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Wedding went viral

283 replies

Xenia · 29/06/2011 16:11

Agree with the step mother but she should not have written it. If you want a sil,y big wedding you are not someone to marry.
www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard/article-23965571-in-the-white-corner-the-bride-in-the-pink-the-mother-in-law-from-hell.do

In the white corner, the bride. In the pink, the mother-in-law from hell...
Laura Roberts
29 Jun 2011

The last thing any bride-to-be wants is to fall foul of her future mother-in-law - particularly when her damning criticism of your behaviour goes viral on the internet.

But that is what has happened to Heidi Withers, a PA working in the West End.

She received an email last month from Carolyn Bourne, the stepmother of her fiancé Freddie Bourne.

The 29-year-old forwarded the message to a select group of friends who were so surprised by its tone that they too forwarded it on to others...and then on to thousands.

Mrs Bourne, 60, who is married to Freddie's father Edward, wrote: "It is high time someone explained to you about good manners. Yours are obvious by their absence and I feel sorry for you."

She went on: "Unfortunately for Freddie, he has fallen in love with you and Freddie being Freddie, I gather it is not easy to reason with him or yet encourage him to consider how he might be able to help you. It may just be possible to get through to you though. I do hope so. Your behaviour on your visit to Devon during April was staggering in its uncouthness and lack of grace.

"Unfortunately, this was not the first example of bad manners I have experienced from you. If you want to be accepted by the wider Bourne family I suggest you take some guidance from experts with utmost haste."

She even described her future daughter-in-law as "an ideal candidate for the Ladette to Lady television series".

Mrs Bourne, who lives near Dawlish in Devon and is a renowned breeder of pinks and dianthus flowers, went on to list numerous examples of Miss Withers's "lack of manners" - as detailed below.

She concluded by saying: "I pity Freddie."

Her stepson, who runs online bike shop Capital Cycles and lives in Putney, declined to comment. His father Edward Bourne, 63, said: "We have nothing to say."

Miss Withers and Mr Bourne are not the first to suffer acute embarrassment because of out-of-control email round robins. A derogatory email exchange between Harry Fildes, 25, and Sebastian Marsh, 24, about the latter's ex-girlfriend "went viral" in March after Mr Fildes accidentally copied her in. Mr Marsh was later sacked by his company, Miller Insurance.

Holly Leam-Taylor, a graduate trainee at consultants Deloitte quit in December 2009 after sending an email discussing attractive male staff. The email, entitled Deloitte First year analysts Christmas Awards, asked her female colleagues to vote on which men in the office they considered most attractive.

The nine categories included "boy most likely to sleep his way to the top".

An excerpt from their email exchange...

from: Carolyn Bourne
to: heidi withers
subject: your lack of manners

Here are a few examples of your lack of manners:
When you are a guest in another's house, you do not declare what you will and will not eat - unless you are positively allergic to something.
You do not remark that you do not have enough food.

You do not start before everyone else.
You do not take additional helpings without being invited to by your host.

When a guest in another's house, you do not lie in bed until late morning in households that rise early - you fall in line with house norms.

You should never ever insult the family you are about to join at any time and most definitely not in public. I gather you passed this off as a joke but the reaction in the pub was one of shock, not laughter.

You regularly draw attention to yourself. Perhaps you should ask yourself why. No one gets married in a castle unless they own it. It is brash, celebrity style behaviour.

I understand your parents are unable to contribute very much towards the cost of your wedding. (There is nothing wrong with that except that convention is such that one might presume they would have saved over the years for their daughters' marriages.)

If this is the case, it would be most ladylike and gracious to lower your sights and have a modest wedding as befits both your incomes.

One could be accused of thinking that Heidi Withers must be patting herself on the back for having caught a most eligible young man. I pity Freddie.

OP posts:
SpringHeeledJack · 30/06/2011 14:32

oh ffs

no-one has heard the DIL's side! This is all from the MIL (and obviously biased) and conjecture!

at least the DIL has had the decency to keep quiet about it (though I bet she'd like to say a thing or two)

[can't believe is getting involved/annoyed to the extent that exclamation marks are being employed emoticon]

Blush
SpringHeeledJack · 30/06/2011 14:39

tell you what though, I love this bit:

'You should never ever insult the family you are about to join at any time and most definitely not in public. I gather you passed this off as a joke but the reaction in the pub was one of shock, not laughter.'

although I am in general adopting a lofty and po faced demeanour on this topic I would fucking love to know what was said down the pub

hope Heidi was really pissed

if she dumps Freddie, she can always marry my brother. I bet she'd be a hoot at Christmas

TheCrackFox · 30/06/2011 14:51

I would love to be a guest at this wedding.

