Am in tears watching the news.....

[VeniVidiVickiQV]

The letter from Gary Newlove's 12 year old daughter is being read out....

that's what I mean. If they dont have empathy now, then I dont think they can learn it. It's something you pick up/are shown in your formative years isnt it? How to treat other people, how others are affected.

Children mimic the actions of those influential around them. Sometimes that's a really bad thing and if they haven't been shown how to respect others around them from childhood then by the time they start mixing with like-minded, strong willed teenagers just like themselves, well, sometimes, it can only go bad.

I think thats going to be the case with this lot unfortunately. I like the sound of your parenting classes Bubble.

let me tell you about one girl I worked with.

She was 13
Regularly playing truant
Had threatened suicide
Had been brought home by the police drunk
Had attacked both her mother and father
Had ran away from home and been found by the police and her father in a house being used by older prostitutes
Had tried drugs

I worked with this girl and her family. When I first met them it was clear the family was troubled. The father described his 'perfect little girl' who had been fine until she turn 11 and then all hell let loose.

I spoke to each family member separately to get a perspective.

Mother told me the marriage had problems, she had nearly had an affair and had been caught out by her dh a couple of years previously. they had split a number of times since.

Father told me he tried his best to provide for his family - worked lots of hours - but felt his dw didnt care for the house and had no interest in the family home (it was filthy and very untidy with brokedn furniture all around) He also had recently had feelings that he might be bi/sexual.

Elder brother (17) worked sporadically but was a gambling addict, stealing from his parents to feed his addiction

And the young girl told me that she resented her mother for having an affair. She felt her dad was weak and neither of them had any time to give her boundaries as they were so engrossed with the drama of their own lives (her words - she was hugely intelligent)
She felt they didnt care enough to stop her.
The point is, they did everything they could to stop her getting drunk, hanging around dangerous areas etc...but by then, IT WAS TOO LATE.

That's the longwinded point I'm trying to make I guess. By the time her unsettled little childhood started taking its toll, she had gone past the point of feeling herself that her life was salvagable. It was already crap so a bit more crap wouldnt matter.

I think there are normally lots of factors here. My brother and I had exactly the same upbringing and in fact out of the two of us I had it much harder as the girl, yet my brother still dabbled in drugs to the point he was hospitalised and is now on medication for the rest of his life.

My point is it has to be about more than just the parents.... it has to be about society as a whole.

However, when it comes to kids like these boys or the boys who killed Jamie Bulger I can honestly say I just cant buy into any explanation and especially the fact that alot of the time the cuclprits dont actually care. They dont necessarily feel immense guilt, they feel hard. That is what is the problem for me. Not to say that that is the ssituation with these kids, it is just i findd it aall so difficult to comprehend.

Perhaps things like picking up drinking much earlier, more dabbling with drugs etc???

Sorry but I do get annoyed when people say the media are voyeuristic... that letter was released to the media on purpose, no one sneaked in to their house and stole it!! The family will have their reasons for releasing it, quite possibly to bring home the horror of these kind of incidents, and hopefully go some way towards preventing it happening again.

Too often victims can end up as names and statistics, anything that humanises them, adds to our understanding that they are a real person with a family that misses them terribly. Now you and I know all this, but perhaps there's some thug out there with a knife in his/her back pocket reading a paper or seeing it on the tv that something like that might actually get through to them.

Don't blame the media, trust me the police family liaison officers will be advising the family on how to handle the media and what they should and shouldn't release. They are not being exploited in any way.

Has this thread died? I just wanted to add, about the James Bulger case, that I left the Liverpool area in the late 1980s as the 'youth climate' there was just so scarey. There seemed to be more violence and outright disrespect for people and things every year. (What is it with people who can't stand to see saplings and flowers being planted in the town centres??) I was shocked and upset to hear about James, but not at all surprised. I get a jolt in my stomach whenever I hear his name.