Gove to announce scrapping of GCSEs

[Itchyandscratchy]

But before anyone is taken in by the leak announcement in the Daily Hate Mail here, take the time to then read this for a more informed version.

With any luck they'll be out of a job in 2015 when this is sposed to be brought in, but there's no doubt GCSEs will be scrapped. What I woud hope is that Labour will get is finger out and propose a system that has had full consultation with schools, teachers, employment agencies, industry chiefs and unions.

It will change how every child is currently taught at secondary school. And I hope that doesn't mean some children's futures are determined by the age of 11.

'classic works are the best'

A classic work doesn't have to be old. But classics stand out from the crowd, they are rare, because geniuses are rare. They don't come around often. The point of reading classics is that they are deeper, better and more fulfilling than the run of the mill novel. Mill on the Floss is better than much of the now lauded dross.

Yes, and to understand what's going on in it you need to know about evolutionary debate and Eliot's engagement with it, for one thing. AND Maggie T reads Pilgrim's Progress!

I think just to read it and keep on going MY GOD it's sad how that girl didn't get educated and Stephen Guest was horrible etc is to miss a lot.

FR Leavis said it wasn't a classic, actually, because the flood is not adequately anticipated and Stephen Guest wasn't very well drawn.

Did FR Leavis take leave of his senses? What did he ever write that can compare to the mighty George Eliot?

Well, he was a prick, IMO

I've written a YA (Young Adult) novel, which my agent distributed to publishers earlier this year. Across the board the publishers are very interested in my manuscript, but consider its style "too sophisticated" for the YA market.
Consequently, I've spent the summer writing a subplot to bump up the word count to adult historical fiction size for resubmission.
I'm obviously thrilled they like my stuff, but somewhat shocked that they consider my writing too "sophisticated" for students who study the types of literature you have been discussing here.

'FR Leavis said it wasn't a classic, actually, because ... Stephen Guest wasn't very well drawn'

FR leavis couldn't draw a ticket from a raffle. FR Leavis? Leave it out!

Well I quite agree! But in other matters, what you're saying about the way literature should be approached is essentially Leavisite, y'know!

'what you're saying about the way literature should be approached is essentially Leavisite'

I take it back. FR Leavis sounds like a lone voice of rigour and rectitude.

Good luck with teh novel, happybirthdayHiggs. It is worrying that the uyoung adult market is not open to sophisticated writing. I think it may be due to our MTV, modularised, bite-sized, fun-size choccie bar culture. It's all part of the incessant dumbing down, and I think Gove is trying to turn it round, so that children can get their teeth into a substantial piece of meat rather than a bite-sized morsel.

Thanks claig. It is very exciting, but I must admit to being a little disappointed that it won't (if it is published) be targeted at the market I intended. I wrote it very much with my YA's in mind. A sort of extension to the childhood storytelling I've inflicted on them all their lives.
The running theme of feedback seemed to be that my sentences are too long for YA. This was from both UK and US publishers.

Nah, nit Far too many subversives there. It was basically a school for subversives. Whatever Keith may have fondly imagined.

@Bigboobiedbertha Exactly. Great post.

Neither do I agree with homework for children of primary school age; too much playing to do in the evenings to find the time.

And playing is proper learning.

However, most parents love homework - have no idea why - and therefore schools set it. Children are in school for 6 hours a day and - if they haven't done enough formal learning in that time - then the school is doing something wrong.

There is only 3 hours in the evening to play, eat, bath, chill, read, do brownies - how on earth is homework meant to fit in?

claig The whole of Gove's Oxford looked down on George Eliot. She was not taught. Even in 1970 O level English Literature was dismissed even by my blue stocking spinster grammar school teachers for being entirely lacking in intellectual challenge. Those of us taking it to A level started the A level course and did not sit it. (Something else nostalgia has probably cleaned from your memory is that 8 was considered the usual number of O levels for University . Now it is 10. That means students have a grounding in two other subjects. It meant my Scientist daughter could keep up History and Geography and two languages and my Philosophy loving daughter has a grounding in all three Sciences, whereas I did a dogs dinner of a basic Science O level called Physics with Chemistry)

As I said in my last post which you ignored I really do think you should indulge your love of Literature and do one of the online courses from Oxford's Continuing Education Department on one of the authors you love. They are run by academics who have taught in other colleges and anyone can sign on, though I gather many are put off in the early weeks by the rigour. They will enrich your understanding not just of the author but just how much new approaches can enrich you understanding. I do not think you can comment until you have experienced it.

