Abuse in football in the news

[Molly333]

I'm not surprised that adults are now coming out saying they've been abused to the FA . For some time ive witnessed football coaches continually shouting at the players and for it to be okay !!! If this was a workplace would this be allowed ? Then why is it allowed for children ? No wonder children never spoke up , no wonder they felt intimidated by these people . The biggest worry of all is that is still goes on today! That's what the FA need to look at - bullying by coaches needs to stop , we need to protect our children !

I am livid at that revolting creature Eric Bristow. I met him about 20 years ago, he really thought he was something special when actually he is foul POS.

They never do Sorry tropezienne Yes they do. I was bullied for having curly hair at school by the P.E. teacher (she also watched us in the showers and forced us to remove our towels after swimming classes).

I know it goes on more recently because my own children were in schools with similar teachers. I was a teacher too and it goes on now. There are some adults who gravitate towards jobs with young kids because they are bullies. (Not nec. rapists). There is not much option to "not return" if it goes on in school if you're a pupil . Though as I said at least children are believed now. teachers can be removed now too, they were just passed to other schools by councils in my time.

There is a big difference between a teacher/coach who is forthright and authoritative and who isn't afraid of being harsh if that is what is required than someone who is an out and out bully.

A competent coach will hand out criticism but also hand out the methods as to what the solution of the issue is. This is a whole lot different than being shouted at and having only negative feedback as your guide. Not to mention unofficial (and illegal) methods used for control and dominance.

It gives one a better idea as to how Ched Evans's and others come about in football if abuse is seen as part of the job.

Of course I'm not saying all teachers and coaches are bullies. You have to be scrupulously fair and not use personal remarks to control and mentally abuse the students.. I would say by my experience probably one third of them are nasty bullies sadly.

Did you actually read my last post ppeatfrui? I said PE teachers at compulsory PE lessons, (or any lessons, compulsory or not, for that matter) shouldn't under any circumstances, shout and scream at children for not being good enough at something. Your experiences and hurt feelings dont prove the rule. I too was treated horribly at school because I didn't fit in. My life was made a misery in fact. I ran away from home, more than once and slept rough to get away from the environment I was educated in.

My point is that these young men were attending Saturday football clubs and were abused there. Coaches at these clubs, (Not all of them of course) but most, generally speaking, are very good ones who encourage and nurture. We mustn't think that because of the way some diabolical, cruel abusers out there, that will find their way into any club, social institution etc, are out there. That we need to wrap our boys in cotton wool and pretend they are being emotionally abused because they are being driven on by coaches. Who want them to work harder for themselves more than anything else. Nobody who has a burning motivation to be the best and get to the very top of their chosen sport will be put off and no one should view them as being abused because they are being urged on - its ridiculous.

I dont know what the answer is, we need better vetting perhaps, more vigilance, awareness ? But not to see 'toxicity' and 'emotional abuse; everywhere we look. This is a knee jerk response.

You didn't read my post actually, I said I reckoned that one third of all teachers\coaches are toxic. As are some parents. (in a thread a while ago it was shocking to read that there a very many people who have been put off PE by over zealous\abusive teachers). You sound like you had problems too.

IME to be 'encouraged' positively to do something one WANTS to do is different to being 'forced" into it because the child's parent wanted to be a ballerina or a footballer. The child should be allowed to have a life and feelings of its own.

I admire the courage shown by the few and no doubt many more, but as a retired social worker of 25 years plus in safeguardng, unless there is a complete head-shift in where the problem is , this will continue. Why ? because local authoirty safeguardng and child proteciotn only kicks in "after" the abuse. With a clear DBS and a few good checkable references, getting a job working with kids is all too easy. The biggest stride forward was educating the kids that this stuff is wrong. Next problem is the way that kids are put off reportng it, becasue of the crash and bash mentality of social services. Who wants to be labelled as a victim ? No one. The stength it took for those high profile men to waive their right to anonymity and speak out should have them in line for knighthoods. A proper reward for outing these degenerate child abusers, and yes therpay if requested. We also need to tackle the "shame factor" of some cultures. Kids in some faith communiities are discourgaed from speaking out, even blamed for the abuse. They are afraid what will happen afterwards, and looking at how social services reacts, I cant blame them for those fears. Finally, we have to decide what we want to do. Do we want to put in place a great system that catches ever chld abuser as soon as they have done it, or do we want to prevent it happening in the first place ? Obvioulsy we want both, but that means we have to work with the perpetrators as well, and becasue of the mood of politicians and media I wont hold ny breath for that. Sadly until we can find the courage to say prevention is better than cure, we will never really stop child sexual abuse. My fear is all that we will get better at, is catching once its happened. As someone who was sexually abused, that just aint good enough. I want you to stop it happening in the first place.

