Drugs company hid evidence that antidepressant *caused* suicide in teenagers

[edam]

This is why you can't trust drugs companies.

report here

It doesn't just have bad side effects for children. Even young adults in their early twenties have suffered.

I was on that drug when I was 21 for PND. It made me worse, I was nasty on that, I beat up DH (something i am not proud of) while on it.

I don't know what you think, but I believe that GPs and the NHS are letting people down by not carrying out routine follow-up checks after prescribing anti-depressants to find out whether the treatment is working or causing issues, and also that these tablets are being prescribed too widely without looking at additional or alternative treatment methods, such as therapy/counselling.

It's the same with blood pressure medication, the contraceptive pill, hormone replacement therapy etc etc - for some patients getting the right medication balance and type takes time and effort, but many patients accept the prescription and then try to get on with it without being re-called to find out how it's suiting them. I've known people with all sorts of problems, simply because they didn't know there were alternatives that could be tried which would suit them better.

mylovely, the regulatory bodies can't weigh up the evidence if the drugs companies hide it. And our regulatory system clearly has very serious shortcomings - they have admitted there is no sanction they can impose on GSK.

As for an 'anti' press, it took a great deal of very hard work over a very long time to uncover the story. It was done out of a sense of responsibility, not to sell newspapers (as it happens, the publication that exposed the cover-up was a subscription-only magazine so it had no effect on sales at all). What's more this sort of investigative journalism is very costly in terms of time and resources so it's not something done lightly.

And drugs companies spend more on marketing than they do on R&D - there are many times more positive (PR-based) stories on drugs than there are negative ones.

Well, as I said, if data has been hidden it will be found out, and as for sanctions - the share price is in a very poor state, which hurts the company where it counts, believe me.
I find the possibility odd - I know that these days, at least, the regulatory bodies have a huge input into clinical trial design early on so that a wide range of important questions get addressed and tested for - so how then data can be witheld when they're so closely involved?

Not being directly involved, I am naive perhaps, and I accept that, but I remain sceptical whenever such stories come up, and I see the upshot in that the whole industry is trashed and drugs are withdrawn which has an impact on patients who may have benefitted from them.

I've yet to see a positive drugs story!

Anyway, I'm not an expert. Just thought another view on this thread might be useful.

My Ex Dh took Seroxat he was a depressive and had anxiety he had tried to commit suicide before in his younger years

Seroxat changed him from being mild mannered quiet man who wouldn't hurt a fly to a maniac who broke my foot, my jaw, split my head open, and tried to set fire to me,
he tried to commit suicide on numerous occasions in many strange scenarios and was admitted countless time to a mental hospital till a DR took him off seroxat since he came off it he is back to being mild and quiet still suffers from bouts of depression but to know where near the extent

He signed up for the class action about Seroxat and I think that this drug should have been contained quicker, I understand this sounds unbelievable and to blame this on one drug sounds melodramatic but the change in him was so sudden when he started taking it and when he stopped

Hmmm - think I am quite naive about this, but then I always give people the benefit of doubt. Will watch and learn.
Peanutbear - incredible story. Absolutely dreadful........

edam was it WDDTY that exposed it?

No, it was Health Which?, part of the Consumers' Association. Panorama came along shortly afterwards. But IIRC they broadcast first as their lead-in times are shorter.

I knew someone that committed suicide and she was using Seroxat .

I thought GP's no longer prescribe this AD? I thought seroxat was an old type AD and not an SSRI?

Anyway, I have heard awful stories about Seroxat. It should be banned shouldn't it?

dittany - I too was on a low dose of Citalopram and remember feeling worse, I stopped taking it. someone else I know had the same experience - she felt suicidal on it.

If data is being witheld and it's found to result in injury or death, then the person/people responsible ought to be prosecuted under criminal law.

I had a horrendous experience on citalopram - I had hallucinations (no history whatsoever) and became very dissociated. I was convinced there was somebody else in my body and I'd been hijacked. kept asking dh is he was sure I was me
also became deeply suicidal on prozac.
SSRIs do not suit me. Modern tricyclics do.

OhYouBadBadKitten - I too was having hallucinations on citalopram, it was awful. I was going to go back to my GP about my worsening PMT, she recommend Prozac at last appt, but reading what you wrote I don't think I will now.

My DH went to his GP when he was 18 slightly depressed. He was prescribed Seroxat and his depression got much worse - within three weeks he was suicidal and regularly hallucinating.
Instead of considering the drugs might be a trigger his GP prescribed higher doses and valium and citalopram all at the same time. DH tried to kill himself three times and ended up on a psyc ward. It took him months to recover.
A decade on, DH is a v calm and happy chap. He is prone to occasional bouts of mild depression (which run in the family) and manages them with exercise - something his GP failed to suggest and he had to work out on his own. He also says removing all artificial ingredients from his diet helped significantly.

Bottom line is, DH said that at the time his GP did nothing but pile more drugs into him rather than suggest any alternatives. This has left him with such a negative view on drugs that he won't even take aspirin for a migraine, and has at times caused problems. He also has unresolved discomfort around doctors and hospitals.

GSK - who knew of the side effects, should be punished for what they did to a generation of depressive teenagers and I can't believe there's such a gaping loophole in the law. It's bloody disgusting and I wish I could turn back the clock so that DH and his family didn't have to go through such a pointless, avoidable and traumatic ordeal

I recognise what Upwind is saying. When in the depths of depression I could not get up, get dressed and get out of the house, let alone plan and carry out suicide. When your brain is working again, if your life is still sh*, then you are probably capable of making plans and may even be making a valid decision that suicide is your most reasonable way out of the mess you are in.

I have been lucky in that I had good monitoring when going on and later coming off Seroxat and suffered few side effects other than a dry mouth (which I was warned to expect) and very vivid, sometimes horrendous dreams, which I did not expect.

My own take on this debate is that the real 'crime' is in handing out mind altering drugs after a ten minute conversation and leaving the patient to come back in 4 - 6 weeks to report how they are getting on. IMO all depressive patients should be seen by an HP at least once a week during the first couple of months - not left to their own devices to either give up, overdose, lose all hope when the medication does not seem to be working.

Edam, the distinction between "likely to make them commit suicide", and "making them slightly more likely to have suicidal thoughts" is a huge one. For a start the former is probably slander! To highlight the difference: buying an extra lottery ticket does make me more likely to win but people would laugh if I said it made me likely to win millions.

You say this investigation took a large investment of time, would you agree that gave the people who had devoted so much energy towards it a vested interest in creating a big-bad-big-pharma story here?

Granny22 - I often wonder what would have become of me if I had become severely depressed before meeting my DH. I can't imagine my old flatmates, or even my family, would have given me the unconditional love and support I had from him. Many of the people being perscribed ADs won't have been so lucky.

No, Upwind, I wouldn't. Honestly. And you don't need to create a 'big bad pharma' angle to this story - Glaxo did that all by themselves without any help from anyone.

upwind - you're right that this isn't such a clear cut case both in terms of the scale of risk and of big companies covering up results - GSK did report the reults after all, they just didn't do it in a hurry.

however, it is a real and important issue and glaxo are arguably morally at fault. Let's not let the fact that the story has been exaggerated get in the way of the fact that we do need better regulation of drugs trials urgently.

Thanks Edam.

Senora, absolutely. But I don't see why anyone would expect a corporation to behave in a decent or moral manner - by law they must maximise profits for their shareholders.

there are no laws that say individuals should be morally decent either, but I do expect people to be, and I don't see why companies can't be socially responsible either (much as we need the regulation anyway).