Social 'cleansing'? What are the implications?

[Solopower1]

Camden Council wants to move 750 poor families north to places like Bradford and Leicester. They say that because of the new benefit caps (which limit total welfare payments to £500 a week for families, no matter how many children they have or how much they have to pay for rent), some families are not going to be able to afford to live in London. So they're shunting them all up north.

I don't think this is a new idea, btw, but I still find it shocking.

When the govt were discussing these benefit cap plans, they must have worked out the implications for the families that would no longer be able to afford to live in their houses. And they will have realised that this would happen more in the poorer, Labour-run (?) councils. It's inspired, it's so clever. In one fell swoop they free up all the lovely expensive properties being wasted on poor families, and the Labour councils get the blame for it. It's absolute genius, don't you think?

So what sort of place will London be, when the heart is ripped out of it, and all the children go? Perhaps a tad melodramatic, but the Pied Piper springs to mind - not that I am blaming the Mayor and Corporation of Camden, particularly (don't know enough about it, tbh).

money.aol.co.uk/2013/02/14/council-to-export-poor-familes-to-north/

How long is it til the next election?

and what is going to happen to rents in the cities were they are shipped to when demand starts exceeding supply.What about healthcare and education provision?

Move the queen to moss side

it should be a twitter campaign

" niceguy2 Sat 16-Feb-13 09:40:50

Oh God. Not tax the rich again.

Do you not think if it was really as simple as raising taxes on the rich to balance our books, they'd have done it?"

Erm no, becuase they are friends with the super rich and the masters of industry, they shape policy to line their own and their friends pockets. bullingdon club fwnarr fwnarr

Masons handshake, hop on one foot with your tongue up someones arse.

Do you think George osborne 17th decendant from a baronet ( or something)

"Osborne is one of the old Anglo-Irish aristocracy, described in Ireland as the Ascendancy. He is the heir apparent to the Osborne baronetcy" [wiki]

highly educated - 4 million in his bank account - actually give a flying shit - or has the most basic of knowledge of what it's like?

no,

am i right in thinking i read that old Georgey boy didn't know a thing about economics?

"He was given a demyship to Magdalen College, University of Oxford where he received a 2:1 bachelor's degree in Modern History. At Oxford he edited the university's Isis magazine, and was a member of the Bullingdon Club...

After graduating in 1992, Osborne did a few part-time jobs including as a data entry clerk, typing the details of recently deceased into a NHS computer database.[13] He also briefly worked for a week at Selfridges, mainly re-folding towels.[13]

In 1993, Osborne originally intended to pursue a career in journalism. He was shortlisted for but failed to gain a place on The Times trainee scheme, and instead did freelance work on the Peterborough diary column of The Daily Telegraph. Some time later, an Oxford friend of his, journalist George Bridges, alerted Osborne to a research vacancy at Conservative Central Office."

do the handshake Georgey boy and lick someones arse - you're in with your other rich friends

sorry that was also wiki

The only people affected by this policy are NON WORKING HOUSEHOLDS.

So hb will still be payed for the majority of hb claimants.

It won't affect the low paid...there are currently no proposals to cap working tax credit.

Shelley.

Does it say anywhere that it only affects non working households. Also if this is the case do you think it makes it ok then?

Explained here

Relevant bit is:

Who won?t be affected?

You won?t be affected by the benefit cap if you qualify for Working Tax Credit, or if you get any of the following benefits:

Disability Living Allowance
Personal Independence Payment (from April 2013)
Attendance Allowance
Industrial Injuries Benefits (and equivalent payments as part of a war disablement pension or the Armed Forces Compensation Scheme)
Employment and Support Allowance, if you get the support component
War Widow?s or War Widower?s Pension

It's getting confused with the reduction in the LHA which does apply to working households but is not what the OP's original post is referring to

I think it will affect some working households - those that don't meet 'conditionality' could be thrown to the wolves, eg lone parent working 10 hours a week at minimum wage as a dinner lady, who lives in an over-priced private rent (that was probably a former council home) in inner London.

Then that part time dinner lady needs to accept that if you work for only 10 hours a week in a non skilled job, you can't expect those of us working 40/50/60 hour weeks to fund your house in a part of London we couldn't begin to afford.

