MNHQ here: are you a JAM ("Just About Managing")?

[FinnMumsnet]

Hello,

With the Chancellor's Autumn Statement coming up next Wednesday (23 November), rumours swirl that it will include measures targeted at a group the government has been calling "JAMs", or those "just about managing." There's some suggestion that this will include action on things like childcare subsidies, the cost of holiday flights and fuel duty. (For more, here's the Mirror, the Telegraph and the FT.)

We know from previous conversations that many MNers are having to work hard to make ends meet, and we'd love to hear your thoughts on whether you think you fall into this category, what action you'd like the government to take, and whether any of the proposed measures (though we don't have any more details we're afraid!) would make a difference to your lives.

Thanks,
MNHQ

It has to be housing.
Build more social housing not these massive spiralling new estates of 500 houses that no one wants near them, that get sold off as buy to let's anyway. Just a street in every town / village of social housing, maisonettes with gardens and family homes.
Get people who should be in council homes back in them, this will cool off the rental market and interest in the buy to rent market will cool. It will keep housing benefit paid into the council pot not the private pot.
It will then mean those who should be able to buy can buy.

I'm a private renter on a rolling 2 month contract. It's bloody shit with kids. You can't have pets in case the next LL doesn't let you, you can't decorate your kids bedrooms, you can't plant a flower in the garden as you don't know if you'll be there to see it flower. Worse of all you don't know if the school your kids start at will be the one they finish at as there's little chance you'll still be in the same area.

My LL asked for an extra £400 a month this year! How are you meant to deal with that sort of increase whilst still saving for a house or pension. You can't.
Talking of pensions, how are the government going to house the current 2.5 million generation rent? I can bet none of our pensions are big enough to cover private renting.

Scrap the desperate attempt to shore up the housing bubble that is Help to Buy, and plough the money into building genuinely affordable rented homes instead.

String all lettings agents up from the nearest lamp post Make it illegal for lettings agents to charge tenants fees- the greedy feckers are already gouging 10-15% of the price of the rent from the landlords.

For me it's all about getting on the housing ladder. We live in a pokey house and pay £600 pcm for what would be about 350 pcm for a mortgage. So much of our monthly wage goes on the rent that it's impossible to put aside savings to get a mortgage. I would love for an overhaul of the system around mortgages, mainly starting with "yes, we see you have paid X amount on rent on time with no arrears for the last ten years, we trust you to pay Y amount for the next 25."
We don't care about holidays, we just want to be able to hang pictures on a wall of our own (something that is against our current tenancy agreement)
Obviously this is just a wonderful day dream and like so many our age (late 20s) we are relying on family to help us out.

Yes ohwool I don't understand why they go
"Ohhh yes you earn 20k so you can borrow £100,000" when your already and have been paying the equivalent of a £250,000 mortgage. It doesn't make sense.

YY to no letting agency fees for tenants - these should be borne by the LL, as a business cost. This already happens in Scotland. But considering that a high proportion of conservative MP's are LL, this (and better conditions for renters) is unlikely to happen.

I'm mid 40's & really worry about my DC's generation's future. Very little hope of owning their own home, working till they drop, no state pension or NHS in all likelihood.

I guess we are JAMs. 2 young children, 1 full time working parents, 1 part time working parent to balance childcare costs. We were able to get on the housing ladder thanks to generous deposit help from parents but our mortgage is over 1k a month. We live in the South East and need to for our jobs. Childcare = lots, not much left at the end of the month but don't need to reach for credit cards.

I was talking to DH about this thread and our thoughts are that housing costs are the biggest issue - we need to build so many more affordable homes in places were people need to live. If housing costs were not so ridiculous families who wanted to have one parent at home to keep childcare costs low would be able to, but most JAM families need both parent working.

Three months maternity leave full pay
Affordable childcare
Better employment rights
Address the growing disparity between salaries of those at the top and those at the bottom
Raise the minimum wage

We are struggling, not because of financial problems but because of multiple health problems throughout the extended family.

Things that would help:

• If the NHS was not on its knees.

• If the GP had longer appointment time so they could hear the whole story at once rather than in multiple 5 minutes chapters.

• I am seriously considering a private GP, as the NHS doesn't seem to be coping at all at the moment. If Bupa could add GP cover to their standard health insurance that would really help.

• For economic reasons my immediate extended family is spread across Ireland, Scotland and England so none of us has any kind of meaningful support network. The government needs to realise this, and at least understand that banning "holidays" during school term time is placing staggering pressure on extended families who are already struggling to cope.

• The primary school system is placing massive demands on children who are young for the year or late developers, or who have undiagnosed health problems. Schools either need more funding or lower targets otherwise the children are just going to be crushed by the pressure.

• It would be great if the kinds of jobs that are currently concentrated in the south east could be spread north and to Scotland too, so that we could return to live near extended family. We are stuck in the south east and going back home would solve a lot of problems.

Similar to a PP

We pay £900 a month in rent, but can't get a mortgage without a deposit but can't save for one because rent is so expensive.
Friends with mortgages are paying less, some much less so why can't we be given a mortgage to pay £900 a month?? We prove every month that we can do it.