Yes I totally agree robshes There seems to be some of that shame culture in our mainstream too, shockingly. I really feel for the children.

The stength it took for those high profile men to waive their right to anonymity and speak out should have them in line for knighthoods

I couldn't agree more, I'm full of admiration for these men. Perhaps we should tell them over on the feminist board, who seem to think, (Quelle surprise) that this is somehow happening at their women's expense.

(whispers) Oh god Tropez don't get me started on the (only women are abused and raped) feminist board.

Ok I won't.

It was my fault for looking..

At that horrid board I mean.

That is entirely unfair, Tropez.

It was an entirely reasoned and intelligent debate about the media reaction to the sexual abuse scandal in football.

By all means join the discussion there.

Why is it you only join in this (several days old) thread now, just when someone has said something about the feminist board?

No I wont thank you. I'll never look in that direction again in fact.

I've commented on two threads about this already:

Sexual Abuse Interview on This Morning

Football Sex Abuse Scandal

I genuinely didn't feel that I should copy and paste my comments into this third thread.

The comment you made "Perhaps we should tell them over on the feminist board, who seem to think, (Quelle surprise) that this is somehow happening at their women's expense" is entirely untrue.

Nobody actually said anything like that on either of those threads.

I don't read links but there are SOME extreme feminists who seem to think that sexual violence is only against women and girls, which IMO is an insult to gay men and boys and men who are violated.

ppeatfruit, I've never encountered that. Not once.

And that was never said on either of the two threads mentioned above.

as someone involved in junior football, the recent media coverage has really raised awareness of why we have DBS/CRC checks and all the things good clubs do re safeguarding. Sadly any activity where kids look up to adults as role models will have these issues. Checks are important but wont pick up people not yet caught; parents, clubs and kids education is key

Kids education is utterly key here.

It scares me the threads on here where children have no idea about sex, intimate touching etc at 10/11 years old.

Teach your child from the youngest age possible about sex. In an age appropriate way obviously. Leading on from that teach them about paedophiles. Actually use the word! Teach them some people are very unwell in the head and have sexual thoughts about children. Teach them about private areas, touching, trusting your 'spidey' sense, not keeping secrets, not listening to anybody who says your parents will be angry with you or won't believe you.

It is utterly key. I think I could say i'm 99% sure my DC would tell me instantly if somebody tried to be inappropriate with them.

I totally agree - both of my Ks1 DC do loads of sports, beavers etc and other stuff where I am not always right by their side. That's an important bit of independence to me. Tonight we had an impromptu discussion about the pants rule as my DS was running about with no pants on in the house. DD was telling him to put pants on and we were were joking about it. We then had a chat about what is ok in our house and what they must tell people about...

Kidnapped, when I saw at the Fem' board stuff like: "If this wasn't about men, there wouldn't be such a fuss". I found that really horrible. Anyway I'm not going to try and change the subject to a row about gender politics. So that's fine, I'm entirely wrong, OK.

Mathsmess I agree with you about education. But I just don't know how we can conquer the shame that so many sexually abused people feel. At the time and afterwards. I was sexually abused by male and female religious teachers. I wasn't alone, most girls there that were being abused in fact. I spoke up, but I was intimidated by my parents into being quiet. Because they (we all would, as a family) would have been punished by the Islamic authorities. I couldn't speak out until now actually, in another country, nearly 40 years later. In that environment it wasn't spoke about at all, because you and not the abuser, would be punished.

In this country though, you can speak out and the offenders are punished. You know you have done nothing wrong. Despite that, for a man who has been sexually abused, I guess there is the problem of their masculine identity being in doubt, if they speak out? In the masculine environment of Football, how do they compete with the others and at the same time live with the hideous memories where they feel so weak and vulnerable. It is a terribly undermining and tragic thing to live with. I know its been said many times but, just seeing others come forward can be all it takes for you to feel, 'OK I can do the same, I'll be brave like that person has been'. In this society you can, you can speak out and know you will not be punished or told you're going to burn in eternal hell fire for doing so. So people have to be brave and come forward. This is easy to say, but often it is very difficult to do. Perhaps this lessens over time, the shame many feel?

Have tremendous admiration for the men speaking out- the pain, anxiety, tension on their faces is hard to see.
Football traditionally has been such a machismo - and silencing- culture- things have changed and are continuing to do so.

That is a terrible thing about your ' culture of shame' Tropez it was like that 50 or 6o years ago here.

I have a friend who was abused by Nuns, In those days, she got punished by her parents for 'telling'.

I understand these things were not discussed and recognised here, in the past as they are now. But I don't think it was ever quite the same here. Of course it is/was just as terrible for those abused,. as we are hearing more and more now. It was far from perfect but you always had the law to protect you. We did not.

Sometimes the law wasn't on the right side though, that is another thing that has improved. and about your background.