Mother facing prison for allegedly lying about her address on a school application

[SomeGuy]

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1179968/Mother-facing-year-jail-trying-son-better-school.html

Basically she put her mother's address down.

She claims she left her husband for 3 weeks to move in with mother then changed her mind and decided to move back in. Dangerous claim if you ask me, could be compounding things with perjury.

But, it's bloody ridiculous that people have to do this. I'm sure she'd be a credit to the school, obviously a motivated parent, and 99% of a 'good' school is having good kids/supportive parents.

(Port & Lemon - lol @ the Bank Robbers!)

The 'we split up then got back togerher is a very well worn one' - some parents in one of my children's reception class did this (the mum supposedly moved into a tiny flat next to the school with the 2 children, whole the dad strayed in big posh house furhter away - as if!!!) and 'got away with it' from the school's POV, but some parents kew, told all the rest of us, they were ostracised, and moved away after a year.

I feel for her. ALl very well to stand in judgment when you live near a good school. It's a constant worry to me; what school will my children get in to.. and the answer is probably the one that is known for miles around as 'the shit one'.

MrsguyOfGisbourne, that's what happened to me unfortunately as we weren't married. My x is still in the lovely victorian villa on atree lined avenue that we lived in for 8 yrs. I live in hovelsville. So, i suppose it's not beyond the realms of feasability, from the schools pov.

I hate the way councils and police seem to be getting all arsey and ott about using the law to respond to fairly minor crimes though. It's like using the terrorism act to spy on and prosecute people who let their dogs shit everywhere and ASBOing people for whistling. Yes, dog shit on the pavements is shit in all senses of the word and yes, lying about your address to get your kid into some perceivedly super pinner primary school is wrong but terrorism acts and magistrates courts and prison are ridiculous responses. Tell the fuckers to clean up their dog shit and give them a fine. Don't let the lying ones' kids into the school. Problem solved. Courts and prisons freed up for suspected violent scumbags and serious crims.

So, MsMargotBeauregarde, do you also feel for the children who genuinely live in catchment for the school but can't get in because of lying tossers like this woman?

The reality is that she won't get a prison sentence though - at least I would sincerely hope not. It's about making an example of her so that other parents considering such actions will think twice.

Not sure it's the right way to go about it though - surely "you've lied on the application form and the place we offered is withdrawn and your child is allocated a place at ...." is more appropriate. Unless of course she has continued to lie about her address after the place was offered. A scenario I suspect is likely as they are making such a big fuss about it.

I think it's awful that people lie and cheat to get their children into a school ahead of other children who might just make the list otherwise. However, I think it's equally awful that there are so many failing schools and people feel driven to behave like this.

I am in an area where there are several failing schools - DS is fortunate enough not to be in one of these. he is at the local Catholic school. I am not catholic and do not go to church - it was my school of choice as all my nieces went there and were very happy. DS got a place after reaching the top of a waiting list.

(sorry, I meant "MsMargotBeauregarde and anyone else who feels for the woman". I'm not jus tbeing personal (

Well of course I feel for anybody whose child ends up in a shit school.

Perhaps though, I feel more sympathy for parents who are right up against it from DAY ONE for not even living in a nice area with a good school on their doorstep. Double disadvantage. It's not fair to just expect people who live near shit schools to accept their lot. I don't think she's a tosser. I think she's an ambitious parent. And thanks to her, her son probably WILL end up doing well.

I don't know, the way I feel about dogshit on pavements at the moment, there's a part of me that is delighted to hear that the terrorism act is being used on filthy gits who leave their dog's shit on the pavement. Being jumped by the SAS while the dog is in mid shite is looking like a proportionate response to me right now.

She is in a nice area with a good school on her doorstep.

The Ofsted Report on Kenmore Park says:

"Kenmore Park First is a good and improving school under the excellent leadership of the headteacher. It has some outstanding features. Parents think very highly of the school ... High quality personal care and consistently good attention to the needs of each pupil ensures their behaviour is excellent at all times. Their manners too are impeccable. ... Pupils' spiritual, moral, social and cultural education is also top notch ... This is an ambitious school that sets challenging targets, which pupils meet ... Pupils enthusiastically undertake their activities and work at a brisk pace because of the good expectations that are set. Relationships are very good..."