TheOriginalSteamingNit

happybirthdayHiggs The publishing industry is now all about marketing and they segment their offering just like every other industry. Whilst there is the niche in the market for the elite end of literary fiction, the Booker shortlist etc., romances, crime novels etc cater to the needs of much larger segments of the market. Fifty Shades of Grey has found itself a whole new mass market. Absolutely terrible rewrites of the classic novels (and now ones with added sex) outsell the actual classics by a very large margin. I might call some of these books utter rubbish and sneer at them but far more people want to read them than read the books I enjoy (and of course Booker winners are said to have dumbed down) And the age demographics of these segments of the mass market? Absolutely across the board, those who sat O levels alongside those now sitting GCSEs. Doubtless your publishers evaluated your book not as a literary creation but as to whether it met the reading needs of the market amongst YA which they have doubtless researched meticulously (and to my knowledge doesn't include a lot of historical fiction) and have determined it better meets the needs of the historical fiction market . But young adults are a diverse bunch, my 16 year old DDs reading pile is diverse. There is some Brett Easton Ellis but teher is also The Virgin Suicides and she just finished the Great Gatsby and not as required reading for a course, and is about to start Jamrach's menagerie. I wouldn't extrapolate from the marketing decision of a publisher to the reading habits of young people, or at least if you do you have to assume most older people are equally interested only in badly written sex, romance and violent death.

Copthallresident, thanks for the introduction to The Oxford Continuing Education Dept. I looked them up on the internet and they offer lots of good courses at reasonable prices. Looked up Cambridge and they offer some too. There is lots for me to get stuck into there, and it looks like rigour is de rigeur, which is the way that Gove and I like it. One of these days, I will sign up for some courses.

Sorry that should have been de rigueur.

Well quite, Copthall, the fact that there is very little historical fiction aimed at YA's was a massive part of the appeal, as far as I'm concerned. I'd hoped my writing (fiction, but based around historically documented events) would demonstrate to a teenage audience that history, far from being dull, is full of wonder and excitement and unlikely happenstance.
I have resolved just to tell the best story I can and trust that it will find its own market, should it get published.

Copthall - cheers!

I think you are right, the trouble with marketers and I was one, is they forget the fact that you can create a need as well as identify one that is already there. It is just a bit harder work. I would have thought with the success of Horrible Histories and some really good pre teen historical fiction that there is a gap in the market. Rosemary Sutcliffe, Henry Treece and Jean Plaidy had a lot more to do with my life long love of history (though the latter was a terrible writer and Treece apparently a facist) than my Grammar School education so it would probably do more for History as a subject than Gove's reforms!! Good luck.

Thanks, Copthall. I'm watching with interest to see how Philippa Gregory's foray into the YA market works out. My agent has indicated that that publishers are far more inclined to take a risk with established authors than with a debut one. Perhaps she'll open the door a crack, although I've already written the extra 30,000 words now, and there'd need to be some ruthless editing to get it back to YA length. My own passion for history, much like yours, is self inflicted rather than formally learned.
On the whole I think Gove is right to push for a core of essential subjects supplemented by complementary subjects, but I lament the fact that syllabuses nowadays are so rigid as to not allow teachers to inspire their students with their passion.

Out of interest, what % of children actually took 7-9 O-levels back in the day? I thought it was the minority. Is the idea that all children can do O-levels now, or have they just not had any ideas yet about what the majority of children are going to do.

I haven't heard anybody arguing about how fab CSE's were, but assume that was the most widely take exam (or were there just loads of people who left school with no qualifications?).

5 olevel passes put you in top 15%

Well, the whole thing is mystifying.

Does Gove think that the only thing holding back the other 85% was poor teaching? In which case, given that he doesn't seem to have much confidence in teachers, what is he going to do between now and 2017?

Gove is full of contradictions. He has stated that the numbers of students getting high grades is just due to grade inflation and not better teaching and attainment, but at the same time thinks countries which have higher numbers getting good grades have a superior system .

He thinks that the large numbers of children failing to get five good GCSEs is evidence of school failure, and is going to fix this by making the new exams harder so more will pass them .

He has clearly though it all through