Should UK adopt a more US approach to benefits?

[Niceguy2]

BBC Article

Has the time come to compel people to work for their benefits? Should single parents also be forced to work or should they be exempt?

I think most people realise we cannot continue to support the current system but what system should replace it?

I'm within a short commute of London, house prices are high, rents( 3 bed £950 pcm plus or £210,000 for an estate ex council hs!) are high, cost of living is crippling, child care for one child can cost in excess of £180 per week full time and there are no jobs in the local press.

A few months ago, you would see job ads, usually for care assistants, cleaners, admin assistants, drivers etc, paying no more than the minimum wage.

Niceguy, that's not a biased interpretation, that is the wording!

At the moment conservative MPs have put forward a bill to ammend the national minimum wage that will mean that employers can pay anything they like.

Ever lived in the US, Niceguy? As a normal person with an ordinary job?

Because it's a place where it's entirely possible to find yourself in tens of thousands of dollars, or more, even with insurance, for such common occurences as a car accident, a heart attack, cancer or a premature baby.

It's possible to lose your home over the same type of occurences.

Do you really want to live in a place with no safety net?

Because there are a lot of good reasons why I no longer do and it's invariably peole who've never lived there long-term who think the US is a good role model to follow in terms of healthcare and welfare.

"At the moment conservative MPs have put forward a bill to ammend the national minimum wage that will mean that employers can pay anything they like."

that's terrifying. More and more would be reliant on the state. SUrely it's basic common sense that a job needs to provide a living wage?

We should stop paying for any more children benefits claimants have whilst claiming benefits - will soon realise that the pot is not bottomless and may be hard for some but I am sure people would be a little more careful about contraception if they realise their standard of living is going to drop significantly.

thats ALL benefits madame? including disability ones?

what do you mean by benefits?
Are you counting things like child tax credits, disability benefits?

MadameCastafiore,

Do you mean people on benefits should stop having more children? Cutting benefits is very unlikely to effect their quality of life, the only difference it will make is whether those kids eat off plates or out of bins.

Because if you are refering to a feckless generation that have never worked and see having kids and benefits as a career option, they often spend significantly more on alcohol and phone credit than they do food.

I would prefer to pay more tax if it meant a fairer society, no I don't want my tax to subsidise their social lives but I don't want a return to people begging from the church enough food to feed their kids either.

In the states they are issued with food coupons, I think that is just about the only thing we could learn from the states.

I think the simple answer to the OP is no

a country that leaves the bottom 20% of its citizenry living in third world conditions is not one the UK has anything to learn from.

food coupons are not workable.....how would you use them for an online shop,or a shop of your choice....shops would have to do the admin,so incur costs,so maybe boycott them(like some do with the milk tokens)

people could sell them on....ebay them etc

how about use on market stalls? what about non food items??

nope.

We should adopt the Nordic model

here

I think there must be a simple way of issuing credit type cards that can be topped up electronically.

The credit could only be spend on food, childrens clothes etc, of course people would also need cash for other exp, wouldn't suggest otherwise.

spend! spent, note, check before posting.

It's a swipe card that works like a debit card most states use, iLove.

It's against the law to sell it or for stores to allow people to use it for booze/fags, etc.

It happens, but it's quite punishable there.

I have been talking about this with friends and suggested a credit/swipe card, I wonder why it can't be adopted here.

Madame - I really resent that comment. I am not on benefits through choice - it certainly was not my choice to have 4 children alone, one of those who i had from birth alone. It wasn't me being too stupid to use contraception, or me thinking that other people will happily pay for my babies. I am actually ashamed of being on benefits, and comments like your own that tar everybody with the same brush are very unhelpful. I am aware that the system is abused and expensive - but I am thankful for it.

these swipe cards dont sound cheap to administrate!!

Cheaper over the long-term.

The attitude is that if you have your housing, food and such basic needs provided by benefits paid directly to the supplier, then you don't need cash. If you want cash, then you have to work for it.

Not saying it's the correct approach, just trying to explain a lot of peoples' attitudes towards welfare there.

The USA is not a nice place if you are poor .

I think the swipe care idea is a good one, in the long term it should save money.

If long term unemployed people have no means to buy alcohol or smoke dope surely this would be better. They are less likely to need other services and interventions.

I'm not suggesting all people on benefits use other services or don't feed their children.

No place is very nice if you're poor, unfortunately, Ripe .

No. Absolutely not.

And I'm a higher rate tax payer receiving (from April anyway) no benefits.

There are levels of poverty and deprivation in the US which we seldom see in this country. I don't want that here.

'There are levels of poverty and deprivation in the US which we seldom see in this country. I don't want that here.'

Oh, yes, you do see them here, too. You just need to know where to go.

expat I'm currently working in a very deprived area and I've still not seen anything like I'd seen in the US. Maybe I need to open my eyes and look a bit harder.