Teachers to strike - 30 June

[meditrina]

breaking now on SKY

Overwhelming vote by 2 teachers' unions (92%)

titchy - surely Trish has a valid point? Many people DO depend on their children being at school in order to "afford" to work. Indeed, IS stops when your youngest child becomes 5 on the assumption that school enables parents to work?

I think it is fir of those people who are self employed or lower earners to point out that striking will make their lives difficult, after all, many of them presumably would be delighted to have any kind of pension at all...

TrishCummings - you say the perks in the public sector are quite considerable - would you care to elaborate on these?

I think when people jump in and bash teachers because they have better pay and conditions than the average private sector worker (allegedly) they're missing a trick: they should put their energies in to campaigns aiming to raise the standards of private sector employment instead of demanding that the public sector lower theirs.

They were saying that the changes will mean they are on average around £90 a month worse off under the changes
And there are plenty of others who are even worse off than that!

Plus how have they worked it out? Is this notional £90 the average increase in pension contributions because I've not heard anything about pay cuts.

Feckwit: Separate thread here about when we might find out about school closures.

Thank you Meditrina!

Trish, when I was teaching, I too had to take time off unpaid when my children were ill. Have a think what my pay packet looked like when all three got chickenpox one after the other.

Oh and teachers at Eton etc are entitled to a state pension but then so is everyone else in the private sector. Not sure I understand the point there.

niceguy - so, because others are worse off, then they shouldn't fight against the changes that make them finincial worse off? They should roll over and put up with it?

No idea how it is worked out. I only overheard the conversation. I don't teach these days so it isn't particularly relevent to me.

Hula, I met another ex-teacher last night who like you and I has given it up and is now a TA too! She's never been happier! The weird thing was that her DH is also a lawyer like mine. Isn't your DH also a solicitor or did I imagine that? Completely irrelevant but I thought it was interesting.

Have ignored most of this (though reading avidly!) but have to chip in to say I totally disagree with nobrainer

A lot of teachers have the option of going part-time without losing their pay scale or benefits. Lucky them!

Anyone with a position of responsibility in teaching (certainly at secondary level, don't know about primary) has to go back full time. You can't be a part time head of department. Unlike ALL my other friends (public and private sector) who have kept their jobs and gone back very part time - often on full pay by supposedly squeezing 4or even 5 days work into 3 - which is a nonsense. I had two options - go back full time and see little of my children, or drop right back down to being a teacher of my subject and therefore lose all autonomy (and payscale!) AND then be at the mercy of my head of department who can direct me to work evenings and weekends. As a result I am not in teaching at the moment as it is not quite as parent friendly as you might think!

Spottyfrock - yes, that's right, DH is a solicitor. What a coincidence! And I agree with her - I love being a TA. All the good bits and far less of the other stuff that gets in the way of being able to work with the children.

Yes, I'm loving it too, best thing I ever did. Though I'm acutely aware that I'm fortunate enough to be in a financial position that makes it possible. Christmas is the best time! I love it!

Minicooper a friend who was a primary deputy head pre kids requested to return 3 days a week after her 1st child. The school agreed but insisted that she would have to go back to a normal teachers pay as they didn't want a part-time deputy. She took it to her union who fought the case, the school gave in and now she is on normal teacher duties but with deputy head pay! Very nice!
Another friend who is head of dept at secondary is able to return 3 days a week.
As mums they have no childcare concerns over the holidays as they are all off.
Don't get me wrong, I have absolutely no desire to become a teacher just because it fits in a bit better with having kids, however I do get fed up of hearing teachers whinging about things. I spent a morning once helping out at a friend's school and one coffee break in the staff room was enough to convince me I'd never want to go into teaching! Too many women together in a very insular setting, couldn't wait to escape.

Interesting, nobrainer - as I said, don't know much about primary, but very unusual at secondary - I don't like it, but do think its very hard to 'manage' a department (whether in teaching or any other profession) when you're not there. But I guess I'm old fashioned!

niceguy - so, because others are worse off, then they shouldn't fight against the changes that make them finincial worse off? They should roll over and put up with it?

Well from my point of view, the private sector is in the tank. It is the private sector which must pay taxes to support the public sector. Therefore its natural that pain felt in the private sector must eventually be felt in the public sector too.

So sure strike all you like. But the money isn't going to magically appear unless someone else (and take your pick here) takes the hit. So if we give teachers their pensions and protect them, do we take it off nurses? What about road sweepers? Our teachers are more deserving. Let's sting the bastards!

The money isn't there or more accurately won't be there.

Look at it this way. You promise your toddler a luxury holiday to Disney. Unforunately you've had to take a pay cut so won't be able to do that anymore. Your toddler now has a strop and throws his toys out of his pram and goes on "strike" since you promised.....

Does it change the fact you cannot afford it? Or should you take out a bank loan to keep your promise?

Niceguy - I love that analogy!

"Earning less and getting less than you expect for doing your job well is shitty but it's been a reality in this country for nearly 3 years." says isitreally

Only 3 years? You've been lucky!

How the government must rub their hands to see us fighting one another over public vs private sector. It's bread and bloody circuses with none of the fun.

If they wernt giving so much away to other countries in aid & bailing out the banks & other countries then maybe there would be enough in the kitty to sustain our own little country & public sector pensions. Totally think they & every other public sector worker should take whatever action necessary to make a stand & try & retain the initial pension terms of contract which they signed up to!

See, I think (mostly from reading people much cleverer than me who know about such things) there is enough in the kitty, right now, to pay back the deficit without taking the steps that the government are taking.

Without sounding too much like a conspiracy theorist, I think it suits the government right down to the ground for us all to think the UK is about to go bankrupt. It allows them to implement measures like this without the whole united public rioting in the streets because we're too busy squabbling with each other about who has it harder.

It's one of the most depressing things I've ever seen, to see people actually say, out loud, that they want other people to lose their work benefits because they don't get them. Why not support them, and then fight for your own company or sector to adopt them as well?

These are teachers we're talking about. We all went to school - all our children will go to school. Education makes us what we are, and school is where we learn to rub along with people from all walks of life. Every single one of us, I bet, can remember inspiring moments from our schooldays as clear as day. It's disgraceful that the government runs them down, and disgraceful to see people going along with it.

Tory MP Phillip Davies suggested today that disabled people work for less than minimum wage.
The attacks on everyone continue.

What a TOTALLY stupid thing to say bobbysmum07!!!!!
The pension scheme should be abolished? So people who has been working hard for years and have been paying into a scheme that may now not do as it promised, should just have it all gotten rid off and live totally of a tiny state pension????!!!!!!!
ARE YOU LIVING IN THE REAL WORLD?!

Exactly, Riveninside. First teachers, now it's disabled people. Next week it'll be single parents, and then perhaps after that it'll be young people. It's already been families, and those who need Housing Benefit, and university lecturers.

We can't all be greedy, over-entitled scroungers!