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What questions do you have about stuff from History, or am I the only one?

975 replies

EverySongbirdSays · 20/11/2016 00:46

Hi all, HQ here. We're moving this thread over to History Club now where Songbird will be starting a Part 2 thread for more History quizzical shenanigans

The main history thing I've been pondering for the last couple of days since the weather shifted is the history of clothes.

So... how did Early Man manage in the winter, how did they make clothes out of animal skin?

After that, I understand that clothes production as we know it today began with the industrial revolution.

But how did people manage for clothes you know before we had cotton or machinery

How/when did we realise you could knit wool to make a jumper?

I'm sorry if it's a bit of a stupid question Blush

Has anyone got any stupid questions I might know the answer to ?

OP posts:
cozietoesie · 21/11/2016 22:35

But you wouldn't be able to take cows out to the fields with you, would you? Smile They would stay fairly close to the homeplace.

XmasSteamTrainsRealAleOpenFire · 21/11/2016 22:37

I want to know how women got by without glasses or contact lenses back in the day! I could not survive without either!

Eye wear through the ages

Not sure undies have been mentioned?

Medieval bras discovered at Austrian castle & Medieval underwear

cozietoesie · 21/11/2016 22:38

And, I'm afraid, age-related eyesight issues wouldn't have been such an issue. They'd still be around but only for those people who made it through.

cwtchesandprosecco · 21/11/2016 22:38

I love this thread... been working my way through it all day.

Ok, my question, why the hell did Elizabeth I not marry and at least try to have children? It just seems so utterly bizzare given that the whole point of a monarchy is to keep the bloodline going. I get that it was risky but it just seems so counterintuitive. I know there's that theory that she was an hermaphrodite but I don't really buy that one....

steppemum · 21/11/2016 22:40

the milk from a cow isn't available all year round in pre modern farming times. The milk is made for the calf, and tapers off as the calf grows up. It is modern intensive farming that persuades the cow to keep going.
Cows don't naturally produce milk mid winter.

The innuit people make shoes out of fur. They sew boots directly from the hide of furry animals with the fur on the inside. I think it is seal skin which is the best one, one seal boot is warm enough to wear with bare feet inside in artic winter.

I think we don't realise how badly we dress now, as a child I was expected to wear vest, long sleeved shirt, warm (woolly, knitted) jumper. Thick trousers (no leggings) long socks and slipper or lace up shoes. When my kids sya they are cold, and I say put on a jumper and socks and slippers, they roll their eyes. Also people didn't sit around on computer or watchign TV, they were active.

Russia - I lived for a number of years in Central Asia, not long after the fall of communism. I learnt a lot about life under communism form my frineds there. They have queueing down to a refined art. You could queue in several queues at once, everyone remembers who is behind you in the queue and holds your place. the shops were empty, and there was very little to buy. Nothing was imported from the west, and Soviet versions were often poor quality. There was no advertising or colourful packaging, as that was all Capitalist. So bread trucks were plain grey with the words Bread stencilled on the side.
Daily life was hard and dull. All consumer items eg fridges were earned on merit and most people didn't have them, flats were small, cramped and basic. You queued for everything, sometimes for hours at a time, everyone worked, 6 days per week, all kids had to be in nursery full time from age 2. Even if there were goods in the shops, you didn't have the money to buy it.
Food was hard to get. In the summer when veg was available you bought whatever you could and bottled and dried it for the winter. I had to do that for the first few years we lived there. Many people had allotments 'dachas' where they grew food in the summer, to last through the winter.

Yes, people did have access to comprehensive health care, available to all, good vaccination programmes etc., but as you could buy your docotrs degree, or be awarded it as the son/daughter of an official, the standard of care was poor. The children's hospital in the expensive new capital city I lived in was shocking. Truly abysmal. Yet the same country runs the International Space Station. The maternity hospital that most women use is horrific, I knew 3 families whose babies died or were paralysed due to bad deliveries, eg mis use of forceps. At the same time, there is a state of the art new Mother and Baby hospital in the city, but it is restricted access.

In Soviet times, you were very, very careful who you trusted, of course daily life went on, falling in love, having kids etc, but the stress levels were very high, and it was always possibe that someone, even your own kids, might tell the authorities that you had done something wrong, and you could be shipped off to Siberia.

treaclesoda · 21/11/2016 22:40

I think if Elizabeth had married she would have been expected to hand over power, or at least share it, with her husband. To remain outright monarch in her own lifetime she had to remain unmarried.

NotDavidTennant · 21/11/2016 22:41

Anyway, alongside one of these cases is a description of a man who had been having sex with a local cow. The entire population was appalled and put to death, not just him - but also the poor cow!

Coming a bit late to this one, but those people were merely being good God-fearing Christians.

"And if a man lie with a beast, he shall surely be put to death: and ye shall slay the beast." Leviticus, 20:15

HuckleberryGin · 21/11/2016 22:42

Part of it was to do with having to give power to any husband. A weird dynamic of female monarchs is that as a wife they must submit, but as a monarchy they over rule. And she couldn't be with the man she really loved.

steppemum · 21/11/2016 22:45

Blush didn't realise that was so long!

cozietoesie · 21/11/2016 22:46

Not at all, steppe. It was fascinating. Smile

Solasum · 21/11/2016 22:52

As I understand, Oysters were effectively the meat of the poor in Tudor London. There were oyster beds in the (much cleaner then) Thames. If you go down to the foreshore at Greenwich, it is still strewn with oyster shells.

