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U.K. 'Quietly' announced it won't be taking anymore unaccompanied child refugees

369 replies

Motherofhowmany · 08/02/2017 17:07

Absolutely appalling, we've only resettled 350 of the promised 3000.

I work with some of these children. The things they have seen are horrendous.

www.independent.co.uk/news/only-350-syrian-refugee-children-will-be-allowed-to-settle-in-britain-thousands-less-than-promised-a7569691.html

OP posts:
DorcasthePuffin · 09/02/2017 22:34

IamWendy, could you answer 53's question about whether you would have opposed the Kindertransport?

I simply can't get my head round some people on this thread. We are talking about a small number of children who are fleeing for their lives. I can only envy your complacency that it will never be your children who need the kindness of strangers - and your staggering naivety in thinking that denying help to these children will mean more resources for 'our' children.

Anon1234567890 · 09/02/2017 22:39

David Cameron made a pledge of 3000
The house of commons passed an amendment that did not commit to a specific figure.

You can scoff at age assessments all you want but I've witnessed them
I am sure assessments take place but for whatever reason they are obviously bypassed/useless.

Showmethewaytogohome · 09/02/2017 22:50

The irony is the shut the gates we are full posters rally xan not see the potential that their views and the climate they rile in is bringing

Any new 'order' won't protect the 'we are born' or the 'we deserve'. You are niave. We really all in this together. Stop believing the near sighted right wing crap. Resources are global and belong to everyone. That's certainly what your trump and putin mates think. And they will be happy to take ours. But let's shut the refugees out as they are the issue. Ffs

Childlike views from the children haters.

Headofthehive55 · 10/02/2017 06:44

If the LA is so full of resources that they have people available to look after these children than they are over resourced and need to give the money back so people can have social care and / or cancer drugs that are needed to stop people dying here.

Headofthehive55 · 10/02/2017 06:46

Somebody needs to look after these children. It takes money and people. I wish us to use the money elsewhere.

IamWendy · 10/02/2017 06:59

We are talking about a small number of children who are fleeing for their lives. No, they were fleeing, now they are in France. Don't keep banging on about kindertransport please. We are not talking about actual children being saved from death camps, but old teens/men who are safe in France.

We've all seen footage of these 'children', face recognition software was used to age them, some were guessed to be 36!

Bananagio · 10/02/2017 07:08

And why should Italy as an example who also don't have infinite resources, have far greater economic problems than the U.K. and who also have public health systems to fund and provide cancer drugs via etc etc be responsible for providing for so many more than the UK due to the fact that Italy is one of the first port of calls that migrants and refugees come to? This is a global problem and needs a global response. There was no talk of opening the borders to unlimited numbers. These are 3000 unaccompanied children. The U.K.'s position is shameful.

53rdAndBird · 10/02/2017 07:18

Wendy, you really need to get your information on this from somewhere other than the Daily Mail. Motherofhowmany has worked with these refugees - but you still think you know better about where they come from and how old they are? The "face recognition software" thing in the DM was utter bullshit, and the footage you saw in the DM included people who weren't even refugees.

Leaving aside your definition of 'safe in France' - as has already been explained upthread, these children are often very much not safe - you must be aware that the Kindertransport children travelled through several countries in order to get to Britain (obviously, they didn't teleport here). Do you think we should have refused to let them in?

jujubeanz · 10/02/2017 07:19

We've all seen footage of these 'children', face recognition software was used to age them, some were guessed to be 36*

Oh yeah I'm sure the daily mail's face recognition app is more accurate than the invasive tests they have to go through.

Been lurking on this thread but fucking hell, the selfishness. Let themstay in France! We have a responsibility to take our share, 350 is pitiful, the reason public resources are so scarce in this country is not cos of children fleeing beheadings and bombs (not gas chambers no, as if that makes a difference), it's cos of poor decision making by our government.

jujubeanz · 10/02/2017 07:31

I am sure assessments take place but for whatever reason they are obviously bypassed/useless.

Love this, hey home office I found a way you can save money on all those invasive age assessments! Just use this app my friend posted on facebook!

