Taking child on holiday

[Name99]

Hi, I need advice on how to obtain permission from the court to take a child on holiday.
I know for access a form can be downloaded to apply yourself, cutting out the need for solicitors
Is there a similar process for taking a child on holiday?
The child is 17, the ex will dispute out of pure spite.
Can anyone advise please ?
Thanks

That is true for most orders but not 'lives with' child arrangements orders/residence orders see s91(10) and (10A) Children Act 1989 www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1989/41/section/91

Would it not be quicker, easier, cheaper and less stressful to just wait til they’re 18? I don’t really understand the necessity of a holiday abroad, sorry.

This order specifies 18
So is this order saying the non resident parent as was described in the court order take the child or not in your opinion?

If you've got time maybe give CAB a call they're pretty good and it won't cost you.
Good luck it's awful when children are used in a private war between parents.

I can’t imagine a 17 year old being stopped travelling given you can fly from 16 on every airline? Certainly most. Or just wait until they are 18? If it’s causing so much drama, and unnecessary angst don’t go but no court in any country, anywhere is going to order a 17 year old who is travelling happily back to their “resident parent” how could they even achieve that? Arrest someone and deport them?

It’s a shared residence order. A resident parent can remove the child from the jurisdiction for up to a month without the consent of the other parent. With a shared residence order, you’re both the resident parents so either of you can do this. If you want to play it safe, make an application for a section 8 Specific Issue Order, but I don’t actually think you need to.

@Name99 I got a court order to say that I could take DD out of the country without her fathers consent.

This was after he withdrew consent he had previously given and threatened to contact police etc if I tried to take her on the holiday he had previously agreed to....

Court order stands until she's 18....it was expensive though

What happens if 17yo wants to fly by themselves or go somewhere with mates?

The ex made it clear if the 17yr old attempted that they would ring the police etc.
The child did want to do this but was scared to do so.
This is someone who handed in the notice of a part time job the 17yr old had as they didn't want them working

I feel sorry for you OP and even sorrier that so few people on this thread seem unable to actually read your question. Instead seem intent on telling you nonsense like 'you probably won't get stopped' (whether you will or not is irrelevant. It's illegal. )

So your question. Yes you can apply for a specific steps order. About £215 for court fee. You probably end up having to go through the motions of requesting consent but don't let them time waste and run the clock down on your departure.
I would say . I need a consent letter to take x away to x country. Please reply by supply by (give 5-7 day time limit) . When not forthcoming call mediation service and request urgent mediation. They will contact the other parent who will either consent or refuse. Refusal most likely - get mediator to sign off and go straight to court for a hearing.

Number of slots are kept back each day for urgent applications.
You don't need a solicitor for this if you are half way competent (self representation is v common in such cases)
Good luck

10 years ago I used to go away with my older boyfriend abroad when I was 16 without any parental consent you literally just go through the airport.

Couldn't you both go through separately? Then there is less chance of them questioning you.

@Hm2020 things have changed since then. A couple of years ago DD2 went on a hiking holiday in Turkey with a school friend and her parents. As she was 17, we didn’t think we needed to provide a letter of consent - indeed, the airline didn’t require anything over the age of 16. We couldn’t immediately see anything on gov.uk either (it was hidden away in a bit about parental consent for travel, which we hadn’t looked at).

DD2 was held at U.K. immigration for four hours because “she couldn’t prove she hadn’t been to Syria.” DD is a British Citizen. She is not Muslim, was wearing hiking gear, and nothing about her suggested that she was a jihadi bride.

DH was waiting for her in the arrivals hall, but they refused to contact him or let him come through. They wouldn’t let one of her friend’s parents wait with her either, though obviously they did tell DH when they got through.

So yes, I would get a consent letter.

There is no border control on exit from the UK. So, what would potentially happen, is that on border control at the second country, checks would be made. Unlikely, but not impossible.
Likewise, there could be a check made on re-entry to the UK where there is border control.

@Hm2020 that's not true. I started my job in 1991 and one of the entry level training points is, and has been since at least then- see someone under 18 travelling either alone or with one adult (especially if that adult is male) then make enquiries as and if you see fit.

That's the important thing really. As and if you see fit. A 17 year old who probably looks 18 going to Rome with her Dad? Will probably "pass". A 6 year old going to Pakistan with her Dad? Not going to happen without seeing those consent docs . For various reasons.