OK, there are some drawbacks, and it's not as good as Pinner Park's Ofsted, but it strikes me as a very good school. If someone sees going there as such a terrible fate for her child that she's prepared to cheat and lie and break the law to avoid his going there, then she is a tosser .

I think there are 2 weaknesses to that argument

1. You are assuming that OFSTED reports are a reliable currency.

1. The suitability of schools for your individual child is not dependent on OFSTED reports.

On that basis, I absolve her of being a tosser.

This sort of thing really pees me off. We have a very very good grammar nearby, but hardly any truly local kids get in because there are so many holiday home owners who use that as their address, and our local primaries are pretty shit.

Those drawbacks:

"Kenmore Park is a larger than average school with a nursery. It serves a socially and ethnically mixed area. Many of its families have significant social and economic need. Almost three quarters of pupils speak English as an additional language. Sizable groups are of Asian Indian, White British, Asian British and Black African backgrounds. The proportion who are entitled to free school meals is above average. The proportion of pupils who enter or leave the school mid-year is much higher than typically found. Around one quarter come from refugee or asylum seeker families."

Must be very hard having 3/4 of your pupils not native English speakers.

The previous report said only 41%!

"This is an urban school with 307 pupils, including 52 part-time pupils taught in the Nursery. Around 41 per cent of pupils have English as an additional language, which is very high, and 90 per cent of the pupils come from minority ethnic groups, which is also very high. The school has 50 refugee
pupils. Mobility of pupils entering and leaving the school during the course of each year is very high, with 22 per cent of the school population changing. This turnover is increasing. Attainment on entry to the school is very low."

We have a very very good grammar nearby, but hardly any truly local kids get in because there are so many holiday home owners who use that as their address, and our local primaries are pretty shit.

Actually grammar schools usually have comparatively very large catchment areas - because they are rejecting nearby pupils if they fail the exam. Selection by ability is much fairer than selection by ability to buy a house next door.

The problem is the primary school, or perhaps the parents, rather than the holiday homes.

and btw Kenton is a shithole.

Attainment on entry to the school is very low. Those same pupils (the low-achieving ones who typically have English as a second language) are achieving average results by the time they get to Year 2.

That implies that the school is doing a pretty darn good job.

If the school is getting results, I don't think that having 3/4 of the pupils not native English speakers should be an issue for the parents. It makes the school's job more difficult, but their results suggest they have risen to the challenge.

If parents just plain don't want their children educated alongside lots of children with English as a second or third language, they should stump up the cash to go private . I genuinely don't see it as a disadvantage (now, I can think of several schools where a high proportion of the children have English as a second or third language and the school is really not coping with that challenge at all well, and I do see that as a disadvantage -- it's in the management of the situation rather than the pure numbers that issues lie).

Given that (according to the Daily Mail) the mother is "Indian born" I would have thought she would have a good understanding that being an immigrant and/or not speaking English as your first language is not necessarily the worst thing in the world. In any case lying on the application form clearly wasn't her only option, as she is now sending her son to an expensive private prep school.

My children were very happy at a school that was not assessed in any category as outstanding, and that had SATS below average (high proportion of children moving in and out of catchment and a SEN behavioural unit). I didn't consider lying to try and get into the two oversubscribed schools (and in fact on visiting I would not have wanted my children to go there). Results are not the whole story.

Kenton isn't a million miles from where I'm from. When the time comes, my situation is similar - one primary school which has great difficulties with a high refugee/asylum seeking/English as a 2nd language issues, the other one much less so, with better Ofsted results. I could lie about my address very easily but I honestly cannot bring myself to do it. I know a few who have done so...

Are Ofsted reports that much of an indicator? My DH worked in a school and says that he's seen how things are manipulated for the benefit of the inspection. Furthermore, in my own experience at primary school, I know one guy who went to the same (crappy) primary and secondary schools as me but he graduated with a first class degree from Cambridge. A good school is only part of the story, methinks...

Kenton isn't a "shithole" but not a nice as Pinner where the school she wanted her child to go to is located (although personally Pinner makes me shudder). There are large, detached expensive houses in Kenton where a sizable Jewish community live, the other side is less salubrious but not rough. Have met plenty of parents like her.