Re life in Russia in the 20th C, in terms of scientific and technological investment it was pretty amazing. Promising minds from all over the area were trained to a very high level. On the ground it probably resembled intellectual slavery, but even now many of the countries that were part of the USSR still have nowhere near comparable facilities, e.g. Universities to what they had at the height of communism. Life has not been easy for normal Russians in the recent past, there seems to me to be a good deal of nostalgia for communism amongst the older generation especially. I suppose because of the hope that The People are stronger than the individual - it is better to feel that maybe someone will help you than no one cares.

treaclesoda · 21/11/2016 22:56

steppemum that was great, thanks, those were exactly the sort of things I had been wondering about. So all in all it sounds like life was dismal and hard for the majority of people. Sad

Solasum · 21/11/2016 22:57

On a separate note, the early days of Nazi Germany were also remarkable from a technological perspective. The modern concept of the motorway - made with slabs of concrete- was invented then, and a lot of money was ploughed into infrastructure, I suppose laying the foundations for Germany's strength in this even now.

They also, remarkably, had the concept of video phones, which appear in some of the propaganda photo-illustrated books of the time.

EverySongbirdSays · 21/11/2016 22:58

Because of patriarchy (Elizabeth) - had she married, her spouse not her would have had the power. She couldn't really trust that they wanted her and not the title/power
It is believed she loved Robert Knoylls who ended up marrying the aforementioned Lettice. She couldn't have him but I can't remember why.

Have I mixed this up? he was married (pre Lettice) and his wifes death ended up looking a bit dodgy

OP posts:
TheHiphopopotamus · 21/11/2016 23:00

steppe that was a brilliant post, really interesting. I must admit I have a morbid fascination with Chernobyl and the pictures of Pripyat, not only because it's an abandoned city, but because of the all the Soviet stuff that was left behind. The 'before' pics are just as interesting as the 'after'.

TheHiphopopotamus · 21/11/2016 23:02

songbird it's Robert Dudley, Earl of Leicester. He was married to Amy someone or other, who died in suspicious circumstances, that made it look like Dudley was bumping her off to make way for Elizabeth, so obviously they couldn't marry after that.

Sometime later, he married Lettice Knollys, in secret and Elizabeth banished her from the court in fury, never to return.

cozietoesie · 21/11/2016 23:04

Amy Robsart. Smile

TheHiphopopotamus · 21/11/2016 23:06

That's it Grin poor old Amy Robsart. Although modern thinking these days, is that she died of breast cancer. Not sure how that's connected with her falling down the stairs though.

EverySongbirdSays · 21/11/2016 23:08

So I was right! Just got the surname mixed.

RE The Gulags. I think this is were promoting reading to kids comes in. I learned so much from just reading fictions that were set at different times. Like the user name steppemum reminded me of the Endless Steppe a teen book I read which was about camps in Siberia - learning stuff isn't only what you lean in the classroom. The value of encouraging your kids to learn stuff through reading in their own time, can't be over estimated.

OP posts:
EverySongbirdSays · 21/11/2016 23:20

Endless Steppe

OP posts:
steppemum · 21/11/2016 23:21

as solasum says, many older people were nostalgic for communist times. I think this is for several reasons

  • everyone had a job. 100% employment. Now it is hard to get jobs and you have to actually do the job, not just show up and hang around as some shop assistants used to do!
-the state provided a lot of stuff. Even if poor quality, it provided housing, education, employment, health care. You didn't have to worry about anything, the state covered it. -there was something to believe in, a vision, a focus, a common goal. once communism went, it left a vacuum.
  • since fall of communism, prices have shot up and many things eg housing etc is now too expensive for many people.
EBearhug · 21/11/2016 23:21

I agree about reading - we had the Endless Steppe as a set book when I was about 12, though the main thing I remember from it is that they bleached their hair with hydrogen peroxide. Smile

EBearhug · 21/11/2016 23:25

(Which is possibly in another book about someone hiding from the Nazis, now I think about it.)

icyfront · 21/11/2016 23:26

The history of exploration is fascinating. Way back when explorers were new to sailing across the Atlantic, the Pope issued the Treaty of Tordesillas, which drew an arbitrary vertical line down the Atlantic Ocean which gave occupation rights to Spain on one side and Portugal on the other. Which is why Spanish is spoken in most of South America except for Brazil where its Portuguese. (Though that’s complicated by subsequent empire building, hence Guyana driving on the left.)

Also the history of Eastern Europe, which is much larger than I had imagined. That’s also complicated by frequent boundary changes and changes of power, especially Poland which sometimes seemed to almost disappear. Apparently, one saying that’s popular with some historians is “Russia without Ukraine is a country; Russia with Ukraine is an empire.” Which seems to be something that goes back centuries, yet might still have something to say in current times.

One possible idea I picked up from reading about non-Western-Civilisation history is that China protected itself against future Mongol invasions (after the Mongols took China and then retreated) by building a great wall; whereas Russia protected itself by taking over nearby countries as a buffer zone.

cozietoesie · 21/11/2016 23:26

Well people did. Smile