Why should those who don't work or work for a just a few hours a week, enjoy a standard of living those of us working our butts off enjoy? Or in fact, better than many working enjoy.

I welcome and applaud this policy. As does everyone I know, all of whom work long and hard.

Hard to get even a DL job around here.

Auntmaude. DFO you fund nobody, your tax pays for roads, schools, infrastructure. So because you work you are better than somebody who doesn't. Go ahead and applaud, openly support social cleansing. You are the type who are worrying me. Do you also believe in kids being taken off parents who can't afford to keep them?

lljkk then presumably you wouldn't object to moving to somewhere where there might be more jobs?

morethan don't put words into my mouth. Am I better than someone who actively chooses NOT to work when they can and lives off others? Too fucking right.

Oh , and morethan = we paid over 100K in tax last year so my tax goes a bloody long way to fund those living on benefits in overpriced housing. And I pay it GLADLY to fund the sick, the vulnerable and the elderly and disabled. But I'm buggered if I'll pay it gladly to fund the lazy, the wasters and the workshy.

AuntMaud I was responding to the assertion that this policy couldn't affect working households.

Auntmaude.

You are choosing your own words you are presuming that people not working are actively choosing not to work, how do you know this?
Some people do choose not to work, why should this bother you or anybody else for that matter? Why are people so obsessed with what others are doing, where they live, what they own, if they work or not? In the scheme of things the 0.5% of claimants not working for over 2 years hardly makes a dent in the current climate, i'm afraid.

AuntMaud, I don't think that swearing helps, do you?

The type of person who worries me is the type who thinks they have the right to live in an expensive house in inner London and have the rent paid by some poor person's taxes who can't even afford to leave home and rent or buy a house of their own. I am one of those who are pleased this policy has been introduced.

Nobody is better than anybody else. But nobody has the right to expect to work 10 hours a week and have rent subsidised by other people working four times that number of hours or more. For less money than they are having their rent subsidised for. Can't see why people don't see this.

Auntmaude.

I don't work and I am by no means a work shy, lazy waster. Also, it is not the persons fault their home is as you term it "overpriced"
I suggest until you have lived the life of the people you so easily condemn, the ones you feel superior to, you haven't got a clue what you are talking about.

Why are people so obsessed with what others are doing, where they live, what they own
Nobody actually is, they're objecting to the notion (that you're advocating very strongly) that people should choose where they live, what they own, etc, when they actually have no means to pay for any of it.

Vivienne and Auntmaude

I do not live in the South but have heard a reasoned argument as to why people believe this is a good idea.
What I fail to understand is why people can be so blind as to the plight of social cleansing and what it might mean for these families.
In the North it may be cheaper, but many of the facilities and opportunities available in the Capital are not here. The LEA's are over stretched as are many health services. In addition, there could be families leaving their extended family who offered them vital support. The disruption these people are going to witness surely deserves some empathy rather than name calling.

Where are the extra schools, hospital beds, houses etc 'up north' going to come from?

yes, what if all we decided we didn't want to work. where would the country be then. Live where you what you want but pay for it yourself unless you are one of the people that Floosie outlines.

I don't think the housing benefit system has helped people in the long run and made them more dependent on the state and pushed rents up.

Flogging

The people who will be forced to move did choose where they wanted to live and could have been there for generations. It seems silly to object to a notion that doesn't really seem to be backed up by anything solid. A bunch of rich people complaining about what the poor have.
I don't know of anybody on benefit in a position to choose what they want to own, they can't afford it.

No sorry. They must live within their means. I do not shop at Waitrose because I cannot afford to. Should I be subsidised by the government to shop there because it is the nearest supermarket and the nicest one near me. I do buy the odd thing few things there so am not looking for sympathy!

The point is people cannot expect others to subsidise huge rents. And this government has realised what a nonsense this is and has brought in rental caps to prevent this. A lot of people have to move away from their support in order to find a house they can afford or because they find a new job or are made redundant. Why on earth are these people any different from the rest of the population that they must be wrapped in cotton wool and protected from the realities that others face every day.

alemci.

You'd be shipped up narth