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Advice please - Court summons for increased access

46 replies

NaamahDust · 10/05/2014 14:27

I have been a single parent since the birth of my daughter who is nearly 6. Her father is registered on the birth certificate and has had regular access to her since she was born. He requested every Sunday day - so I granted him that. A few years later he then "offered" to help mid-week and since then also has her every Wednesday evening into Thursday morning. He then asked to have her every other Saturday night, which I also granted. (this has now somehow turned into every Saturday night). He asked for additional time with her in the school holidays, which I have granted.

However his most recent request has been for 50-50 split in the holidays, which I have not granted. I have retrained as a teacher (leaving a significantly better paid job) so that there was someone to care for her during this time. I have no family nearby and he had never given an indication that he would want to share the time.
He suggested mediation as a precursor to taking me to court. I agreed, made an appointment, but had to postpone it as they wanted the full fee up front and I did not (nor still do) have the money to pay it. I was intending to go during the next school holiday, however I have today received a court summons.

My question is: how likely is he to get the 50-50? He states his reason being to spend more time with his family, yet she sees his family (which are local) every fortnight, and sees my family only three times a year on average. I know the courts are trying to be very pro-father, so am I onto a losing battle? He also has plenty of money for solicitors, legal advice etc which I do not. Will the courts recognise this or is he going to be able to effectively buy what he wants? I do not qualify for legal financial assistance as I work.

Also any advice as to how to act in court - i.e. what sort of things to say, and what not to say?

Many thanks in advance.

OP posts:
SuperSnowWoman · 11/05/2014 10:55

Shock horror he 'insists on separate clothes'. God forbid the child feels at home with her Dad.
I suspect you would like her to view it as 'visiting' her Dad, packing her off with clothes to stay over.
Sorry OP, but my ex is similar to yours, and it makes me feel like they want/need to be in control and are intimidated about me being part of OUR son's life.
I understand you feel that you have done the hard yards (which isn't the case in my situation I add), however surely it is in your child's best interest to facilitate this. Not yours from your point of view but this child does have two parents, that unfortunately aren't together, but that isn't their fault. There is no reason that you have mentioned that suggests you are an any more important parent that her father. You acting like it will only frustrate him- and rightly so in my opinion.

WhateverHappenedToJasonStyles · 11/05/2014 11:14

Do you have a way of contacting the mother of his older child?

tribpot · 11/05/2014 13:23

So he took the other ex to court and now has reduced contact? That sounds somewhat worrying and makes me think you should consult a solicitor to see what effect that might have on this application.

The Wednesday night does not sound in the best interest of your dd. After school she needs time to wind down, do homework (increasingly so as she gets older) and have tea. If all she does is drive (how many miles?) to his house and go to sleep, I'm not sure what that gets either of them. How early is she having to get up to get back to school?

I think SuperSnowWoman is echoing the sentiments we've made previously about your choice of language - she is entitled to contact with her father and for him to be part of her life.

NaamahDust · 11/05/2014 14:43

Balia - I am already a teacher, and have been for 3 years, so I am well aware of the stress and pressure of the job. I work every night once my daughter is in bed, and many times over the holidays. But at least I get the daytimes with her. Plus we are able to travel to visit family and friends.
Thanks for the tip re: CAFCASS, I'll look into that.

OP posts:
NaamahDust · 11/05/2014 14:49

SuperSnowWoman - I didn't think of that with the clothes, I just thought it seemed silly for her to have to have two sets, and us have to keep giving each other back the clothes. I saw it as her having her worn stuff (regardless at which house), but he requests back whatever she has worn from his house.

I do hope I don't act like I am a more important parent, I have always tried to foster a good relationship between my daughter and her father. I wasn't in touch with him when I discovered I was pregnant and some people (who knew him) even suggested I didn't put him on the birth certificate or tell him, but I didn't agree - I thought she had a right to know her father and him to be in her life. I'm glad he is, and I'm glad of all the things he can offer than I can't. I've never once given her any indication that I don't think he's the best daddy in the world.

I'll definitely be more mindful of my choice of language, I appreciate the comments.