One of my friend's MIL seemed to have a complete breakdown over her darling son marrying "beneath" him. She was called things from a "whore" to gold digger" (He was on pretty average wage and so was she) - luckily for MIL she was far too old to have put it all into an email. 15yrs on they are still married and the MIL is incredibly lucky that her DIL is of the forgiving nature.

culturemulcher · 30/06/2011 14:55

You know what's really going on, don't you?

Carolyn is Freddy's step-mother aka an in-comer to the family. She's obviously been feeling like an outsider (and clearly doesn't possess any many of the good manners she finds lacking in her Heidi).

She's now found the perfect opportunity to get 'in' with her husband's family by siding with them against the newest incomer - Heidi.

The whole thing smacks of her insecurity as well as her down right bad manners.

For all those who still think Heidi's in the wrong, how do you know that she didn't say "this is absolutely delicious, do you mind if I have some more?" as she helped herself to a second helping without asking first? How do you know she wasn't hiding in her bedroom because she couldn't face the dragon downstairs? How do you know that she didn't phone the dragon to thank her for the weekend, rather than sending a handwritten note?

If I'd had such a rude, insulting email from my MIL to be, I'd certainly have shared it with my best friends!

CrapolaDeVille · 30/06/2011 14:57

Step mother nasty snob
DIL possibly poor mannered

culturemulcher · 30/06/2011 14:58

stray 'her' there...

SpringHeeledJack · 30/06/2011 15:03

you'd think if Heidi was that ghastly MIL would be glad of her having a lie in, instead of coming down to breakfast with the rest of The Bournes- using the wrong knife for the butter, asking for "tea- three sugars" and smothering her eggs with that frightful HP sauce

...oh, and propping up the Sun with the toast rack

redandgreen · 30/06/2011 15:10

Would she have expected a thank you note from a future son-in-law? Hmmm.

Sounds like lots of the things in that email would be held up as brilliantly charming had a daughter brought home a fiance who behaved like that.

You can just imagine: 'We just love Jeremy, he was properly appreciating Annabel's cooking and even had seconds, he charmed everyone in the pub and it was so nice to let him have a proper rest from his busy London life. He
really will be a lively addition to the family.'

I think this is just straightforward sexism.

SpringHeeledJack · 30/06/2011 15:13

oh gosh yes! that's spot on

culturemulcher · 30/06/2011 15:24

redandgreen absolutely. Sexism and utter snobbishness from someone who's clearly insecure.

And what happened to the version of manners that says that you do your utmost to make a guest in your house feel welcome and comfortable?

Georgimama · 30/06/2011 15:35

From her own mouth the MIL sounds ghastly. God knows what she is actually like. It wasn't the DIL's fault the email went viral, it was the MIL's fault for sending it to her in the first place.

limitedperiodonly · 30/06/2011 15:37

red and spring I also agree. My own MIL has rules about manners and etiquette which are in reality bear traps for outsiders she considers to be lowly. She holds women to higher standards of behaviour than men. And people she considers our social superiors are always right.

I didn't realise for years but that's because I was badly brung up Grin

Ephiny · 30/06/2011 15:42

Agree with redandgreen - these 'handwritten notes' seem to be something that women have to write to other women, the MIL expected one to be addressed to her (not to 'us'), and one to be written to the SIL. As though the husbands don't exist Confused.

The whole thing is very odd. Who on earth talks about 'catching a husband' and 'eligible young men' any more? Really bizarre.

vanillacinamon · 30/06/2011 15:44

if I was heidi i would be mortified. Especially the bit about suggesting she should attend a finishing school. i would just be so mortified as I am sure my own manners at my (quite scary) mother in laws house have not been up to standard although I have always tried my very very best on that front.
I suspect when she forwarded it on to her friends she didnt imagine it would go viral but was just looking for some support from her peers. If i was in her shoes I would dread becoming a member of the "Bourne" family and would need to love "freddie" a lot to still go ahead with things (castle or otherwise)

AttilaTheMeerkat · 30/06/2011 15:45

re this earlier comment made:-

"Poor freddie. I bet he just wants a quiet life and no hassle".

So do all bystanders because they act out of self preservation and want of a quiet life. I would not let him off the hook entirely here; this has been brewing for some considerable time.

Re the content of the e-mail to my mind there is right and wrong on both sides. This will not be resolved easily if at all and will require a lot of tact and diplomacy.

I wonder if he has subsequently spoken to his stepmother and dad about this.

