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Original poster

Outward facing carriers and push chairs are "child cruelty"

61 replies

pookamoo · 22/08/2011 12:45

Surely not so?

We had a pram and then a pushchair for DD which faced the pusher, and turned her round when she was about 2, and then she would usually tell us which way she wanted the pushchair...
But we got a sling when she was a colicy, sad 4 month old, and she howled when facing in, but was happy and content facing out!

Doesn't it depend on the child?

(ok, so I am listening to Jeremy Vine - so shoot me! Grin )

OP posts:
Valetude · 22/08/2011 17:54

I'm talking kids of walking age, not babies. Slings are the db for babies.

RitaMorgan · 22/08/2011 18:21

So once your child can walk you shouldn't use a sling Confused

usingapseudonym · 22/08/2011 18:25

That's funny - I know a lot of people who use slings, being that I used one myself, and most tend to walk from 2 onwards and occasionally use a sling when tired - very different from being in a pushchair beyond walking age! Certainly at a group I go to where most use slings they are far from clingy - after developing a very healthy attachment in the first 2 years they are often very independent!!

You must know some odd people...

usingapseudonym · 22/08/2011 18:27

i meant only walk from 2 onwards. Obviously they walk a lot before that too!! However most pushchair-friends of mine still use a pushchair a long time after that. Each to their own!

GwendolineMaryLacey · 22/08/2011 18:28

Nonsense. My only issue with slings though is that they look extremely uncomfortable for the baby when they're facing outwards and their legs are just hanging. It doesn't look particularly good for them. But DD hated slings so I'm prepared to be educated :)

Cattleprod · 22/08/2011 18:36

When it comes to pushchairs, I think it's far more 'cruel' to force your child to stare at your crotch for the entire journey, rather than all the interesting people, animals, shops, cars, trees, flowers, trains etc that you are walking past.

BertieBotts · 22/08/2011 18:38

"Cruelty" is too far and probably intended to be attention grabbing rather than accurate.

I wouldn't carry a baby facing completely out, even if their legs and hips can be supported properly - I think the stimulation is too much. I agree they like to see what is going on but someone showed me a way to carry DS so he was sort of sideways in the moby but with the weight still on both of my shoulders, so not a true hip carry. The problem with facing out is that if they get overwhelmed or overstimulated they can't escape - carrying on your back or with them side-on to the world is the best compromise as they can see but also come back for some quiet time just resting on you. Babies who are overstimulated actually tend to go to sleep, it's sort of a defence mechanism - they just shut off.

Having said that it's not a massive thing - don't feel bad if you've already done it. I would just like to see it discouraged. I'd imagine the same issues exist for forward facing pushchairs if used from too young an age as well, but again, I wouldn't call it cruelty.

ragged · 22/08/2011 18:51

Bollux.

I am a quiet person who doesn't talk much anyway. IN or outward facing isn't going to make me an any more talkative person. DC4 had a RF pushchair, come to think of it, unlike his siblings, and was probably the worst talker in my lot (all somewhat speech delayed). DC4's speech came on brilliantly when he started to watch lots of cbeebies, that's my top tip for parents of delayed talkers, btw. Wink

We got on very well with the B-Bjorn, tried other carriers but couldn't make any sense of them, or babies hated them and they killed my back to boot (unlike the BB).

Original poster
pookamoo · 22/08/2011 19:55

I missed the start of the excerpt on the radio, so I didn't hear where the "research" actually came from, has anyone seen it?

I still think it depends on the child, and we've used in and out facing forms of transport for DD (2.10) and she is absolutely fine!

OP posts:
fluffles · 22/08/2011 20:00

my neice refused to be carried facing inwards by anybody from about six months onwards... unless she was actually asleep she HAD to be facing out into the world or she'd wiggle and scream... i think it must depend on the child.

mousesma · 22/08/2011 20:13

Yep I'm in the bollox camp too.

We've always used a forward facing buggy and DD loves having a good nose around. Even if we're stopped for a bit and she's facing me she's still looking over my shoulder half the time trying to see what's going on.