OP posts:
NaamahDust · 11/05/2014 14:55

WhateverHappenedToJasonStyles - potentially, and someone else has suggested this, although not quite sure what I would say! When she found out about my pregnancy apparently she wished the baby "dead" but that is on his hearsay. He was always terrified we would have contact (I don't know her) and one time when she did actually send messages to mutual friends on Facebook (although never to myself) he went absolutely bonkers.
He also told me in no uncertain terms to stay away from his family too - his sister had contacted me and asked to stay in touch, and he didn't want me to have any link whatsoever with his own life. I could contact her if I needed to, I didn't contact her again after he asked me to stay away as I didn't want to get involved in any family dispute. I figured she knew where I was if she wanted to "defy" her brother and contact me. Perhaps that was the wrong thing to do in hindsight?
I should point out that I didn't really have a relationship with this man, it was just a casual affair that ended very quickly, but I didn't find out about my pregnancy until some months later. So there's never been any closeness and he has always been adamant that I stay away from him and his life, which I've been happy to do, having never really been part of it.

OP posts:
NaamahDust · 11/05/2014 15:01

Tribpot - it does seem odd, although I'm conscious that I don't know any facts. When I "knew" him he saw his other child every weekday to take her to school, and every Saturday. No regular overnight stays. No idea about summer holidays although I did spend one Xmas with him and he did not have 50% of the holiday with her, not even close. I understand (from him) that once the mother found out about my pregnancy she stopped him having any contact at all with his other child, hence the progression to court. I thought (memory is a bit hazy, I was dealing with a newborn at the time) he won the case, but despite having my daughter midweek, sometimes on Saturdays, and for extra time in the holidays, my daughter has never met her sister. This indicates that the contact has changed significantly to what it was prior to the court case. Had I asked him details I do not believe he would have answered as he was always very keen to keep his life very private and I respected that.

OP posts:
NaamahDust · 11/05/2014 15:19

Can I just take this opportunity to thank ALL of you for taking time out to offer advice and comment, I really do appreciate it.
It's hard to talk to friends and family as they are naturally "on your side" and having seen the hurt and upset he caused in the early days, they automatically see everything he does as a negative.
I'm definitely starting to rethink my stance on some things thanks to you lot, I genuinely only want the best life for my daughter, whatever that entails. She's the most amazing little girl and I adore her more than I can express. But you all understand that as you are parents too :-)

OP posts:
RandomMess · 11/05/2014 16:35

It is completely about putting your dds interests first and I honestly do think EOW with her Mum and half the holidays with her Mum is in her interests, just as much as it is with her Dad. Hopefully he will see that having her Fri after school until Mon morning will replace the midweek and be better for her and that half the holidays in blocks will replace the every Sat night & Sunday.

I think now she is getting older it is an appropriate time to revise contact schedul to be in her best interests and you can even bring up that perhaps the next natural review time will be when she starts secondary school. The start going to bed much later and she may well want to be taken out for tea by her did midweek etc.

3xcookedchips · 11/05/2014 18:13

The sense of entitlement from some of the contributors will never cease to amaze me...OP you come across as if you're doing him a favour.

The only entitlement that really matters is the one in which your daughter is to have a relationship with BOTH parents and she should be able to feel BOTH parents are involved in their education and upbringing.

Reducing the time your daughter sees her father to every two weeks when she had been used to every week is NOT in her interests.

This situation does not require court.

NaamahDust · 11/05/2014 21:53

3xcookedchips - I don't mean to, so another point for me to take on board, thank you.

I don't wish to reduce anytime at all, that's definitely not my intention. The current arrangements aren't working very well though (from my point of view, I appreciate that is very subjective) as we can't do much on the weekend, or get away much in the holidays due to the mid-week arrangement. I thought it was a good opportunity to have a rethink altogether about what would be best, and many people have suggested EOW, not just people here. I take it you don't agree? Would you recommend arrangements remaining as is, and adding in the extra holidays? What about keeping the midweek during termtimes, changing the weekend arrangements to full EOW and then splitting the holidays, but removing the mid-week during the holidays so it's all simple week-long blocks for both of us?

OP posts:
STIDW · 11/05/2014 22:39

Changing from every Saturday night to Sunday evening to every other weekend isn't necessarily a decrease in contact. Contact could start Friday after school and end Sunday as usual so there is no reduction.

Contact should be practical and meet the changing needs of children. Younger children "need" frequent shorter spells of contact so they can develop and maintain their bond with a parent. School aged children tend to be more settled with less frequent longer periods of contact with fewer handovers. Sharing the quality time every other weekend and during the school holidays 50:50 is an arrangement that suits many children.