Believeitornot · 10/02/2017 07:38

I am sure assessments take place but for whatever reason they are obviously bypassed/useless

Let's have some proof please. Proper evidence.

At the end of the day, we are talking about people. Children. A figure of 3,000 sounds a lot but it is a drop in the ocean.

For those who think we should help our own first, please tell me what you have been doing to help those in greater need in the uk?

What have you done?

CarelessWispas · 10/02/2017 07:38

Yep, some ungodly, inhumanely selfish and utterly ignorant posts from the usual Daily Mail readers etc. on this thread. With such little empathy for these pitiful kids, who have simply been unlucky in their country of birth, I really hope the posters who deny them any kindness or help from this rich country don't have any children themselves. Nauseating.

Believeitornot · 10/02/2017 07:42

I will add. I was brought up by fabulous foster parents for the second half of my childhood.

They also fostered someone from the Democratic republic of the Congo - he was in his teens and I suspect he would have been one of the ones who the Daily Mail readers would think was "too old".

Having lived with him in close quarters it was clear he'd seen some awful awful stuff.

Fundamentally it's just racism. These kids look different, sound different so you feel threatened. Threatened by a child who's seen more horror than you can describe.

Would you ever send your child out of your home country for a better life?
Travel on a rickety boat and hope for the best with your babies and children?

For people to do that they must be desperate.

Did you see the headlines about how many tens of thousands of people that Assad has hung in Syria? After trials lasting minutes? Probably not because you read the Daily Mail.

This world is full of a lot of shit. And there are a lot of ostriches sticking their head in the sand.

GraceGrape · 10/02/2017 07:43

Just because the UK happens to be geographically located quite far away from current areas of conflict does not mean we should get away with not taking refugees. The countries (less wealthy than the UK) surrounding the region are overwhelmed with refugees. Greece is sheltering thousands. We should certainly step-up.

In this case most of the children have family in the UK to take care of them so the only argument against them coming can be to reduce migration figures for the statistics. Disgusting.

The same posters always pop up on these threads with their anti-forriner spiel.

Sixisthemagicnumber · 10/02/2017 08:37

What happens at the age assessments? The last report that I read said that the govt were refusing to impose dental checks as a means of ascertaining age. Dental maturation I always understood to be quite a reliable method of ascertaining age so why are we not using it? Obviously every method has a margin of error but I am interested to know what methods are being used and how reliable they are. I think if the public could be assured that there is some reliable age assessment process happening in every case where a child/ young adult is thought to be at least 12 years old then they might be reassured that we are only accepting genuine child refugees and they might not believe the media outlets that seem
Intent on spreading the message that lots Of adults are getting through by posing as children.

53rdAndBird · 10/02/2017 08:56

Dental checks are not that accurate. One of the reasons the government doesn't use them is because the British Dental Association told them this and came out very firmly against it.

squishysquirmy · 10/02/2017 09:18

3000 is actually a very small amount. And no, these children are not "perfectly safe" in France. Penniless, 13 year old CHILDREN living on the street/makeshift camps are not fucking safe. As has been pointed out earlier, business is booming for those willing to exploit the situation - child sex traffickers for eg.

squishysquirmy · 10/02/2017 09:19

But hey, they're forrin kids so who gives a fuck if they end up gang raped as sex slaves eh?

NotStoppedAllDay · 10/02/2017 09:52

Don't France offer safe places for the children? Are France saying they must live in shelters/on the streets?

Floggingmolly · 10/02/2017 10:18

Hasn't France offered asylum to the refugees at Calais? They have already left the war zones they're fleeing from.

As to the arbitrary figure of 3000; they haven't all got a family in the U.K. ready and waiting to take them in, that defies all credibility?

JeNeSuisPasVotreMiel · 10/02/2017 10:30

Floggingmolly the 3,000 is not an arbitary figure; it's the number of minors identified by the Home Office who have families in the UK who are ready and able to care for them.