Honestly, am I missing something here?

I hate renting, all I want us to be able to paint my children's bedroom.

And what on earth will happen when we get older and can't work and can't afford to rent? It terrifies me.

So, yes, housing but also childcare would help us.

Childcare is so expensive that I have to work part time. Working full time means I work at a loss so I'm stuck in part time work for the next few years which is damaging to my career and future earnings. Working part time I break even but if I give up work altogether I'd find it so difficult to get back into a job that I simply have to do it this way for the timebeing.

YY to housing and flexible working rights.

If holidays are on the table, surely it's more important to look at how the cost of ANY holiday rockets in school hols and parents face penalties if they take them during term time? That stands whether you can afford a fortnights all-inclusive in Spain or a week in a caravan in the UK.

We need lots more houses, yes, but without massive improvements to infrastructure at the same time, all this results in when built is: dangerously overcrowded roads, pollution, insufficient school places, sewage coming up into people's homes, lack of hospital beds, GPs' surgeries with closed lists, no space in local nurseries, no community spaces, local businesses being turned into private accommodation for commuters, little to no effective public transport, poor quality building, abusive landlords, destruction of the natural environment... We seem to be heading quite rapidly back in the direction of the world portrayed in Victorian Slum on BBC2, tbh. I would rather live in a higher tax society with less extreme inequalities than go back to the sweat shops, lack of any security, death sentence of disability, appalling conditions inflicted by private landlords of the Victorian era. Unfortunately, you need a cohesive, co-operative society to achieve this and we don't seem to have one of those. Actually, a whole world heading in that direction is required, as we are not a self-sufficient island that can survive by itself. We would all starve to death and not be able to obtain the natural resources needed to help improve living conditions without the rest of the world there to help. It's a shame we are heading in the opposite direction - seemingly towards mutually assured destruction through increased division. Really, there are too many of us and we aren't encouraged to be very nice.

Didnt I read something on here recently about a national wage actually paying for itself and more because of the vasr amounts spent on benefit admin etc? SSomething like this, plus tax increases across the board and particularly on high earners and tax evaders. Free or cheap childcare.
How come other countries can manage? Are there these numbers of German JAMers? I'd personally be happy with Scandy taxation and consequent quality of life but Germany is hardly a socialist paradise yet it does seem to values its citizens...

It's really very simple;
There are more of us
We are (generally) living longer with complex health needs
We need to pay more in taxes for;
Better Housing
Better education
Better NHS

probably controversial, but i would like them to make CTC not take Carers allowance as income.

Its bad enough that i can't work because i have to care for a disabled child in receipt of Higher Rate Care element DLA, so it means we're also reliant heavily on CTC to subsidise the income we're losing through me not being able to work.. but if i claim the Carers Allowance i'm entitled to, i lose the corresponding amount of CTC.

Caring isn't a job.. i'm not being employed by anyone, and that extra £200 a month would make a world of difference.

We are managing but would not dream of a holiday while on a single income (I am currently a stay at home mum).
Just a thought on rent - is it madness to suggest that the government introduces a cap on rental as a percentage of the house value? It would mean landlords look after their houses so they get a higher valuation and renters can actually afford to save. Any landlord who finds it is no longer profitable will opt out and free up the houses for families to buy. Maybe a crazy suggestion?
Childcare costs are prohibitive so yes, subsidies would free a whole generation of stay at home mothers. I think the salary you have to earn to even return to work with 1 child is above the average wage, let alone when you have 2 or more.

I think so many families are "just about managing"

• and it's not always just about finances although that's certainly a biggie.

I'd agree secure employment - in my case in the early years sector - would have made, and would make, a substantial difference to our family well-being.

Better understanding and resourcing of mental health support would make a difference to our extended family - I think the government promised parity for mental and physical health needs? But little sign of that - unless it's piss poor parity!

One thing we are doing is I'm taking a course at my local college which could lead towards a new career/ opportunities for the future. I hope such opportunities for life long learning and training will continue to be developed for all.

Overall my feedback and advice to government would be families need security and opportunities in order to enjoy well-being and to prosper.

There are lots of things that could be done to promote this - we need to invest, including in people and families, in order to thrive.

A real commitment to quality early years/child care provision for all would do much good too - look to Scandinavia for a model of how this could look.

I agree if you're really thinking of JAMs then the cost of air travel isn't really high on the agenda. Talk of this makes them look more out of touch with our reality than offering much appeal - though a family trip to Mallorca does sound nice

roundabout
The only continent on earth with a growing population is Africa.
Within the next 30 years the demographic time bomb will be that there will not be enough young people to look after the old.
Its already happening in Japan - their population is falling.
The UK born population has been flatlining for 20 years.
Without the immigrants we would be seriously short of workers.

BUT
The UK has got to grow up to the fact that if we want universal health care, universal education and universal pensions then we have two choices
(a) Pay for it now by putting up taxes
(b) borrow to pay for it, bankrupting our children

Way, way up thread I listed the five simple measures that will sort the NHS and housing.
Philip Hammond is not brave enough though.