That doesn't prevent contact during the school week, but rather than it being midweek it can be at the beginning or end of the week so it is added onto every other weekend, if that is less disruptive for older children. For example, contact could start Thursday collecting from school and end with dropping off at school Monday morning every other week and there would be no reduction in the contact overall.

Relationships and regular contact with extended family is important, but not more so than spending quality time with parents. There needs to be a balance. As I said above contact needs to be practical and there is no point in a parent insisting they have children at times they are unavailable to care for children and require assistance from extended family and friends much of the time when the other parent is free and willing to care for them. Sharing school holidays 50:50 may not be practical if a parent only has 4 weeks leave a year and needs to take some days off sometimes to accept deliveries, let in workmen, see their bank manager or whatever.

STIDW · 11/05/2014 22:41

PS It is fairly common for the regular contact arrangement during term time to be suspended during the school holidays.

3xcookedchips · 11/05/2014 22:42

The following is considered the 'default'...

EOW
One mid week over night
Half the school holidays, typically that works out at least 6 weeks/year for state schools.
Mid week would be suspended to accomodate hols
Fathers day spent with father
Mothers day spent with mother
Bank holidays alternated

Any other arrangements to be agreed etc e.g. how Xmas gets split...

Where's the contention?

BluebellTuesday · 11/05/2014 22:49

For example, contact could start Thursday collecting from school and end with dropping off at school Monday morning every other week and there would be no reduction in the contact overall.

I think this would be a good solution, as it is less disruptive than the mid-week Wednesday and then a Friday pick-up again.

And I also don't think it is entitled to want to spend a full weekend with your DC; or a full week holiday; it is fairly normal. With a school age DC, that is surely in everyone's interests as both parents would get this opportunity in an EOW arrangement with the holidays split. I would say this is also less tiring for DC than ferrying back and forth, and they get time to be a bit more settled with the other parent.

Anyway, I hope you get it sorted, OP.

STIDW · 11/05/2014 22:54

As far as I'm aware there is no default. Children aren't possessions to be divided between their parents. Living and contact arrangements are based around the welfare of children and meeting their changing needs. There is no single arrangement which suits all families, or even most families.

NaamahDust · 11/05/2014 23:23

3xcookedchips - the 'default' you describe is better that the current arrangements. The reason I have resisted any further change is because the current situation isn't 1) what we agreed 2) what's best for my daughter & I. However the outline above is not only fair, but suits all sides best I think and also addresses both these points of contention.

STIDW - indeed, there's still the issue of whether she would be spending the increased holiday time with her father and not someone else, which is what I believe will be the case as he works fulltime (as do I, but my holidays coincide with my daughter's) - but I guess there's not much I can do about that unless / until it happens?

Thank you BlueBellTuesday! I intend to still pursue the mediation as planned (not least because the court papers claim I refused which is factually incorrect), and if still necessary will attend the court date. It's a while off yet, so in the meantime I have lessons to plan, students to prepare for exams, an assembly to give tomorrow, additional tests to arrange, detentions to over-see, marking, observations to prepare for... roll on half term when I can take a breath and start concentrating on this :-)

You've all been great, thanks.

OP posts:
3xcookedchips · 11/05/2014 23:57

Stidw, you may not refer to it as default which is why I quoted it, and also is subject to proximity between parents and school which is when courts do tend to favour it.

Most parents will only get 4-5 weeks annual leave. That doesn't mean children can not spend time with wider family members or however the parents want to arrange their children's time for that extra week.

Children are not possessions but try telling that to those who have that believe in ownership...not aimed at you OP.

SolidGoldBrass · 12/05/2014 00:58

This sounds to me like yet another controlling dickhead of a man whose main intention is to score points and make the OP jump through hoops rather than actually maintain a good relationship with his DD. He 'forbids' any contact between OP and the rest of his family? He's not the OP's boss or owner and she can tell him to do one as he has no right of veto over her contact with other people.

balia · 12/05/2014 18:02

Well that should sort out the delicate negotiations a treat, SGB. Thank goodness we don't have to bother with what is best for the child, eh, if we can just write off every father who wants to spend time with his DC as a controlling dickhead. Problem solved, OP!

lostdad · 13/05/2014 13:41

SolidGoldBrass - He's not the OP's boss or owner and she can tell him to do one as he has no right of veto over her contact with other people.'

I agree. It is completely inappropriate for someone to decide who someone else who they can and can't see.

I can see the irony however that this thread is about, erm, deciding when a little girl is allowed to see her dad.

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