Another dog attack ..cocker spaniel

[Ricco12]

Another dog attack and this time not a bully breed.
Does this just highlight that although powerful breeds do have the potential to be much more deadly that actually keeping any breed of dog with young kids really need to be throughly thought through by parents and is risky.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11972879/Mom-faces-backlash-keeping-familys-pet-dog-bit-three-year-old-daughters-face.html?ito=social-facebook&fbclid=IwAR2HXFDtxITHz3ccDwURMXy8LR99K0HzoSmIwBk1Ysd1iKjj_ZhWFCrWDEs#6nj37p2du8y

The story in question appears to be a failure of the Mum to properly parent. Why hasn’t she taught her daughter to properly respect the dog, its space and its boundaries? Why is she allowing a 3 year old, who is old enough to understand “no” and “gentle” etc, to climb all over her dog, especially if the dog is not well? Why hasn’t she made a safe space for the dog, that it can retreat to when it wants to decompress or just have a snooze that the dog could have escaped to/been placed to recuperate whilst feeling ill?

I have owned a dog since 2017; 3 dogs in total over that period. 1 passed last year so we currently have 2. 1 female (Fiona) that is 7 who we’ve had since she was just over 1 year old that we rescued from a bad situation. She can be a bit tetchy and as a shepherd breed (Belgian Malinois) has been known to try to ‘herd’ people, especially kids, so we keep a very close eye on her when around youngsters or will separate her to a quiet space if there are any particularly wayward youngsters around. Our other dog is a male who is 14 months. He’s gentle as anything but is a Kangal, so is huge and as a puppy, has no concept of his size or strength, so could be a calamity around younger kids if left to be too bouncy.

I have a number of nephews and one niece ranging in age from just over 1 to 17.5 years old. The elder two teens have basically grown up with Fiona and as well as playing with her, we involved them with training her whenever they would stay over/were around her so she would know they were pack members she needed to listen and respond to. We’ve been doing the same with Stanley and we’re repeating this approach with the younger niblings. I would never allow any of them to jump all over any of my dogs or pester them as it’s inviting trouble.

Personally, I think the bully debate is a bit of a red herring. The fact is, some breeds may be more naturally disposed to certain behaviours and more capable of inflicting damage on a greater scale in the event of an incident with a child or adult (or other dog), but banning or tarring an entire breed with the same brush is not the way forward.

The current breed specific legislation in the UK is not fit for purpose and until something is done to properly tackle the proliferation of breeders who breed irresponsibly and buyers who take on dogs of any breed without proper research and without fully comprehending the responsibility that comes with being a good dog owner, there will continue to be dog attacks resulting in life changing or life ending incidents. I find that incredibly sad.

There is a reason that many breeders won’t sell their puppies to families with young children. I don’t blame them. It’s not the child’s fault, of course, but it certainly was the parent’s, in this case.

This.

And our dogs have brought joy and happiness to my dcs. Balance.

People are cunts

Animals aren’t.

Dogs have boundaries too. I would bite if someone was clambering over me when I was in pain.

I know when my DDog has had enough & I tell me DD to leave him alone.

Devoted dog owner here and ready to be flamed for this

1. The Mum should be given some parenting courses and/or charges for child endangerment. Unsupervised dogs and children do not mix, especially when the poor dog was unwell.
2. Teaching and modelling safe behaviours around dogs takes years. Many parents seem to find it cute/amusing for their young child to disturb dogs when they are eating, sleeping or clearly just want to be left alone, most dogs will growl and then their only defence if they cannot escape is to bite. Reading dog body language takes skills that children under 8 do not have imo. This event is totally on the Mum.
3. Dogs who bite children ( even if they are provoked, as in this case) should be uplifted and rehomed with people who do not have children ( I adopted a dog who had bitten a child in similar circumstances). Yes, some dogs will be destroyed ( which is tragic and awful ) but once a dog has bitten I believe the pack order in the home has changed and the dog needs to be removed.
4. Virtually all dog bites are attributable to poor training/ socialisation/ care of the dog, a tiny minority are caused by medical issues like brain tumour/ cocker spaniel rage etc. I would ban people from dog ownership if their dog had bitten a child under their supervision. In this case, the parent obviously cannot cope with having a child and a dog. A ban on keeping dogs safeguards the child and the dog.

I am firmly of a deed not breed viewpoint but some breeds attract more than their fair share of negligent/ aggressive owners. There needs to be a lot more accountability for owners including compulsory basic training and safety courses.

With the volume of poorly socialised lockdown dogs I fear dog bites will increase and so many more children will be injured, accountability of owners and compulsory dog registration/licensing is required in order to hold owners to account. I have not lived in the UK for a long time now but I thought hospitals etc reported all dog bites to the police for investigation, or has this stopped?

Ive owned labradors, springer spaniels, one Boxer and DH had a rehomed Staffie when we met. Loved these animals to distraction, would I have a child under 5 permanently in my home with any of these dogs, no I wouldn’t. Not fair on the dog, not fair on the child.

