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Original poster

Peer names 'serial liar' whose rape claims sent an innocent man to jail

38 replies

GhoulsToo · 20/10/2006 22:26

story

Do you think naming women who falsely accuse men of rape would stop genuine rape victims from reporting the crime?

I think if women have been proven to have completely fabricated their story then they should be named, unless you can sway me otherwise ...

OP posts:
CountTo10 · 20/10/2006 22:31

I think they should be named as well. Just as I think men who have raped should be named. Unfortunately being named or not, it doesn't do anything to make the process or reporting a genuine rape any easier or likely. These women who are proven to be lying ought to be sstrung up. It irritates me that a woman would lie about something like that

sorrell · 20/10/2006 22:35

For a start this particular woman has a long history of mental illness and self-harming. I hope he feels good about what he has done. Secondly, what happens? Every single woman who reports rape when teh man in found not guilty (about 90%) is investigated with a view to removal of anonymity and prosecution? can you begin to imagine the trauma that would involve? Who would think of reporting rape under those conditions? Would you? SO that leaves even more rapists free to rape at will...

sorrell · 20/10/2006 22:35

Ian Huntley was found not guilty of rape many times.

CreepyCrawlyCarmenere · 20/10/2006 22:35

I think that women who make false claims of rape should be named. It is one of the most damaging things a woman can do to a man and if it has been proven to be false(as opposed to being a grey area)she should definitely be named.

sorrell · 20/10/2006 22:36

Or rather, not even prosecuted as the possibility of conviction was so low.

CreepyCrawlyCarmenere · 20/10/2006 22:37

As I said in situations where there are no grey areas, where the woman has defintely fabricated the story.

edam · 20/10/2006 22:38

"These women who are proven to be lying ought to be strung up." WTF?

So falsely accusing someone of rape is deserving of the death penalty, as opposed to, ooh, let me think.... murder, for instance?

FFS it's no wonder women don't report rape and sexual assault with misogynistic attitudes like this still so prevalent. And from our own side! No-one routinely accuses victims of other crimes of making them up, do they? You don't get people reporting a break-in treated as untrustworthy. So wtf is everyone so convinced that there are thousands of women just waiting to have fun being put through the mill of giving evidence about rape?

Feel strongly about this anyway, but particuarly because a very good friend of mine has just told me that she was damn near raped at a work function some months ago. Whole thing has been completely covered up.

giddy1 · 20/10/2006 22:39

Message deleted

sorrell · 20/10/2006 22:40

So how do you prove it is false? Investigate every case? Or just some? Leave it as a threat hanging over every single woman who reports rape. Bear in mind that very, very, very few rape victims even report their rape, and of those, a fraction of cases result in conviction. I happen to think that serial rapists repeatedly raping women is a more serious problem than the odd mentally ill, self-harming, delusional woman falsely accusing men. After all the second case is vanishingly rare. The former is all too common.

sorrell · 20/10/2006 22:40

She's not a 'silly woman', she is a very disturbed mentally ill woman. Slightly different, I think.

Original poster
GhoulsToo · 20/10/2006 22:44

I agree that this is a special case and the woman is clearly troubled but you also have to look at it from the man's pov.

Imagine if it were your dh or db and they'd spent 3½ years on prison?

OP posts:
CountTo10 · 20/10/2006 22:47

edam strung up might sound harsh but which side is a woman on that falsely accuses anyone of rape knowing it not to be true??? Certainly not mine or any other woman in this world. Its not just about the effect it has on the innocent man, its the damaging effect it has on how rape is viewed and the women brave enough to report it (of which I am sadly not one). Women have fought for years to have rape recognised as something that is wrong, and something they should not be ashamed of. When a woman does what this woman has, it puts those efforts back years - how am I supposed to be sympathetic to that?? It just gives those men who are guilty of rape more ability for their defence to discredit their victim.

CreepyCrawlyCarmenere · 20/10/2006 22:48

Because it happens more often than you will know. Do you really think that there arn't lots of stupid women out there who falsely report rape for whatever reason. They are the ones that are jeoprodising the genuine cases.
It does happen, my dp is a dc in the met and has experienced this far more often than he should have. Stupid women who have falsely reported this most heinious of crimes as a solution to a petty problem. And before you all jump in with prejudices about the police, he is a kind and sensitive man who is sympathetic to any woman who has been harmed. They investigate every case to the full and with equal seriousness. Unfortunately many women do cry wolf, should they be allowed to just get away with it?

