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Bedroom tax will be costly disaster, says housing chief

999 replies

vivizone · 31/03/2013 06:51

I don't understand how they can implement it. When a council tenant signs the tenancy agreement, if bedroom tax is not mentioned, is it not illegal to implement it at a later date?

I don't see how it is enforceable. Let's say a tenant refuses to pay/can't pay. They then get evicted - wouldn't the council still be obliged to house them after eviction, especially if they have children?

The whole thing is a mess. Why so many changes all at the same time?!

www.guardian.co.uk/society/2013/mar/30/bedroom-tax-disaster-housing-chief

Cost-cutting policy will push up benefit bill, cause social disruption and create widespread misery, say critics

Ministers came under new fire over benefit cuts last night as the independent body representing 1,200 English housing associations described the controversial bedroom tax as bad policy and bad economics that risks pushing up the £23bn annual housing benefit bill.

David Orr, chief executive of the National Housing Federation, said the tax would harm the lives of hundreds of thousands of people. It comes into force this week alongside a range of other tax and benefit changes.

"The bedroom tax is one of these once-in-a-generation decisions that is wrong in every respect," he said. "It's bad policy, it's bad economics, it's bad for hundreds of thousands of ordinary people whose lives will be made difficult for no benefit ? and I think it's about to become profoundly bad politics."

His intervention came as opponents launched nationwide protests against the tax, which will hit 660,000 households with each losing an estimated average of £14 a week.

Crowds gathered in London's Trafalgar Square yesterday to protest against the measure, and simultaneous protests were being held in towns and cities across the UK. One protester, Sue Carter, 58, from Waltham Forest, told the Observer: "I'm a working single parent with a tiny boxroom and now I'm faced with the choice between food, heat or paying the bedroom tax. People have looked after their homes, improved them ? why should they be turfed out?"

Under the scheme, which is introduced tomorrow, people in social housing with one spare bedroom will have their housing benefit cut by 14%, while those with two or more unoccupied rooms will see it slashed by 25%.

Ministers say the tax, which David Cameron calls the "spare room subsidy", will encourage people to move to smaller properties and save around £480m a year from the spiralling housing benefit bill. But critics such as the National Housing Federation (NHF) argue that as well as causing social disruption, the move risks increasing costs to taxpayers because a shortage of smaller social housing properties may force many people to downsize into the more expensive private rented sector.

The federation's warnings came as charities said the combination of benefit cuts and tax rises coming in from this week will amount to a £2.3bn hit on family finances.

Labour said analysis of official figures showed average families would be £891 worse off in the new tax year as the changes ? including those to tax credits and housing benefits ? begin to bite.

Research by the NHF says that while there are currently 180,000 households that are "underoccupying two-bedroom homes", there are far fewer smaller properties in the social housing sector available to move into. Last year only 85,000 one-bedroom homes became available. The federation has calculated that if all those available places were taken up by people moving as a result of the "bedroom tax", the remaining 95,000 households would be faced with the choice of staying put and taking a cut in income, or renting a home in the private sector.

If all 95,000 moved into the private sector, it says the cost of housing benefit would increase by £143m, and by millions more if others among the remaining 480,000 affected chose to rent privately.

As well as the move on spare bedrooms, council tax benefit will be replaced from this week by a new system that will be run by English local authorities but on 10% less funding. Pensioners will be protected under the changes but, as a result, it is feared there will be a bigger burden on poor working-age adults. Restrictions on the uprating of a number of welfare payments will also hit millions of households, homelessness charity Crisis has warned.

Chief executive Leslie Morphy said: "Our poorest households face a bleak April as they struggle to budget for all these cuts coming at once. People are already cutting back on the essentials of food and heating but there is only so much they can do.

"The result will be misery ? cold rooms, longer queues at food banks, broken families, missed rent payments and yet more people facing homelessness ? devastating for those directly affected, but bad for us all."

A Department for Work and Pensions spokesman said: "Our welfare reforms will improve the lives of some of the poorest families in our communities, with universal credit simplifying the complex myriad of benefits and making three million people better off. And by next year, we will have taken two million of the lowest earners out of paying tax altogether."

Crisis argues that homelessness is set to rise dramatically. This winter has already seen a rise of 31% in the numbers of rough sleepers across the country and a 20% rise in people seeking help with homelessness from their local authority in the past two years, according to Crisis.

ChartiesCharities are also concerned that the government-funded network of homelessness advisers in England is to be scrapped. The team of regional advisers and rough sleeper and youth specialists which have provided councils with expert guidance on meeting statutory homelessness duties since 2007 will be disbanded just as the bedroom tax comes in. Also being scrapped are the crisis loans and community care grants which provided a lifeline for people in financial crisis who needed essentials when moving to a new home.

Shadow chancellor Ed Balls said: "This is the week when the whole country will see whose side David Cameron and George Osborne are really on and who is paying the price for their economic failure."