OP you are completely correct that parents need to think long and hard about mixing younger children and dogs. Perhaps making parents accountable for dog bites due to negligence?

This was not a random attack, a dog who was in pain was cornered, crawled over and couldn’t get away, the dog needs to be removed to a home where its needs, safety and care is the very highest priority and the Mother requires investigation. Perhaps if she spent less time posting sad faced selfies and supervised her child and dog more diligently the child would not have a lifelong facial scar to deal with. Poor dog, poor child!

tin hat on ready for missiles! 😉

Or parents need to think about responsibly supervising their children.

what happened to that little girls was a tragedy.
was it her fault? No
was it the fault of a sick dog who used perfectly normal dog communication to create space when feeling unwell? No
was it the fault of a parent who let their unsupervised child harass a sick dog?
yes

dogs shouldn’t be killed because adult humans are irresponsible. I actually applaud this mother for recognising this wasn’t the dog’s fault. I hope she’s doing a better job of supervising her child now.

Owners fault entirely. Stupid woman should have provided a sick dog with a safe, quiet space. Poor Child too being exposed to that risk due to idiot adult being hard of thinking.

Very sadly an older relative who lived alone and with no children had to take our cocker spaniel. We just felt very uneasy with him around our then 2 and 5 year old.
We were beyond heartbroken

Do you believe that under 5's should be banned from travelling in cars? Lot of injuries and deaths from car accidents.

Why did the adult not take the dog to the vet? It clearly needed to be helped and instead let their child climb all over a dog that was scared and in pain and couldn’t run.

They should be prosecuted for cruelty to the dog and negligence to the child

I have a spaniel, I’ve always wanted a dog but waited till my children older enough (9 & 15) Our dog has a safe space, he is crate trained (not just left in there) dog will open & close the crate door we don’t lock it. The girls are also trained that the dog is not a play thing to be sat on.

i trust my dog , but would never leave her on her own with the girls (she follows me everywhere anyway)

Exactly! We waited til ours were 8 and 12 to get our spaniel. They know when to leave him, not to take chews etc and his space is his space.

That is MY responsibility as the adult to keep the kids safe and the dog happy

In 2018 8000 people in England alone were admitted to A&E with dog bites and children under 5 made up 60% of that

I most definitely haven't over inflated numbers

Since 2018 number have increased yearly.

@NuffSaidSam I totally agree with you and the chance of a kid being killed by a dog is tiny .

Way more chance of being killed riding their bike outside but my point is everyone is jumping up and down trying shouting ban breeds but in reality that's a tiny part of the problem and will solve nothing

That's the point I'm trying ti make.

Dogs over x weight require handling examination and licensing.

the bigger the dog the less chance the person defending themselves or their child or pet has to safely stop it.

some terriers can be very dangerous but people don’t take the threat seriously as they are small and while they can do lasting damage a fit, huge bully dog can rip a small child’s head or arm off without trying and their breeding and ownership should be treated like driving or owning a firearm.

Best choice Joe Public can make is to stop buying into the whole unhealthy breed kennel club cult and choose mongrels and cross breeds of small, friendly, intelligent dogs.

While I have met perfectly lovely Rottweilers, bull breeds and German shepherds there is no denying the statistics

If dogs were to be banned in homes of children under 5, where are all these dogs going?

Pets do so much good for children - they teach them about responsibility, empathy and care, they are a calming influence on children and adults which can only be a good thing with the sharp rise in mental health conditions in children and young people.

You can't seriously think the solution is to ban them from all homes with children?

Cocker spaniel in pain bit... a bully breed would have killed. Just take a look at the fatalities by actual dog breed. Bully types are the main killers. Any dog can bite, some dogs kill.

Having read the story the mother is more interested in Tic Toc and posting stuff than parenting her child and teaching not to climb over a dog, particularly a sick one. Made a mistake and wants others to fund surgery. Some people shouldn't breed, dumb people on Tic Toc.

This happened three years ago. The dog has been fine since. He was unable to escape when very sick a young child. The adults in this situation are to blame

In a population of 67 million, that works out to be 0.0001% of the population per annum. The vast majority of these will be small bites to the hand or leg, requiring only low level management. It's tiny. Yes, train people on dog behaviour and supervision, but banning is a massive over reaction.

Exactly so what's the % of death's must be absolutely minuscule. So shouting ban breeds is a over reaction

Probably more people killed a year from horses and farm animals than a dog.

Not that I'd own a giant breed of any kind personally but I don't believe in all this goings on about banning breeds . If you look at statistics then as you say it's tiny.

Cars, swimming pools, and poverty are all far more dangerous to children than dogs are.

That puts it in perspective. Leave your kids at home with the dog when you go out in the car. Less risky.

Yeah, Nah, not as witty as you think it is.

The article calls her mom so presumably they're in the US.