VeniVidiVickiQV · 20/10/2006 22:51

This is a hugely sore subject for me.

I am currently in the process of setting up a website to encourage more women (and men) to come forward and report this kind of crime for the exact reasons this case has highlighted. For exampled the paltry 5.6% conviction rate for all reported rapes. Thats all reported rapes.

I think, before people start naming false accusers, it has to be able to be reasonably applied to all other failed/quashed criminal cases.

If it is such a clear cut case that a woman has lied about rape - it wouldnt get to court in the first place. The CPS actively discourage cases going to court because they are notoriously difficult to prove. Why on earth would they put forward a case where the woman is "clearly lying"?

First on my list to be prosecuted for perjury would be Professor Sir Roy Meadows......

sorrell · 20/10/2006 22:52

Injustices happen and they are dreadful. But far, far more women are raped than men are falsely accused. I know several woman who have been raped, for a start, and no men who have been falsely accused (or even claim to be). And not ONE of the rape victims I know even reported it. I think this is not the key issue in rape cases. Not by a very long shot.

sorrell · 20/10/2006 22:53

Er 'strung up MIGHT sound harsh'? You betcha it does. YOu can rape a woman until her insides are ruined and she can never have a child and is destroyed as a person and the worst that will happen is a few years in prison, but lie in court and you 'deserve to be strung up'? What kind of world is this?

giddy1 · 20/10/2006 22:55

Message deleted

VeniVidiVickiQV · 20/10/2006 22:58

Carmenere - that is a shockingly misguided generalisation "many women cry wolf".

They certainly do not. You have no facts and figures to back that up, furthermore, I have it on pretty good authority that police attitude to claims of rape is NOT ALWAYS as "PC" as it should be. DESPITE what regulatory bodies say it should be.

There are many many many more women who do not report rape for this very reason - that people wont believe them.

As far as I am concerned - I would be quite happy for those who falsely claim rape to be named when society and law means that rape is reported properly, sensitively and with the respect and gravity that this shocking crime deserves. When conviction rates improve from the meagre 5.6% that it currently is, and the report is equal to that of all other crimes so that victims feel like they arent the criminal - then yes - name and shame.

Before that time it will do far more harm to rape victims - that includes men and CHILDREN, who will have less incentive to report than they do now.

And unfortunately, the perpetrators of this crime positively thrive on the fact that their victim most likely wont report it which is how they often go on to rape/assault/abuse again and again and again.

GoingQuietlyMad · 20/10/2006 23:02

Have to agree with sorrell. I know so many women who have been raped, and never reported it. Just because one man has been convicted "falsely" we all jump on this?????

A very sad day for women.

CountTo10 · 20/10/2006 23:02

OK I remove the words 'strung up' from my original post and replace them with 'severely reprimanded' as what I deemed as just a saying has obviously caused offence and in hindsigt is ott and I apologise. I would, however, like this said woman to meet some genuine rape victims and see what effect this crime has on these peoples lives and then perhaps she'll think twice about behaving so appallingly again.

VeniVidiVickiQV · 20/10/2006 23:02

Agree with Sorrell 110%.

CountTo10 · 20/10/2006 23:03

See just to clarify I'm not outraged re the innocent man - I'm outraged at the damage it does to the genuine rape victims credibility.

VeniVidiVickiQV · 20/10/2006 23:04

The very sad irony about your last post Countto10, is that she probably meets "real" victims of rape/assault everyday and doesnt even know it, because the crime is so very common.

edam · 20/10/2006 23:07

It wouldn't be doing half as much damage to the credibility of victims if this idiotic peer hadn't raised it in parliament, though, would it? No doubt he thinks those feather-headed ladies are just making a fuss about nothing and should accept sexual violence as part of our lot in life. Certainly that's what an awful lot of outwardly-respectable men seem to think, judging by what has happened to my friend.

CreepyCrawlyCarmenere · 20/10/2006 23:08

VVVQ I am by no means unsympathetic to women who have been raped(been there myself actually). And would have never have believed that anyone would do something as vacuous as cry wolf with a crime as horrific as rape. But my anecdotal evidence is that it happens, and more often than it should and my opinion is that this is a contributing factor to the undoubted difficulty of sucessfully prosecuting a rape case.
I'm sure that many police attitudes to a rape case are not as PC as they should be but I can only speak for my dp who I trust to be a compassionate human being.