Woodlands · 22/08/2011 20:20

I used a rear facing buggy but by about 9 months DS would crane his neck round to see where we were going. I turned it round and then only had him facing me when I wanted him to go to sleep. at 12 months we stopped using that buggy altogether and now we just use a little folding Maclaren.

I used a Kari-Me and I feel really bad that until I went to a sling meet at about 8 months I didn't realise I was doing it wrong and supporting his legs knee pit to knee pit. We used to have him facing out a lot when he was bout 4 months old and he seemed to love it. I wouldn't do that next time. Ah well. Nowadays I use a sling similar to a Mei Tai but DS doesn't like being on my front facing me - again he's always craning to see where we're going. Though yesterday we did have a nice walk with him on my front making silly faces at each other and him inserting his hand in my mouth/nose and giggling.

Valetude · 22/08/2011 20:23

Usingapseudonym, I don't know odd people, I don't think, I've just seen one too many 3 yr olds being lugged around by extremely physically tired stooping women, refusing to walk etc.

Confident children exist no matter how they are moved from a to b as babies.

RitaMorgan · 22/08/2011 20:38

I've never met anyone who lugs around a 3 year old if it makes them extremely physically tired Confused

bibbitybobbityhat · 22/08/2011 21:42

I actually feel rather sad for all the babies and toddlers who are going to miss out on having a different view of the world in a forward facing (as opposed to parent facing) pushchair as the result of this new "fad". Poor little lambs. It will all change again in 5 years time, without a doubt.

exoticfruits · 22/08/2011 22:15

It all depends on the DC-there is never a 'right' answer for all DCs.

Ryoko · 23/08/2011 01:48

My 16 month old son loves seeing where he's going when in the pushchair, not that he's in it much, he prefers to walk with the reins, I expect those are "child cruelty" too.

Kids want to see the wonders of the world around them, not stare up mummies nose constantly.

addressbook · 23/08/2011 13:22

I could maybe see, with good evidence that yes some children are talked to more when facing their parents, or feel more secure facing mum and dad.

However every child, parent and situation is individual. One rule cannot apply to all.

And to use the term 'cruelty' is ridiculous and quite frankly disgusting. I had an abusive childhood and I find this notion highly insulting

SpeedyGonzalez · 24/08/2011 19:56

Oh fgs, what a dumb thing to say (I mean the JV comment).

If you don't talk to or look at your child, ever, they will certainly develop communication problems.

Apart from that, kids are born pretty intelligent and there's rather a lot of developmental wiggle room.

NacMacFeegle · 25/08/2011 08:08

I used MT for DC3 with a back carry from about 6 weeks old. That's probably even worse. Still using same MT in very similar way now he's a hulking 2.5 stone 2.5 year old!

misdee · 25/08/2011 08:15

i 'lug' around my almost 3yr old in a sling.

she walks quite well, isnt clingey and is v v confident.

but she is only little and not quite up to walking 5+ miles

misdee · 25/08/2011 08:17

and i also dont do front facing out here

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 25/08/2011 08:23

when I was doing my antenatal classes we had a session with a SALT. She was saying that parent facing was much better. She also told us to aim for 15 mins of one to one interaction with the baby in a day, 'but it's ok, it doesn't have to be in 1 block, 3 x5 mins is fine'

I guess if you are the sort of parent who never interacts with their baby then parent facing might be nice so they can see you once in a while?

Bonsoir · 25/08/2011 08:29

It's complete rubbish to say that outward facing pushchairs are "cruel". Babies and toddlers like to look at the world at large, and it is very good for them to have the stimulation of doing so. It is also good for them to get used to some familiar routes and journeys outside the home and to learn to point out landmarks.

PrincessScrumpy · 25/08/2011 08:30

This was so important to me with dd1, but now I'm looking at double buggies for my expected twins and the only few that face the parent are rubbish. Surely it's more about how long they're in them for and what you do with the babies when not in them!