OP posts:
FasterStronger · 01/04/2013 21:18

on topic - it does seem pretty silly that the basic HB rules don't account for someone needing bulky equipment e.g. a hoist. or adaptations.

but I doubt any govt database contains the necessary information in a usable format. so someone has to apply as they could not be identified otherwise.

skinnywitch · 01/04/2013 21:18

Victor you are wrong again. My parents and I are estranged. Sorry I'm not fitting into your silver spoon rich bastard box, but keep trying.

pollypandemonium · 01/04/2013 21:18

Even our favourite rightwinger David Starkey said that the tweaking and tinkering with tax breaks and penalties is woefully inadequate and is just prolonging the pain. He said on newsnight that a drastic change was necessary and all this niggling and blaming wasn't enabling us to grasp the nettle and make any changes that will have a long term impact. He said that a post-war style rebuilding programme was the only thing that could bring us out of recession - fiddling about with tax here and there is going to make that harder. He was very angry about it (as you can imagine). I think the government has such a low opinion of the unemployed - they seem to assume that they don't want to work. They may not want to work for Tesco for NMW but if you gave them a barrow and told them to rebuild the nation for their kids I'm pretty sure most of them would be honoured to.

VictorTango · 01/04/2013 21:21

Skinny- I think your middle class background was solid?

Mini is right - your story doesn't fit right.

lottieandmia · 01/04/2013 21:21

They are happening, but that doesn't make it right. That's what the thread is about.

I tell you what, I'll write to the people in my town who are panicking because they can no longer pay their rent, including the man whose dd lives with him 50% of the time and yet is being told he is under-occupying a 2 bed flat and tell them everything will be ok if they just stop being lazy and decide to become a self made millionaire.

rhondajean · 01/04/2013 21:23

The sad thing is skinny, you probably think you did do it all by yourself.

And no you don't fuck me off at all, I have a very realistic understanding of the world and all the types in it, including yours, and I am able to feel empathy.

In fact, I very rarely get fucked off. Depressed from time to time, saddened, even frustrated, but not fucked off.

skinnywitch · 01/04/2013 21:23

victor believe it or not - it's irrelevant to me. We became estranged in adulthood ( a not too unusual story,sadly) but I have no intention of going into more detail.

Tasmania · 01/04/2013 21:24

Mini

My parents are reasonably well-off. Their assets alone are worth more than a million at least. HOWEVER, my father always thought that his children had to make it on their own. So... yes, you had to live in a sh*thole sometimes and it was easier not to ask him for help.

FasterStronger · 01/04/2013 21:24

is this thread now called have a go at skinny because I thought it was about the bedroom tax?

girliefriend · 01/04/2013 21:24

Good point mini, also not sure where your thinking skinny would lead eventually...

Would you like to see children living on the streets or collecting plastic from rubbish dumps as they do in other third world countries?

We either live in a country where we look after one another or we don't.

twofingerstoGideon · 01/04/2013 21:25

Bloody hell, skinny. You sound very, very angry. What is making you so miserable? Your millions in the bank? Your successful business? Your domestic staff?
Why are you getting so worked up?

pollypandemonium · 01/04/2013 21:26

Here's Dave www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-21895497

FasterStronger · 01/04/2013 21:26

maybe because a number of posters are being rude to her?

twofingerstoGideon · 01/04/2013 21:26

is this thread now called have a go at skinny because I thought it was about the bedroom tax?

I know you're a supporter, Faster, but frankly I think skinny is bringing the wrath upon herself. She has been rather rude to several people on this thread.

skinnywitch · 01/04/2013 21:27

Would you like to see children living on the streets or collecting plastic from rubbish dumps as they do in other third world countries?

Gosh no, what a waste. Put 'em up chimneys!

twofingerstoGideon · 01/04/2013 21:27

...not to mention a tad sanctimonious.

Viviennemary · 01/04/2013 21:28

I think a drastic overhaul of the Housing Benefit system is needed. And drastic overhaul of council house allocation and right to remain and right to take over tenancies. I listened to Ian Duncan Smith tonight saying a few words and I am realising that it's not as easy as he seems to think.

So if somebody now has a spare bedroom so has to pay extra on a really limited wage, it will be very hard for them if they are counting every penny already £14 a week is quite a lot. And also can they just go and find a new smaller place in the next street so easily. No they couldn't.

VictorTango · 01/04/2013 21:28

This reply has been deleted

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twofingerstoGideon · 01/04/2013 21:29

Quite, vicar

lottieandmia · 01/04/2013 21:29

'is this thread now called have a go at skinny because I thought it was about the bedroom tax?'

Upthread, skinny has said that all poor people should be able to become self-made millionaires because of their access to 'good education' and 'good healthcare'

You can expect to be challenged on thinking this way.

flatbread · 01/04/2013 21:30

They may not want to work for Tesco for NMW

Why?

skinnywitch · 01/04/2013 21:30

And it's your refusal to accept that many of us are not fortunate we just work hard and take risks, that gets mine.

Tasmania · 01/04/2013 21:31

Faster - Poor Skinny is getting the tough treatment here because some people on here seem to be the ones affected or at least know people who are. They keep on wanting Skinny to see it from their perspective, but seriously, if you asked those very same people (who earn a living) why they do not voluntarily give up half their income to pay someone else's accommodation, because they are so poor... they wouldn't.

Question should be the one paying?!? The likes of Skinny???

IneedAsockamnesty · 01/04/2013 21:32

And none of that has anything to do with under occupancy.

FasterStronger · 01/04/2013 21:32

two - I don't know if she knew if one of the posters was the parent of a child with severe disabilities. its is easy to get lost with names.

oh goodie - David Starkey - I am always surprised to hear he has a wife. I am really. not only poor poor poor woman. but he likes ladies not gentlemen .....??..... Shock

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