It's important to interpret the laws and guidelines correctly too. The resident parent can travel without asking for consent. BUT absence of a negative (consent) doesn't mean consent has been given and the non resident parent, as has been said, CAN still refuse.

All of this is moot really as we have a 17 year old and a (if I'm reading correctly) a non resident father wanting to travel. To be on the safe side, he needs proper legal advice particularly as it's been a difficult situation throughout. The 17 year olds wishes will absolutely be taken into consideration.

OP I've been in your exact position - acrimonious divorce and asshole ex who would try anything to piss me off, no matter what the consequence for the dc.

Here's what I did. Firstly advisethem of the holiday, in writing, by email/text so that you have a paper trail. Ask for consent for a legitimate family holiday, to be given by x date. .

When the consent isn't forthcoming, acknowledge the date having passed and advise you will be seeking permission through the court.

Then fill out the form and submit it. Pay the fee and wait for it to come up.

It was a really straightforward process, and the judge sighed and gave me the permission - it was actually a residency order, not at all what I'd applied for but kids were with me almost 100% and I had the evidence the ex was being obstructive. Do you have written evidence from the police and ss confirming they recommend dc lives with you? I think I'd be applying for the order to be fully updated, but the holiday is priority.

Honestly I saved a fortune applying myself - I had a hugely empowering solicitor who pushed me to DIY as she was so sure it was a black and white case. It took 20 minutes max in court,and my ex didn't even show up.

It sounds like your dc has got the measure of their other parent.

Are you absolutely sure the current order doesn't give you the right to leave the country for up to one month without permission. This is usually the case (as with my order for my DD13)

Thank you.
Thank you very much that's exactly the advice I was looking for.

As I said yesterday it's a C100, specific issues order.

I attached a copy of the order upthread

Thank you for peoples advice, it's the specific orders order that's needed which is what I wanted to know to keep costs down

It's such a sad situation, nothing actually surprises us anymore from the ex.
We keep saying it will all improve when the child is 18, but it won't, the ex is clinging on to the last few bits of legal control, when the child is 18 control has gone and that will really tip them over the edge.
The child is starting to see the reality of it all and what has been happening for years it's an incredibly sad situation

Thank you for your advice

What a knob cheese. My ex used to try this all the time. I just faked a permission letter and was never once asked for it. I was asked who my DS was and our relationship when we went to Turkey but nothing more.

Disclaimer- I’m NOT suggesting you do this. I’m offering support and telling you what I personally did. I was able to get away with it because the ex was just posturing and wasn’t really involved/interested in DS. It sounds as though your ex is more interested in your child and would notice if they were gone. My ex didn’t notice we’d moved 100 miles for 18 months 😆

Because as she said he is an abusive spiteful arsehole. Nothing strange about that there's many of them around unfortunately

Judge told me that I had to live in England or Wales until dc turn 16yrs old, and could not travel abroad for a holiday for more than 28days until they reached 16yrs old.

Exh has tried to have us stopped at airports but I provided evidence of giving substantial notice of travel plans by email to exh, and proof of return flights with 28days.

Exh never succeeded in stopping our holidays, but has succeed in alienating his dc who deeply resent his controlling behaviour. It has caused/continues to cause deep resentment.

We have been restricted by which countries we have been able to visit, no where that requires a visa.

Name99 I would have this moved to Legal. You will get a lot of opinion in AIBU that really has no relevance in law.. there are a few excellent family lawyers/barristers there who should be able to interpret the order.
It looks like to me (law degree but not lawyer ) that you have shared residency and therefore each can take on holiday for up to 28 days without permission of the other.

You may also get some good advice from the Coram legal centre. A charity dedicated to child rights.

I have used them for a dispute where the parent applied to move my husbands children to a non Hague convention country. They have excellent advice which assisted me in writing the opposing statement.. and the request was refused.

www.childrenslegalcentre.com/

Clpsmum

Because as she said he is an abusive spiteful arsehole. Nothing strange about that there's many of them around unfortunately

I know it's probably against MN law.. but pretty sure the poster here is the dad and it's the mum who is being the knob head..

The OPs post at 17:43 yesterday.

The child did live with the mother more than the father, the child has since decided that they want to spend more time with the father
The father wants to take the child on holiday