NotStopped unfortunately these children are running away from the French authorities once they know that their claim to join their families in the UK has been refused. This is because their next stop is in a French care home with other neglected and abused children. The age group who are running away are older teenagers. It's been a long journey for them already, fraught with danger and they have had to make a lot of decisions for themselves already - they are trying to join their families.

The article below explains what is happening with these children in France.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/feb/09/dubs-child-refugees-calais-theresa-may-deception-cruel-people-smugglers

thisisthereality · 10/02/2017 10:51

Ive name changed here. My reality is fostering around twenty unaccompanied minor 'children' from many different countries for over ten years up until six months ago. The reality is that many of these children are thought to have family in this country. The reality is that they seldom actually get to live with them, if they do it will take many many months to complete the checks required on their families ( maybe rightly so, the Local Authorities need to know for certain that these people are 'suitable', have the right accommodation etc) The reality is that often these 'families', once found, are not actually blood related or do not have the capacity in their home to look after the young person. All this takes a long, long time. In the meantime the 'child' is placed in LA foster care. The foster carers will be paid up to £400 including a fee and maintenance. I've no idea how one would calculate the costs of the SW, health and Education during this period.

Many LA carers are refusing to provide homes for unaccompanied young people now. There are many reasons for this and I can only speak from my own experiences as well as many carers I know from my own LA. ( oh and this then means that the children will be referred to independent fostering associations at a cost of between £750-950 per week)

I'll be perfectly honest and say here that, around 10 years ago when children starting coming from Afghanistan and Eritrea ( although they have always arrived unaccompanied, just not in the numbers that we see now) many carers enjoyed the 'challenge' of having an UM within their homes, me included.
As the years have gone on, the makeup of the children has drastically changed. The reality is that these young people are very very difficult to have within a home. If they present as, e.g., 15, it is very likely they will actually be around 20. If they are actually 15, they are very very different to our own 15 year old children, their life experiences can not be compared, obviously. A 15 year old male from, e.g., Syria, is actually like a fully grown man here.
I have 20 years experience working in various ways with teens, often males. I have experience of drugs, police, courts, living with severe mental health disorders, self harming and suicide attempts ( from local children). but NOTHING would persuade me to ever offer a home again to an unaccompanied child.

My reality is that these 'children' do not actually want to be in a foster home. They certainly do not wish to abide by ordinary family 'rules' and they certainly do not want to integrate into British society. Their one goal is to be within groups of other young people from their own country and culture ( very understandable) However, here they are, at the port, so what do we do? They come into foster care! They stay in foster care until the placement breaks down, they are moved to another foster placement until eventually they are given what they have demanded for that past year, a room in a shared house with other young people ( they may only still be maybe 16!)

So then we have five young, e.g., Eritrean, young people living together in a house rented on behalf of a LA on, for example, a housing estate. These young people are thought to be around16 years old! They speak very little English and do not integrate within the local community, they do not want to. It goes on......

This is the reality. I could actually write a book based on my own experiences of unaccompanied young people living within my home but it wouldn't be believed! However, I do know that there will be other foster carers reading this who will know exactly what I am talking about!

It's actually quite sad that I've felt the need to change my name here and I'll sit back and wait for the back lash. But nothing I've written here is untrue, it is the reality

Floggingmolly · 10/02/2017 10:57

I imagined it was something along those lines, reality. The notion that they all have nice cosy family set ups awaiting their arrival with open arms is really rather ludicrous

53rdAndBird · 10/02/2017 11:15

Hasn't France offered asylum to the refugees at Calais? They have already left the war zones they're fleeing from

This is a global refugee crisis. The reason that our government made a commitment to take refugees in the first place was an acknowledgement that the UK should do its share in this.

You're free to say "I don't care what happens, they can all just stay in other countries and other countries can deal with them so we don't have to" if that's the person you want to be. Many of us - including Lord Dubs, brought here on the Kindertransport - want our country to be better than that.

jujubeanz · 10/02/2017 11:22

None of what thisisthereality says surprises me much, I don't have rose tinted glasses when it comes to this, these children will be troubled, damaged, hard to integrate, I only see this is as a reason to improve the system, rather than not help at all.