rent rate that HB is calcuated on, calculates the maximum for a one bed flat to be 400 quid a month

When the therefore receives a proportion of his rent as benefits, its still much much lower than his actual rent.

Its worse if he is single and under 35, he is then restricted to the single room rate, rather than a one bed flat rate.

OP, my advice would be for him to find a shared house/bedsit type arrangement which would be much cheaper than a one bed flat and build up from there.

Original poster
LionsandLambs · 02/01/2023 15:52

bellac11 · 02/01/2023 15:41

Rent cost will be an issue if the rental rate of HB/UC is less than the rental rate of the property

So for example, he might live in an area where the cheapest one bed flat he can find is 500 quid. But the applicable rent rate that HB is calcuated on, calculates the maximum for a one bed flat to be 400 quid a month

When the therefore receives a proportion of his rent as benefits, its still much much lower than his actual rent.

Its worse if he is single and under 35, he is then restricted to the single room rate, rather than a one bed flat rate.

OP, my advice would be for him to find a shared house/bedsit type arrangement which would be much cheaper than a one bed flat and build up from there.

Show quote history

The mum won’t want her to be in a HMO sharing space with strangers. To be honest I’ve also seen hardly any of those, he’s quite rural. One bed flats here start at £1200 pcm, he can just about do that but can’t secure one as gets pipped to the post.

OP posts:
Janedoe82 · 02/01/2023 16:04

pharaohrocher It really depends on the mothers capacity to care for the child full time- she isn’t currently? Why has dad more time than mum? if child is being well looked after by dad I think it is important to continue that rather than leave with a mum full time who may struggle.

Janedoe82 · 02/01/2023 16:07

Has anyone actually asked the child what they want??

Babyroobs · 02/01/2023 16:07

LionsandLambs · 02/01/2023 12:34

Thanks for replies.

Yes, it would be a family hostel not a single man’s one. But obviously if he relinquished custody he’d have to go into a single persons one and then my niece of course could spend time with him at ours. They can’t move in with us as we don’t live near to them.

He has his daughter 60% of the time on average because her mum has a difficult job and her partner has older children with special needs. She doesn’t pay much child maintenance as her income isn’t different to his (her partner earns a lot more but self employed). Brother has a reasonably skilled job but it doesn’t pay enough to afford much where we live and he’s restricted to how far they move out because of the joint childcare, school etc. He is looking into night classes but it’ll take time. He gets tax credits.

If he currently gets the child tax credits for the child as opposed to just working tax credits for himself then he needs to look at whether he would be better off on Universal credit with a rent element included. It's likely he would find a private rental with UC help is considered the child's main carer.

titchy · 02/01/2023 16:10

Its worse if he is single and under 35, he is then restricted to the single room rate, rather than a one bed flat rate

He is the main carer of a child - he'll be entitled to the 2 bed rate so why post this? Confused

Luredbyapomegranate · 02/01/2023 16:18

That’s really difficult OP. I can’t imagine either of them would want her spending time in a hostel. Or is it that the men’s hostel is a much tougher place for your DB than the family one?

It’s good he can spend time with her at yours. It seems the priority is to do something to raise his income, what are his skills and where does he live? (I am assuming you’ve checked out housing associations?)

mathanxiety · 02/01/2023 16:39

The mother (and her partner) can't have their cake and eat it here.

The dad has 60 % custody in order to facilitate the demands of her job and in order to enable her to maintain the current relationship. He's also facilitating the level of care the partner can give to his two children. Right now, the mum is getting a cushy deal and so is her partner.

Mum can't demand the dad snap his fingers and magic up an extra job or money from the money tree to pay for a flat that's suitable for a child to live in.

Either she and her partner need to take the child for 60/40 or more, and facilitate visitation at a suitable place, or they need to pay more child support.

The amount they pay should be calculated based on whether their life choices are sustainable without the help of your brother. His choices are limited by his parenting role while their careers and parenting role are facilitated by your brother.

Daddywaddy · 02/01/2023 16:41

Has he put in a CMS claim? He should do if he is the primary carer and is in a precarious financial position. Either that or they should all work together to ensure dad and daughter don't end up in a hostel.

mathanxiety · 02/01/2023 16:55

How much care does the mum provide for the partner's children? By care I mean even everyday contributions like cooking and laundry. Would she be free to do any of that (if that's what she does) if she had her own child there to care for and ferry around?

I suspect she's letting her new partner take the piss here. It's nice for him not to have an inconvenient child of another man messing up his domestic arrangements or costing him money.

SeasonFinale · 02/01/2023 17:02

mathanxiety · 02/01/2023 16:39

The mother (and her partner) can't have their cake and eat it here.

The dad has 60 % custody in order to facilitate the demands of her job and in order to enable her to maintain the current relationship. He's also facilitating the level of care the partner can give to his two children. Right now, the mum is getting a cushy deal and so is her partner.

Mum can't demand the dad snap his fingers and magic up an extra job or money from the money tree to pay for a flat that's suitable for a child to live in.

Either she and her partner need to take the child for 60/40 or more, and facilitate visitation at a suitable place, or they need to pay more child support.

The amount they pay should be calculated based on whether their life choices are sustainable without the help of your brother. His choices are limited by his parenting role while their careers and parenting role are facilitated by your brother.

The poster already said the ex is also on a low income and paying maintenance in line with her income. It is not for there's partner to pay maintenance just the ex

loislovesstewie · 02/01/2023 17:02

He needs to discuss all of this with the person dealing with the homeless application. Each local authority is different in that what help can be given and whether he could be helped with a deposit to rent privately or even if there is anything suitable to rent. I used to work as a homeless officer and most people are unhappy with having to move into temporary accommodation, but it was suitable for families and was managed by a housing association. How long he might wait to be housed will vary too, so please, just advise him to discuss all this with the appropriate person.

Original poster
LionsandLambs · 02/01/2023 17:18

mathanxiety · 02/01/2023 16:55

How much care does the mum provide for the partner's children? By care I mean even everyday contributions like cooking and laundry. Would she be free to do any of that (if that's what she does) if she had her own child there to care for and ferry around?

I suspect she's letting her new partner take the piss here. It's nice for him not to have an inconvenient child of another man messing up his domestic arrangements or costing him money.

She doesn’t do an awful lot for them, the partner and his ex do the majority really. It’s more that her job has long unsocial hours and the children with special needs (adhd, very disruptive) are quite difficult for my niece to
live with any more than she does.

OP posts:
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