Neighbour damaged boundary wall - council wants me to go 50/50

[TheNefariousOrange]

The boundary wall between me and the neighbour is shared. My house is privately owned but the neighbour is in council. Neighbour had a cherry tree and decided to chop it down themselves, as a result, it tipped and damaged the wall. The wall is in a bad state and now and the council wants me to pay half of it. My argument is that the neighbour shouldn't have chopped down the tree, but where do I stand?

Do you have any receipts for the fence or photos of your garden - which would be digitally timestamped?

You can also check Google maps online or other digital maps. Your council may have aerial photos from different years online.

I don't know why they said that.

Some posters have strange ideas about how much court action costs. This would be a small claim, so you wouldn't need a lawyer and you wouldn't have to pay the other side's costs if you lose.

On the information given, I think you would win, although it is impossible to be certain. It depends on the evidence you and the council put forward.

Would you go back to them then with this new letter?

On Google maps I can see. So 2019 the tree is there and then 2020 the tree has gone and there is substantial damage

I said it because of upset and having an ongoing dispute about the property. It’s always better to settle property disputes if you can. Lawyers , such as other posters, think differently. Most sensible people would try and work out an agreement. If you like the idea of court @TheNefariousOrange then go for it. But presumably it’s the council asking you for money and you are defending. I would make the effort to avoid a dispute and get you firm professional advice from someone who knows about walls!

When did the fence go up? Was it after the Google Maps picture in 2020 with the substantial damage?

OK so I think based on what posters have said this time, I'll go back to my councillor with the letter from the council where they say they have no records of communicating about a cherry tree with the pics off Google maps and the letter from my solicitor saying they accept liability because of the cherry tree that their tenant felled.

Op get back in touch with your MP on this too. If they said they would help before, I'm surprised they closed your case without it being resolved- maybe they have something from the council suggesting the council would deal with it (although MPs office still should have confirmed with you that you were satisfied in this scenario).

Did you take any photos at the time when the cherry tree was felled showing it on top of the wall or next to the wall with fresh looking damage? That would help you a lot. However, it sounds like they may have initially said they would pay to stop you worrying about it and gathering evidence with it was fresh. Now the wall probably just looks like an old tumble-down wall so hopefully you have the photos from when it happened.

Did the tree just affect part of the wall, are they suggesting the whole wall need replacing. She must have had help to cut down a tree , do you remember any tradespeople.

@HappyHamsters I thought the OP had said the council’s surveyors have induced her fence has undermined the wall. Hence they want 50/50.

Yes, but if the Google Earth photos clearly show the damage after the tree was felled but before the fence went up, that is strong evidence that the Surveyors are wrong.

@Lougle It would if the op has proof of when she put the fence up. I’m also querying why any surveyor thinks a fence damages a wall. We also don’t know if it’s just at the tree site the wall is damaged or if it’s in poor repair all the way along. A proper survey of the whole fence would establish that. If the op put up a fence to disguise the whole wall because it’s in poor repair, she might well be obligated to pay 50% irrespective of “tree gate”! Why would you put up a fence to disguise an otherwise perfect wall?

Sorry - survey of the whole wall.

Well, I'm not sure she even needs that. If there are 3 GE photos:

1. Tree in situ, wall in state A
2. Tree felled, wall damaged, no fence
3. Tree felled, wall still damaged, fence erected

Then it isn't the fence.

It gets murkier if photo 3 shows further damage to the wall after the fence was erected.

Have you checked your house deeds. Does it specify your have a (shared?) responsibility to maintain the wall? Usually there are T and H markings on deed plans. If it’s a T it belongs to whoever’s garden the T is in on the map. If it’s an H then it is shared

I'd be furious that my council tax payments were going to pay for the actions of some twat who's already being maasively subsidised, let alone being told I would have to pay as well. Seek legal advice through your insurer.

Because the wall was only 4ft tall and the fence was taller at 6ft to block out crazy egg throwing neighbour

@Lougle I suspect the council are wrong to say a fence has caused damage to a wall. However if the wall is in poor repair for most of its length, then it’s a shared issue. Why would anyone erect a fence to disguise a perfect wall doing its job? I suspect the tree is a red herring which is why the council went 50:50.

Walls are frequently poorly built. No foundations. Incorrect build structure.Not designed to do the job they are built to do. Eg: Often an issue in retaining walls that move due to being unable to withstand the pressure of wet soil piled up behind. Walls are often damaged by tree roots and weakened mortar in the structure allows loose bricks to move and the wall fail. All of this could be an issue as well as a tree falling on it.

OP the letter from your solicitor pretty strong evidence that conversations were had at the time confirming that the cherry tree felling was to blame. Even if you have nothing from the council side, it is still very likely to be seen as evidence. The Google photos also help your cause. Screen shot them. Sometimes they go away online.

Your fence went up two years after the event. It's not attached in any way to the wall.

It must be so frustrating that no one at the council is taking this all on board.

I'd send images of the dated Google images, the solicitors letter and of the fence not attached to the wall and send it to everyone with a letter outlining that this is clearly not your issue. The neighbour damaged the wall and as with any time anyone damages anything, it is their responsibility to make good. Age that any further attempts at them to contact you over this will constitute harassment.

@TizerorFizz Why would anyone erect a fence to disguise a perfect wall doing its job?

Again, because the wall was low at only 4 ft and the neighbour is a crazy egg throwing lunatic so the OP built a 6ft fence inside her property line

That still does not indicate if the wall is in good nick or not. That’s what matters. I could lob an egg over a 6ft wall
or fence!

Even if a wall look shite, no one can force you to replace it. It broke due to the tree. The council initially acknowledged this. They would have to prove the wall was dangerous or falling down prior to the tree. There was no evidence that it was.

@petticuliar Says who? Have we seen a pix of all of it?

Indeed, there's no evidence that my fence caused damage. I don't have photos as this happened when I was at work and the neighbour literally came and told me she'd chopped the cherry tree down and damaged the wall.

The previous owners had a fence attached to the wall and I'm starting to wonder if they mean that is what caused the weakening of the wall? I can't see why though as looking at Google maps, that was already erected in 2009 and I'm guessing the damage would have been obvious before the tree incident, not when a tree that was literally taller than a 2 story house fell on the wall.