Longtalljosie · 30/06/2011 15:52

The thing is, if we a) strip out the MIL's interpretation on events, and look at the terrible skew on the things we really know, it's clear we can't trust the MIL's perspective at all...

  1. You should go to finishing school. Really? Who does that? Especially from a not-well-off family. Staggeringly rude.
  2. Nobody gets married in a castle unless they own it. Yes, they do
  3. It's rude to say there are foods you don't like. In my view, it's good manners to check if there are foods your guests don't like. And it's not like she's only staying over once, she's about to join their family? Is she really expected to eat food she can't stand at theirs for the rest of her life? My MIL asked if there was any food I didn't like the very first time I came to theirs, when all I was was now-DH's new girlfriend! Isn't that normal?
  4. It's rude to help yourself to more food without asking. She might want to consider her portion size.
  5. It's rude to sleep in. Oh yeah? And is Freddie up with the lark as well? Singular, for a single bloke in his 20s, if he is...
  6. The joke. All we know is there was one of a teasing nature, and everyone laughed. The MIL's interpretation that they laughed "out of shock" is just that - an interpretation.
  7. "I pity Freddie". Well, that says it all. Any helping yourself to seconds / more firsts pales in comparison with that really.

And who does she think she is anyway? Frankly, if she's ever seen "From Ladette to Lady", she's not that posh...

culturemulcher · 30/06/2011 15:53

Something tells me the couple might be decide to elope Grin

Can you imagine a wedding after the MIL to be has said those spiteful things about the bride's family? The dig about her family not having saved for their daughter's wedding was hardly veiled.

EldritchCleavage · 30/06/2011 15:55

I think I know a bit about law. It is unlawful. If you send an email for publication in a newspaper you give a licence for the intellectual property in it to be reporduced by the newpaper. Same if you post on mumsnet. If you send an email to one person you are not giving them permission to copy it to anyone else and nor are you allowing the confidential information in it etc to be sent to all and sundry but then what do you expect if your step son picks a girl like this?

This is not right, I'm afraid. Nor is your next e-mail re copyright and the DPA (they just don't apply to this situation).

A private e-mail can be confidential, but isn't necessarily. The information contained in it has to have the necessary quality of confidence about it. Trivial information is excluded. Nor is a private protected by the Article 8 privacy right unless it is something one would have a 'reasonable expectation of privacy' in. The case of McKennitt v Ash is a good example of these principles being applied. Not saying that you couldn't argue this particular e-mail was private and/or confidential, just that there is no blanket rule as you expressed it.

EldritchCleavage · 30/06/2011 15:56

Nor is a private protected by the Article 8 privacy right
Doh!

I meant 'Nor is a personal communication protected by the Article 8 privacy right...'

Xenia · 30/06/2011 15:59

That's true. You don't always need a signed agreement - Mr & Mrs Blair I think had one with their nanny who wanted to spill the beans but various footballers have been reasonably successful without contracts with the women concerned. In this case I certainly think you could make a case that a private email exchange is not to be distributed more widely. Also it shows the fiance in a bad light that she would forward it.

I did also say above it's never a good idea to voice thoughts like this though in writing. Better morally to keep those thoughts to yourself or have a quiet word with the step son.

OP posts:
Longtalljosie · 30/06/2011 16:00

Bloody hell - here's the email in full: www.citytalk.fm/Article.asp?id=2226294&spid=27776

Heidi is diabetic, so clearly would have to ask for more food if she needed it. The woman's deranged.

BeattieBow · 30/06/2011 16:01

haven't read the whole thread, but the crux of it is that the mil thinks that Freddie is marrying beneath him and that Heidi is common.

She is just a snob, bullying her potential dil. She obviously takes all of that seriously, when really, she should be going out of her way to make her dil feel welcome. She is the one with bad manners.

If it was my fiance, I would hope that he would stop talking to his stepmother if she treated me like that.

What an unpleasant woman.

Xenia · 30/06/2011 16:10

Thanks for the link. It sounds like she's one of these nightmare me me me finances always going on about themselves and their condition.

OP posts:
SpringHeeledJack · 30/06/2011 16:12

incidentally, I read somewhere on one of the links that Heidi is from Ledbury. I have been to Ledbury, and am firmly of the belief that no-one from Ledbury could possibly be common.

It is vair, vair posh.

But then I am from south east London Grin

SpringHeeledJack · 30/06/2011 16:16

oh ffs Xenia. She probably was forced to mention her condition. You would, if you were visiting someone's house and eating there

for someone who professes to be au fait with The Law, you don't arf rely on hearsay and conjecture

just sayin'