Housing.

Like so many pp I rent and it is pretty crap. Now in my 40s and we are hoping to buy next year - we have been saving for a house deposit for over 5 years. No hols for over 10 years. Decent jobs but not great salaries but over £40000 a year between us.

We live in a 2 bed flat, 4 of us, bit squashed but manageable. Can't put any pictures up, paint, put shelves up. We have been doing this in various properties for donkeys years. At least now we are with an agency, things tend to get fixed quite quickly. We had a private landlord for 7 years previously and the house was damp, we had no proper heating for 5 years and the electrics were a bit dodgy! How did he get away with it?!

I would happily pay more tax for services.

Ta1kinpeece - the world population in 1800 was around 1 billion. In 1930 it was 2 billion. In 1974 it was 4 billion. In 2011 it was 7 billion. At the moment it is more than halfway to 8 billion. There are too many human beings in the world, whatever their age and capacity to care for themselves - we are killing off other species at a rate of knots, running out of resources and deliberately destroying what we do have with wars, violence and an obsession with increasing growth and consumption. Even if the world population did not continue to grow, there are too many of us and we are collectively raping the earth of its resources. That said, I strongly favour higher taxes and more investment in infrastructure in this country, but in the long term, 8 billion human beings is too much, yet if we want people to care for us in our dotage, it has to keep on going up...

roundabout
yet if we want people to care for us in our dotage, it has to keep on going up...
The point is that it is not going up.
So we need to find better ways to look after the elderly (who hardly existed in 1930, let alone 1800)
Which also means not loading our spending onto future generations - which is what our "structural deficit" actually means.

If we had an brave politicians they would sell the hard news to us in a palatable way.
Sadly the meejah thinks that morons like Trump and Farridge and LePen sell more adverts
so we are treated like idiots and left with housing shortages and failing healthcare and infrastructure.

The point is, the world population is still going up - current estimates are for it to get up to 11 billion within 100 years. We are also making more areas of the earth uninhabitable, and global warming is only going to help with that. The unpalatable truth is, we are not self-sufficient in anything in the U.K. - we do not grow enough food to feed ourselves, or have enough resources to make for ourselves everything we need - and there are a lot of people in the world wanting the same resources that we do. And yet, despite this inter-dependence, the direction of flow at the moment seems to be towards increasing instability.

current estimates are for it to get up to 11 billion within 100 years
Nope.
www.newscientist.com/article/mg23231001-400-the-world-in-2076-the-population-bomb-did-go-off-but-were-ok/

However for the UK the important thing is to find ways to repatriate a lot of the money that the super rich have rotting in offshore accounts
and get it circulating back into the economy
a land tax is the neatest method

but Philip Hammond will chicken out

The world population does need to fall off a cliff - this is not going to result in good healthcare for our children in their old age or premature infirmity, however! Whatever way you look at it, whether a growing elderly population not replaced by the young, or an ever growing population needed to care for the elderly and infirm, it doesn't look good. And you can't repatriate offshore wealth without global co-operation, as most countries are in an unseemly scrabble to attract any morsels of wealth to themselves at the expense of others. With our financial services industry, we are world leaders in tax avoidance wheezes.

we arent a JAM family - but I know some who are. I'm afraid that what JAMs need, what all of us need, is a change of government because this government is not likely to implement the changes that are necessary.

Conservative governments take money from the poor and give it to the rich. The idea that it "trickles down" is insane. The rich spend more of their money abroad on things like foreign holidays. Give more money to the poor and it trickles back in taxes as it supports people in the uk. So first we need a policy to reduce income inequality by higher taxes on the rich. We need to increase inheritance tax, abolish council tax and go back to rates, impose punitive taxes on residential property that is empty for more than 6 months of the year, introduce restrictions on taking money from the sale of UK property abroad.

Planning rules are so weak that builders dont have to provide even minimal "affordable" housing. Allowing housing profits to be creamed off into offshore companies is insane. Selling off council houses and housing association houses is insane. Councils should be encouraged to build (using money raised by increases in taxes on property), VAT should be removed on any work providing additional living rooms or bedrooms. Letting rooms in your own home should have a tax exemption per room let.

Then we need to deal with tax evasion, especially by companies. Income generated in this country should be taxed here, wherever the company choose to locate their headquarters. We should jail those who advise on tax evasion schemes, there needs to be some real deterrent for them.

The NHS needs more money. A small part of this can come from increasing the age at which people get free prescriptions so that it matches pension age. There should also be higher taxes on alcohol since this this increases NHS expenditure.

I agree with the many comments about holidays abroad not being a priority for 'jams' and is so out of touch from reality! Also I think the cost of renting needs to be addressed and affordable housing. I'm not sure that keep throwing more money at childcare is the answer, I really believe more support should be given to allow parents to look after their own children as much as possible, this has been ignored for a long time. Decent wages and decent terms and conditions and the ability to earn more before tax would help many people on a low income. Keeping the cost of fuel down is crucial too.